Do you recognise these student rioters?

Glaucus · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:36

its a hell of a different to a riot and as your link shows they have been arrested and even banned from oxford, hardly call that above the law.

mushroomsoup · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:36

No, when the charges are dropped -as they often are- the law doesn't apply I'm afraid old chap

Glaucus · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:39

if no law why was there a 15mile ban

Ahleckz · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:40

One of the main organizers and fans of stupid (I was meaning to type student, but stupid came out instead) politics from my university just put this on Facebook.
"Has been screwed over by national rail and it looks like I can't get to scotland tonight, WHAT ON EARTH!!??!!"
Poetic justice, me thinks.

rypt · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:43

Von Smallhausen said:
The current system is uaffordable.

Only due to the soft degrees, sort out the system correctly rather than just a bandaid and hope the problem goes away

Von Smallhausen · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:43

He could always smash a window on the train to get in.

dowie · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:44

scorza said:
Great, so if you're rich the law doesn't apply. You can pay your way out of any bind. I thought we lived in a first world democracy under the rule of law and not a third-world, feudal society.

If the person who's property was smashed is happy in the end then what does it matter. A restaurant owner has every right to press charges but it seems they're often willing to accept a decent payment instead.

I'm sure that a number of them have been charged etc.. over the years too and not everyone has been happy with the result of damage caused.

Von Smallhausen · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:47

rypt said:
Only due to the soft degrees, sort out the system correctly rather than just a bandaid and hope the problem goes away

Is that not the real barrier though rypt ?

The chances of less people going to university through goverment intervention and clamping down on BAs in Transformers and Harry Potter seem low at best.

dowie · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:49

rypt said:
Only due to the soft degrees, sort out the system correctly rather than just a bandaid and hope the problem goes away

High fees will probably have that effect to an extent in that less people will bother applying for rubbish courses at rubbish universities and as a result some of them will be axed.

It would be better if the Govt could simply close a bunch of universities at the bottom of the table and reduce places significantly then perhaps go back to having no fees at all. I don't think that it is as feasible to do that however.

In the end if you end up doing something like Law at an Oxbridge college then fees could be 20k per year and it would still be a complete no brainer to attend regardless of your social background.

rypt · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:49

Von Smallhausen said:
Is that not the real barrier though rypt ?

The chances of less people going to university through goverment intervention and clamping down on BAs in Transformers and Harry Potter seem low at best.

What is not a real barrier, and barrier to what?

dowie said:
High fees will probably have that effect to an extent in that less people will bother applying for rubbish courses at rubbish universities and as a result some of them will be axed.

It would be better if the Govt could simply close a bunch of universities at the bottom of the table and reduce places significantly then perhaps go back to having no fees at all. I don't think that it is as feasible to do that however.

In the end if you end up doing something like Law at an Oxbridge college then fees could be 20k per year and it would still be a complete no brainer to attend regardless of your social background.

High fees benefit the government though due to them having a lower investment in education for future returns of increased tax revenue, which is why I'm opposed to it.
I feel that 2:1 and above at a good Uni in STEM subjects (and law, medicine, etc) should be fully funded by the gov.

Glaucus · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:51

dowie said:
It would be better if the Govt could simply close a bunch of universities at the bottom of the table and reduce places significantly then perhaps go back to having no fees at all. I don't think that it is as feasible to do that however.

I would go for something in-between, If you want to go to uni take a loan out for full amount.

However if you do a degree from a good uni, in a degree the government decides the country needs and you pass with good results. Your debt is cancelled.

That way people who really need to do a degree will not be indebted but still allows anyone to go to uni.

rypt · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:52

AcidHell2 said:
I would go for something in-between, If you want to go to uni take a loan out for full amount.

However if you do a degree from a good uni, in a degree the government decides the country needs and you pass with good results. Your debt is cancelled.

That way people who really need to do a degree will not be indebted but still allows anyone to go to uni.

Exactly, alas that will never happen

scorza · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:52

dowie said:
If the person who's property was smashed is happy in the end then what does it matter. A restaurant owner has every right to press charges but it seems they're often willing to accept a decent payment instead.

I'm sure that a number of them have been charged etc.. over the years too and not everyone has been happy with the result of damage caused.

Using that logic we should re-introduce "blood money" payments so the rich don't have to go to prison for assault, rape, murder charges. If the victim's family are happy to receive a couple of million, what's the problem?

Glaucus · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:54

scorza said:
Using that logic we should re-introduce "blood money" payments so the rich don't have to go to prison for assault, rape, murder charges. If the victim's family are happy to receive a couple of million, what's the problem?

Those things can't be replaced.
damage is only a criminal matter if the owner presses charges.

Those other crimes can be followed up with no such claims.

Von Smallhausen · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:58

rypt said:
What is not a real barrier, and barrier to what?

Why haven't the government said we will keep fees as they are but we are capping how many go and also cutting down on pointless courses ?

rypt · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:59

Von Smallhausen said:
Why haven't the government said we will keep fees as they are but we are capping how many go and also cutting down on pointless courses ?

Because due to the lefties it would be political suicide, this is less of one.

Glaucus · 11 Nov 2010 at 21:59

Von Smallhausen said:
Why haven't the government said we will keep fees as they are but we are capping how many go and also cutting down on pointless courses ?

That would be just as un-popular.

Uther · 11 Nov 2010 at 22:00

I await the next riots with something approaching glee.This place will be a fun factory!
We can have more responses on:
Student scum
Miner scum
poll tax protester scum
And appearing at a riot near you soon:
firemen scum
nurse scum
council worker scum
OAP scum

craig3000 · 11 Nov 2010 at 22:01

If they want to do a peaceful protest fine, make it huge, fine but trashing the building and/or anything else including the public's parked cars, doesn't help anything. I hate the way they take it out on the police as if it's their fault as well, pathetic scum.

Uther said:
I await the next riots with something approaching glee.This place will be a fun factory!
We can have more responses on:
Student scum
Miner scum
poll tax protester scum
And appearing at a riot near you soon:
firemen scum
nurse scum
council worker scum
OAP scum

Are you trying to say it's ok for them to just trash everything? Or am I missing something?

Von Smallhausen · 11 Nov 2010 at 22:08

AcidHell2 said:
That would be just as un-popular.

It is difficult to strike a balance given the options.

Craig3000 said:
I hate the way they take it out on the police as if it's their fault as well, pathetic scum.

I think the cops are absolved of any blame for this one.

They are damned for doing nothing and would have been damned for wading in with sticks.