My EVO X selected as an R&D car by Forge Motorsport

Forge have nothing but a good rep in the 'Fiat' scene for there uprated FMIC's.

If I was you I would be over the moon at this, plus looking to get it mapped after.
 
topshot said:
Fitting a different intercooler with no remap? How will they know if its improved anything without a remap? Do they expect the standard map to adjust to suit the intercooler? If so its a disaster waiting to happen.
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Hardly, its forge motorsport.

They're a big company with a good reputation among many marques. I don't think he's got anything to worry about.

All the FMIC does is provide cooler air, you can maybe remap it to get some more power out of it and take advantage of the cooler air. But it will be fine to run without a map to suit.

As Gibbo says, what happens when you run your car in the winter and the air intake temp drops by 10 degrees ? its no different.
 
MrLOL said:
Hardly, its forge motorsport.

They're a big company with a good reputation among many marques. I don't think he's got anything to worry about.

All the FMIC does is provide cooler air, you can maybe remap it to get some more power out of it and take advantage of the cooler air. But it will be fine to run without a map to suit.

As Gibbo says, what happens when you run your car in the winter and the air intake temp drops by 10 degrees ? its no different.
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IAT (inlet air temp) corrections are already built into any engine ECU calibration.
 
just drive it get it mapped by them to its proper potential if you dont like remove all the parts and sell on MLR then refit your stock parts and reset the ECU or get it unmapped:-)
 
topshot said:
Still needs mapping, changing the air intake and intercooler(probably going to be bigger/flow more than standard) will still affect the engine regardless of temps.
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Changing the intercooler won't do anything to the engine (except maybe introduce a little lag), the problem is most people put a big intercooler on so they can up the boost, the fuelling can't keep up and it goes bang.
 
HI there

Decisions decisions, I've got four plans.

Plan 1.
Let Forge fit their bits and bobs, take it to EVO tuner get walbro pump fitted and get it road mapped for best drivability. Will probably give an extra peak 10BHP from as it is now but upto an additional 40-50lb/ft with even earlier spool times as the tuner was explaining when they map the X they adjust the mivec, ignition timing, boost, fuelling etc. to get the best combination and can tune to car for exactly whats wanted, can even tune in loads of pops and bangs on the overrun if that is whats really wanted. Ideally I'd want the car to stay around 400BHP so keep the boost 26psi at peak tapering down to around 23psi. Thats probably about 1-2psi more than current at most, so marginal increase. Work on earlier turbo spool and stop the thing from running so rich and most of all keep it safe with an AFR in the 11-11.5 region at WOT right upto 7700rpm, stock its around 9 AFR so very rich. This in theory will give me a car that can do the 1/4 mile in circa 12.2s with terminal of circa 112mph. :) With end result of circa 410BHP with 410-420lb/ft at 3000rpm. Its currently 397BHP with 365lb/ft at 3500rpm.

Total cost of this too me is £600!


2. Option 2, as above but purchase some 800cc injectors and fit, can do myself, cost circa £500. Purchase an FP RED Turbo about £1000 landed if I import myself, get it fitted and map for circa 460-480BHP with around 400lb/ft of torque. Cost about 2k, but this could put the engine on limited time. The Americans say this is perfectly safe, the UK guys think its a time bomb waiting to happen. I kind of agree with both coming to the conclusion what probably kills the engines is boost pressure, over 30psi and high torque numbers. As long as boost is kept low and torque sub 400lb/ft when pushing high power all should be fine, but then you loose drivability. Getting the engine forged is an option, I believe the cost is circa 2k and future proofs the engine towards 850BHP. This would mean one could then map the FP RED Turbo to approx 500-550BHP and well over 450lb/ft. Obviously this power level needs a new clutch, thats gonna be 1K fitted for something decent.
So spend 2k and how big power, low torque and a possible big bill, or spend 5k, get serious power, serious torque and reliability.

Cost 2k-5k, added resale value to car, probably 1-2k max, so instant 3k lost!


3. Options 3, get my bits fitted from Forge, take the bits straight off that I want, so FMIC, short shifter and intake, hoses, Milltek exhaust etc. Sell the car stock or trade it in against a newer 2009/2010 White FQ-360 GSR or a White FQ-330 SST GSR with sub 20k miles. Then re-fit all Forge parts, get engine forged, bigger turbo etc. etc.
Cost, circa 26-28k for car plus 5k in modifications. Total 30k ISH minus the trade-in from my car or private sale. As a trade-in I've been offered 20k by Mitsubishi which actually seems quite fair, I paid 23k a year ago, added 14,000 miles.


4. Continue looking at alternative cars, test drives etc. until something really lights my fire and I just have to buy. I am yet to drive Porsches but feel Housey is right that an C4S or C2S won't have the explosive power/delivery I crave, but a 996 Turbo could fit the bill perfectly, just a shame they are getting on now and could be money pits. Or the other option which has all the power I need, awsome SMG/DSG style transmission and huge tuning potential should I wish get myself an R35 GTR.
Porsche cost circa 35k which I could buy outright now, thank you RRL shares. :D
Or get a GTR for 45k ish and finance the remainder 10k which would be sub £300 a month so nothing. Only off putting with the GTR for me is its big and its not quite as precise as the EVO due to its weight but its hugely capable.
Or I could go crazy and get 997 Turbo but for some reason I have a car limit of 50k, even though I can afford more, I don't want over 50k of money in a car, maybe daft keeping car finance to sub £300 per month is a very nice option. :)
 
option 1 then bide your time till the 997 Turbo comes down in price.

New 911 is due soon isn't it ?

[TW]Fox;18465727 said:
I love it when he does this :D
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yeah because being perfect and all you don't make mistakes do you. :rolleyes:
 
So you've gone from not a penny over 40K to 50K....hmmmm

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2341945.htm

Just go drive one. Forget mine, too harsh for most, the 7 GT3 is leagues better (in terms of composure not performance or event) as a road car. Just drive one and the Evo will be gone from your mind in seconds. 8200rpm, 415bhp or proper Pork power and steering, brakes, feel and event like few and a lot cheaper to run than a GT-R. Still the best value sports car in the world in my book, nothing close when you forget statistics.
 
I wouldn't touch a red without going forged.

People have been bending rods at 400 on the X.

Not sure what the process is as it's an ally block with liners opposed to the cast iron block in the 4G - not sure if you'll have to get it sleeved.

It's just not worth the risk. I'm not pushing more than 1.5 Bar on stock rods and thats with an established engine.
 
Housey said:
So you've gone from not a penny over 40K to 50K....hmmmm

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2341945.htm

Just go drive one. Forget mine, too harsh for most, the 7 GT3 is leagues better (in terms of composure not performance or event) as a road car. Just drive one and the Evo will be gone from your mind in seconds. 8200rpm, 415bhp or proper Pork power and steering, brakes, feel and event like few and a lot cheaper to run than a GT-R. Still the best value sports car in the world in my book, nothing close when you forget statistics.
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Or alternatively

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2416601.htm

Won't be long before these are nearer 50k when the new 911 Turbo / GT3 is out next year ish (at a guess ?)
 
MrLOL said:
option 1 then bide your time till the 997 Turbo comes down in price.

New 911 is due soon isn't it ?
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Not got a clue m8, I've seena rumoured 998 Turbo I think, looks gorgeous.

Its a shame 997 Turbo PDK aint a bit older, but those are well out of my price range if I keep finance sub £300 a month.

I still keep finding myself looking at Yank Muscle too, Z06 and new shape Stang. Again big though and I've done the Yank Muscle though a Z06 is still hugely tempting.

Something else that I really like and it might be bit grandad and slippers is the new 5.0l Jaguar XKR, plenty of power, gorgeous looks, epic sound, but could I live with the AUTO box, they are now just slipping under 50k but I don't really want to go past my upper limit of 45k.

Porsche I love the looks and its small enough to take on any road without worry a 996 Turbo looks awsome and can be tuned hugely or I could just try finding a Porsche 997 C2S/C4S with the powerkit and Aerokit, extremely rare but more or less zero depreciation as so rare. But nearly 400BHP stock in a 1390kg NA Porsche. :)

Or just get the GTR and either stop going down really narrow roads or just potter down them, just idiots in vans who seem to just not slow down until they actually hit you.
 
Housey said:
So you've gone from not a penny over 40K to 50K....hmmmm

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2341945.htm

Just go drive one. Forget mine, too harsh for most, the 7 GT3 is leagues better (in terms of composure not performance or event) as a road car. Just drive one and the Evo will be gone from your mind in seconds. 8200rpm, 415bhp or proper Pork power and steering, brakes, feel and event like few and a lot cheaper to run than a GT-R. Still the best value sports car in the world in my book, nothing close when you forget statistics.
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Yes mate, am 10k better off, had a share come lucky so banked it. :)
 
This happened to me once with Regal Autosport and an Astra SRi. Throttle bodies dbilas kit, fast road cams, standalone fuel maps, delimited, heat wrapped exhaust, etc

Car was never the same again but it was fun while it lasted :)
 
Gaijin said:
I wouldn't touch a red without going forged.

People have been bending rods at 400 on the X.

Not sure what the process is as it's an ally block with liners opposed to the cast iron block in the 4G - not sure if you'll have to get it sleeved.

It's just not worth the risk. I'm not pushing more than 1.5 Bar on stock rods and thats with an established engine.
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Yeah from reading around the US side where they seem to have a much larger tuning scene for the X the Yanks believe the killer is people pushing PSI too high on stock turbo which throws a rod or aiming for too much torque too low down. Also the ones that have bent at 400BHP, well those cars in particular had different intakes and turbo elbows on FQ-300/FQ-330's and were not mapped even when AFR and DET had been heard, they paid the price. :(
The guys who seem to map for when above 400BHP and keep the torque within question seem fine, the US guys are running 500+ on stock blocks, so they must be doing something right though sometimes you do have to question their figures as well. Still there is a couple of UK guys running FP reds above 460BHP on stock internals for last 10,000 miles OK. So its either luck of the draw or is down to the tuner, I am thinking its tuner and making sure AFR is good and ensuring there is zero DET. Still be on bought time I think and trying to sell such a car on could be hard, just might as well forge engine to begin with as far cheaper than once its thrown a rod.

MG Autos can FORGE the engine for £2200 which can take upto 850BHP, I'd not need that power as at that power they are just 1/4 mile cars and un-drivable.
 
MrLOL said:
the mod is very popular on astra VXRs, which normally just route the oil back to the inlet manifold. People have been known to take the pipe leading to the manifold off to find it coverd in oil. Doubt it does it any harm, but it makes it very messy in there !
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Not short term, but over time the oil can gunk up the throttle body and stop it from working properly.
 
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