March in London on the 26th?
- Thread starter Tummy
- Start date
Yes the evil current government is the reason for all of this. How dare they try to fix the damage done by the previous government.
The fact is, the unreasonable Unions were always going to go crazy over public sector job losses. The only people to blame are Labour, they were the ones who grossly increased the size of the public sector with thousands of unnecessary and overpaid positions. Labour always do this, they 'buy' voters with such heavy public sector investment.
Would the Unions honestly rather see the country bankrupt as long as their workers were protected, even though a great deal of them aren't necessary?
Not a single one of them has mentioned any viable alternative to what the government is doing right now. In reality the only other viable alternative is more cuts in spending, but I'm sure that's not what they are after.
I expect their alternative reads something like: "we must keep all our jobs, so lets tax the bankers even more because it's their fault, we should also go after all those super rich tax avoiders and the big corporations!".
Say we did that, what would happen when all those bankers leave the country and start paying tax elsewhere, where things are more reasonable and there isn't so much of a witch hunt after them? We'll have substantially less tax receipts and therefore be in a worse position. The same can be said for the tax avoiders, what's to stop those companies relocating somewhere cheaper? It's not like they can't sell their products here anyway...
I really don't understand what these protesters think can be achieved. The country is in massive debt, we spend way more than we have every year. All the government has done so far is reduced our overspend a little bit, we're still overspending by a great deal, just not quite as much as under Labour. We're still nowhere near where we really ought to be.
Meh as I've said before I don't want to get in to an argument about this with what seems a very right wing forum 
I'll leave you all to it, but I enjoyed the march and the turn out was just incredible, easily half a million people probably more. It's such a shame the minority ruined it for the majority.
I'll try and stick up some photo's I took (nothing special, just took them on my iPhone 4) but I feel pretty horrific after my fight with a train door still.
I'll leave you all to it, but I enjoyed the march and the turn out was just incredible, easily half a million people probably more. It's such a shame the minority ruined it for the majority.
I'll try and stick up some photo's I took (nothing special, just took them on my iPhone 4) but I feel pretty horrific after my fight with a train door still.
They will rush to their favourite internet forums and argue incessantly that there is a better way.......
Things don't happen like that though do they?
There are plenty examples of small community benefiting schemes. That aren;t driven by profit.
You just have to look at the rapidly expanding community farming/food producing sector.
Some people are starting to realise the community should provide such things and not the state with all the inefficiency they incur.
Hopefully enough people have the foresight, intelligence and responsibility to try and better their community. Just like the huge number of people who work for the thousands of charitys.
We can not keep extending are debt, it is never sustainable. You are far to short sighted, how can you possibly think we should keep spending more and more money. Do you have the same out look on your own finances? do you keep extending your credit card debt every few months?
Last edited:
I may be missing the point here but why would you have to deliver a shoddy service and take advantage of the vulnerable just because you ran a private company which offered this service, instead of the public sector?
Would it make you any less caring if you worked in the private sector as opposed to the public sector?
To me, that sounds nothing more than left wing union propaganda or words from that well known and discredited agitator, Ed Milliband!
There are plenty of large examples as well, such as Bupa, the RNLI, John Lewis and so on....
I didn't hear one constructive suggestion from people on the TUC march about how to address the issues.
Some peopled argued that there were no needs for cuts! Other suggestions were to tax the rich and tackle tax evasion, I think what they were actually talking about is tax avoidance.
Some peopled argued that there were no needs for cuts! Other suggestions were to tax the rich and tackle tax evasion, I think what they were actually talking about is tax avoidance.
ooo a tiny bit personal.
You've failed to read and / or understand my view on this. I've said several times that I don't agree with the severity of the cuts. The bold word is the important bit.
My own finances are fine thank you, I don't owe a penny
on the flip side I don't earn much.Meh as I've said before I don't want to get in to an argument about this with what seems a very right wing forum
I'll leave you all to it, but I enjoyed the march and the turn out was just incredible, easily half a million people probably more. It's such a shame the minority ruined it for the majority.
I'll try and stick up some photo's I took (nothing special, just took them on my iPhone 4) but I feel pretty horrific after my fight with a train door still.
It's nothing to do with being left or right wing (if only people were that easily pigeonholed), if we continue to spend as we have eventually the money runs out and the cuts you are so vehemently against will only be insignificant to the world of pain that public services will be in when our debt spirals put of control and we end up in a worse state than Ireland and Portugal.
The EU bailing out tiny economies like Ireland is one thing, bailing out the UK, it isn't gonna happen.
Cuts are NECESSARY, in many ways they are not enough and we still run a risk, but continuing down the road laid by Labour would have ultimately led to far worse and marching about really doesn't solve anything, only costing more money that could have been spent more efficiently.
Instead of incessently moaning, why not put that effort into finding ways of alternative funding and investment?
ooo a tiny bit personal.
You've failed to read and / or understand my view on this. I've said several times that I don't agree with the severity of the cuts. The bold word is the important bit.
My own finances are fine thank you, I don't owe a penny
it's a personal question, not a personal attack. to find out your view point.
The cuts are not going to reduce our debt, Even after the cuts we will still be expanding our debt by considerable amounts. So your point just does not stand.
More to the point, it doesn't matter where you put the tax burden, historically we've never achieved much more than 40% of GDP in taxation for any meaningful length of time, whether we were hammering the rich and corporations in the 70s, or moving to sales taxes and the like in the 80s and 90s.
Currently public spending is over 50% of GDP, while taxation remains at around historical levels. It is therefore clear that we need to reduce spending, not increase taxation, to balance the economy sustainably.
Associate
- Joined
- 6 May 2009
- Posts
- 566
I don't know how to do the separate quote bits. Regarding speculation- If I remember, the best way to save arguing about this is to have a chat about it in a few months.
In terms of accusations of playing the 'emotional' card- That was not my intention. I don't care in what way a decent service is offered to vulnerable people needing care- what I am certain of is that if any sector currently funded primarily through state provision is in dire straits it is social care. So, if these services can be provided in other ways, great.
I don't love working in the public sector by any stretch of the imagination.
In my situation I do my current job because I see it as a role that has a significant positive impact on people's lives, not because I earn a shed load (I don't). I think it's a bit too easy for you to acuse anyone in these posts that stands up for services to automatically also think that they must be state provided.
The idea of decent not-for-profit organisation is something that could work. I was a bit flippant about private care because it gets up my nose how much profit they make at the expense of the care they deliver. However, if being honest, in the area of social care that I work in, the squeeze has been evident for over 2 years and the private companies (who I would estimate get about 75% of all the contracts) are also being squeezed. It's not a good time to set up in this field otherwise I would have considered it!
I'd be genuinely interested to know how you think social care should work in this country, and how we get from where we are now to where you think we should be without it harming people that need it.
You give them far to much credit, they haven't done the numbers. It is just typical "tax the rich rhetoric."
Associate
- Joined
- 6 May 2009
- Posts
- 566
You are right, I wouldn't. I was being slightly flippant about the reality of most private care organisations that I see day in day out in my work.
I would say though that a lot of charitable organisations are a lot better. I'm not sitting here saying the state has to physically run all of these services
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 27 Sep 2004
- Posts
- 25,821
- Location
- Glasgow
So we're agreed then, pointing at the number of people on the March or not on the March isn't a good metric for knowing how many people support or disagree with the cuts and indeed to what extent.
I didn't say it was a personal attack?
In your opinion, In my opinion the cuts are overly harsh and more to do with political ideologies.
When they begin? The private sector has had them for 3 years and far harder. Don't forget that a company going bust and losing a few hundred or thousand jobs will never happen to a public sector department, so you can probably see why people get angry over those protesting over reducing the public sector spending to that of a few years ago.