Poll: Terry Pratchet what the...

[Burnsy2023]

The BBC is supposed to be impartial. If they are going to show a programme like that then they are supposed to show both sides of the argument.

I disagree. Terry Pratchett has made a couple of documentaries about his condition and his wishes to end his life on his terms. This is just a follow up on how he could achieve those aims legally.

This is a personal journey for him with wide reaching consequences but he doesn't want to live when his conditions becomes acute, so why put it in the documentary?

 

[Van Hellseek]

This debate isn't anything new, there are a number of threads on euthanasia already here on OcUK.

 

[spudbynight]

A question for all those in favour of assisted suicide :

Depression is a debilitating illness. Many people who commit suicide do so because they suffer from severe depression.

Do you think they are simply entitled to make their own choice in ending their suffering?

 

[Vonhelmet]

I just think it's right thing to do - to survive as long as possible, even when facing death. It should always be a docters duty to keep someone alive. I don't think death should be a logical choice. Basically just see Britboys examples as to why I disagree with assisted suicide.

Should a doctor prolong a "pointless" life? Terry Schiavo? Extreme example, sure, but where do you draw the line?

And why should life be prolonged? Why not draw the line at a person successfully breeding?

 

[Burnsy2023]

A question for all those in favour of assisted suicide :

Depression is a debilitating illness. Many people who commit suicide do so because they suffer from severe depression.

Do you think they are simply entitled to make their own choice in ending their suffering?

I think there should be many good quality options to avoid death such as hospice care, counselling, drugs etc. However, if the person makes a considered decision to die and are in sound mind to make that decision, then I believe we must respect those wishes.

 

[Vonhelmet]

I think there should be many good quality options to avoid death such as hospice care, counselling, drugs etc. However, if the person makes a considered decision to die and are in sound mind to make that decision, then I believe we must respect those wishes.

The question then is whether anyone with depression, or a comparable mental illness, is in their right mind.

 

[spudbynight]

I think there should be many good quality options to avoid death such as hospice care, counselling, drugs etc. However, if the person makes a considered decision to die and are in sound mind to make that decision, then I believe we must respect those wishes.

So someone who for example loses their family and decides rationally they don't want to live any more should be allowed?

 

[Pighardia]

I think there should be many good quality options to avoid death such as hospice care, counselling, drugs etc. However, if the person makes a considered decision to die and are in sound mind to make that decision, then I believe we must respect those wishes.

Totally agree, but i would probably say that i would feel more comfortable with it if the person was of sound mind at that point, and not a decision made earlier tbh, for reasons i said earlier.

 

[FTM]

A question for all those in favour of assisted suicide :

Depression is a debilitating illness. Many people who commit suicide do so because they suffer from severe depression.

Do you think they are simply entitled to make their own choice in ending their suffering?

yes I do

but the clinically depressed probably wouldnt go down that route anyway as you never know how planned those sorts of suicides are...sadly it wouldnt stop people throwing themselves under trains or walking out into traffic on the motorway ( an incredibly selfish and dangerous choice as it inevitably causes an accident where total innocents are injured)

 

[spudbynight]

The question then is whether anyone with depression, or a comparable mental illness, is in their right mind.

Well surely anyone who suffers from a life debilitating condition wouldn't be in their right mind?

If you were in constant pain then that is surely going to have a bearing on your mental outlook?

 

[spudbynight]

yes I do

but the clinically depressed probably wouldnt go down that route anyway as you never know how planned those sorts of suicides are...sadly it wouldnt stop people throwing themselves under traisn ore walking out into traffic on the motorway ( an incredibly selfish and dangerous choice as it inevitably causes an accident where total innocents are injured)

I am just speechless

 

[Burnsy2023]

So someone who for example loses their family and decides rationally they don't want to live any more should be allowed?

Dignitas have a process that is around a year with multiple psychological examinations. If we had a similar process where someone made a decision to go through the process, gets the green light to say they are of sound mind why should we stop them? I don't see how society can say that you can't make that choice. We shouldn't force people to live just as we shouldn't force people to die.

Clinically depressed people may have difficulty proving they are of sound mind though.

 

[Pighardia]

So someone who for example loses their family and decides rationally they don't want to live any more should be allowed?

But as someone has already said, as sad as it is, that person will have the capability to end their own life. I imagine killing yourself isn't the easiest decision to make and if someone is truly determined, then there is little you can do to stop them outside of the appropriate counselling. In that situation, there would surely be months of checks first and counselling etc.

 

[Sunbed]

Should a doctor prolong a "pointless" life? Terry Schiavo? Extreme example, sure, but where do you draw the line?

And why should life be prolonged? Why not draw the line at a person successfully breeding?

It's a good point, and something I can't really answer because I don't have any personal experience (fortunately!).

I think the reason we have "no line" now is because that question is so difficult to answer.

I was really trying to promote an argument that seemed in the minority when I first posted. I am yet to be convinced either way.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Well surely anyone who suffers from a life debilitating condition wouldn't be in their right mind?

If you were in constant pain then that is surely going to have a bearing on your mental outlook?

Does that mean that suddenly their opinion doesn't count? That just because they are in pain and want that to end that they are not qualified to make a decision about their future?

I am just speechless

Why? This is all about empowering people to have control over their destiny even if their body doesn't (or may soon not) allow them to make the actions they want to take.

 

[iamtheoneneo]

I'd like to think that it should be everyone's duty to attempt to stay alive for as long as possible. However, my feelings may be different if I were lying on my death bed in pain.

There was a time where death was an honour, a glorious death for one reason or another was the ultimate sacrifice but also the right sacrifice.

As time has progressed and especially after the recent big wars it seems your average joe public has turned into a bit of a nancy boy (or girl)

theres one thing in life that we know is certain - that we will die. I dont see the problem in doing this one act on our own terms when we choose to do it.

death isnt pretty no matter how its acted out, anyone that thinks otherwise is clearly living in a different world...but if its a quick valiant death thats surely better than a soul destroying one.

 

[Craig1981]

Its a very thorny issue and I dont think theres a simple blanket answer that can cover everyone. One person with a terminal illness might choose to die where another might cling to every single second of life they have left. And it begs the question where you draw the line? What about babies born with severe disabilities? The ones that will never walk on their own two legs, have a relationship, have children of their own, enjoy pretty much any normal social activity? Isnt it "kinder" to spare them such a hollow half life and end it immediately? Thats not my personal belief just for the record, I'm just playing Devils advocate.

On a more selfish note, Terry Pratchet cant kill himself! Who would write Discworld novels then!

 

[Theophany]

death isnt pretty no matter how its acted out, anyone that thinks otherwise is clearly living in a different world...but if its a quick valiant death thats surely better than a soul destroying one.

Flip side: suicide is regarded as a cowardly way to check out.

People who have it unimaginably harder than you or I don't have the option of choosing that route for whatever reason.

There is no valiance in suicide, it is not glamorous or brave, it's just a less difficult way out for a minority of people.

 

[spudbynight]

My argument against this is really a moral one.

There is the practical side of things. If assisted suicide was allowed then I am sure there would be cases where families or doctors put pressure on people to end their lives. The story below gives an example of the pressure that can be put on people to end things - in a society where assisted suicide is illegal. This would only increase if the law was changed.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/health/2011/0412/1224294468194.html

Aside from the practical side of things I am not convinced of people being in a fit state to make such a decision. It is highly likely that anyone diagnosed with such a condition that causes them to consider taking their own life is going to be suffering from depression (whether that depression is diagnosed or not)

I view life as sacred. I don't support the death penalty and one reason for this is that I believe that the wrongful execution of one innocent outweighs all the potential lawful executions. In the same way if legalisation of assisted suicide caused just a single unjust death then that alone outweighs any potential benefits.

 

[Vonhelmet]

On a more selfish note, Terry Pratchet cant kill himself! Who would write Discworld novels then!

He has Alzheimer's... At some point sooner or later he may well not even know that he wrote them thus far.