Logic Test - i don't get it

Nanoman · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:20

Chronictank said:
nop no extra info.
you basically get the 2 statements a and b, with a concluding statement which you need to decide is correct or incorrect

Another example, this is the question as written in its entirety:

Where the answer is 'correct' as a canadian can be right handed and an optician

Apologies for the badly phrased initial question here it is better formatted

The right answer is that the conclusion is incorrect

Yea I'd say they were both incorrect tbh. The first is only stating 'some' when it's all.

The second is just wrong.

Chronictank · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:23

Nanoman said:
Yea I'd say they were both incorrect tbh. The first is only stating 'some' when it's all.

The second is just wrong.

it's not 'all' because right handed non-canadians can be an optician too

Redz · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:27

TheCenturion said:
The conclusion is wrong.

Why? Because it doesn't tell you anything about racing tracks being routes of transportation, and it doesn't say that only streets are routes of transportation.

Basically, it's possible for all racing tracks to be routes of transformation, and the two premises would still be valid.

This. The conclusion doesn't follow from the premises given, in philosophical jargon it's a Non_sequitur.

mistercrabb · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:29

Chronictank said:
nop no extra info.
you basically get the 2 statements a and b, with a concluding statement which you need to decide is correct or incorrect

Another example, this is the question as written in its entirety:

2. a. All Canadians are right handed.
b. All right handed are opticians.

Conclusion is: Some opticians are Canadian.

Is this
Correct
Incorrect

Where the answer is 'correct' as a canadian can be right handed and an optician

That's not why the answer is correct though.
Read it again.
a. ALL Canadians are right-handed.
b. ALL right-handed people are opticians.

That means that everyone in Canada is an optician.
But Canada isn't the only country.
Some opticians are filling up Canada, but the rest can be in other countries, so you must conclude that some opticians are Canadian.

Nanoman · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:30

Non-canadians are not in the scenario.

Al Vallario · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:36

Chronictank · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:39

aw man now i am even more confused, i think its time for a break :/

xarr · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:44

Al Vallario said:
Just to clarify, this is the correct Venn diagram:

That's what I drew in my head when I read it, not a "typical" venn diagram but the correct answer to the puzzle

semi-pro waster · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:48

Al Vallario said:
Just to clarify, this is the correct Venn diagram:

http://i.imgur.com/bm6rV.png[img][/QUOTE]

Technically do the routes of transportation and racing track circles have to overlap at all? There doesn't appear to be enough information to say whether they do or don't.

Your picture answers the question fine and may very well be correct in terms of what they questioner is aiming for but figure I might as well check despite the irrelevance in terms of the answer required.

Al Vallario · 28 Sep 2011 at 19:49

muon · 28 Sep 2011 at 20:02

Both Venn diagrams are 2 possible options. We don't have enough information to pick.

It could also be completely outside of transportation.

Liampope · 28 Sep 2011 at 20:03

Al Vallario said:
Just to clarify, this is the correct Venn diagram:

Not neccessarily. From the two statements given racing tracks could be inside transport, outside transport or intersecting transport, just as long as it does not intersect or include streets. So the conclusion doesn't follow, but isn't neccessarily incorrect.

Liampope · 28 Sep 2011 at 20:17

And this is a correct diagram for the other question...

So the conclusion 'some opticians are Canadian' is correct.

Al Vallario · 28 Sep 2011 at 20:22

Kenai · 28 Sep 2011 at 20:37

Al Vallario said:
Nope, I think the latter one I posted is correct.

It should go without saying that all racing tracks are routes of transportation. That's a truism

I suspect adding in your own conditions somewhat defeats the object of the logic based puzzles though.

I would think the idea isn't to apply your own 'real world truisms', it's to establish whether the conclusions are correct or incorrect based on the provided information to test your ability to solve logic based puzzles.

Liampope · 28 Sep 2011 at 20:50

Al Vallario said:
Nope, I think the latter one I posted is correct.

It should go without saying that all racing tracks are routes of transportation. That's a truism

If you think you can just add your own 'truisms' (and I dont agree personally that race tracks are for transportation because you dont go anywhere - i.e. you end up back where you started) then what on earth do you think about all Canadians being right-handed opticians??

[FnG]magnolia · 28 Sep 2011 at 20:54

If you're doing these tests then WHO IS FLYING THE PLANE? :eek:

Al Vallario · 28 Sep 2011 at 21:02

Turambar · 28 Sep 2011 at 21:07

Kenai said:
I suspect adding in your own conditions somewhat defeats the object of the logic based puzzles though.

I would think the idea isn't to apply your own 'real world truisms', it's to establish whether the conclusions are correct or incorrect based on the provided information to test your ability to solve logic based puzzles.

Indeed. If we replace the names the answer should be the same:

a. All streets are routes of transportation.
b. None of the streets is a racing track.

Conclusion is: Some racing tracks are not routes of transportation.

Answer: Incorrect.

Becomes:

a. All X are Y.
b. None of the X is a Z.

Conclusion is: Some Z are not Y.

Answer: Incorrect.

With the information provided provided we know that all are X are Y but only that some Y are X. We also know that no X is a Z.

We don't have enough information to determine whether some Z are not Y so the conclusion is incorrect.

Amp34 · 28 Sep 2011 at 21:17

And this is why "logic" questions are not about actual logic, rather about being able to answer a certain type of question... It's a bit like logic puzzles. Logically there can be several answers, unfortunately you have to guess which one is the "right" one...