The tolerant Catholic Church

e36Adz said:
This is an example of talking out of your rear end.
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As well practiced as you may be sometimes you may be interpreting what others say on your own level, as I never talk from the lower half of my body you did indeed misjudge my post.

e36Adz said:
It is a very simple question which no one seems to be able to answer yet previously it was all 'do as you please as long as you are hurting no one'.

Oh but you have stated this is 'not right', please do explain why?
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It cannot ever be morally right to engage in relations with family members; this is apart from the fact that genetic mutations can curse the offspring, the idea is plain wrong in all ways.
 
e36Adz said:
If you do not believe in God, and you believe that 'right' and 'wrong' change as time goes on depending on how you feel, then yeah, there is absolutely nothing wrong with homosexual marriage. You can only fear the worst for a society when it is heading down this road.
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When we don't just blindly follow things, but instead question them and actually think for ourselves? haha. I perish the thought!

e36Adz said:
Certain actions are harmful to oneself. Again, if you do not believe you will ever have to account to anyone for anything then I suppose yeah you can do as you please without fear of any consequence.
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Yeah, I don't know what's keeping me from raping women... it must be the fear of jail. :o Perhaps that's why these damn atheists have no moral compass!!

spudbynight said:
So if they were infertile then you would have no problem with a brother a sister marrying?
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I wouldn't as long as they aren't hurting anybody else in the process. It would be none of my business what other consenting adults do.
 
e36Adz said:
Do you also think it is ok?
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Without knowing all of the situation it would be impossible to say.

for example if two siblings separated at birth later meet and fall in love, I'd personally have a very hard time saying that was morally wrong.


After all could you explain in that circumstance, what exactly the moral "wrong" is?

assuming they don't know.
 
Hitman_Leon said:
It cannot ever be morally right to engage in relations with family members; this is apart from the fact that genetic mutations can curse the offspring, the idea is plain wrong in all ways.
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Castiel disagree with you, as I think does Tefal, so try telling that to them.

Again, you haven't really explained why two adult siblings lets say aged 29 and 30, cannot marry each other if they both consented. What reason would you give them?
 
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Morality has to adjust with technology, which includes science. Otherwise society would never progress as we would just not do anything because it's morally wrong.
 
steve-h said:
When we don't just blindly follow things, but instead question them and actually think for ourselves? haha. I perish the thought!
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Which is exactly what people brought up in certain societies do! If society tells them homosexual marriage is normal, they seem to blindly agree.

Searching for answers and being open to accepting the truth, is hardly following things blindly.
 
Craterloads said:
Childish but uugghh!

Your morals are in the wrong place then.
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Why is it childish?

and how are my morals in the wrong place?

I have explained that I am morally ambiguous about it, given specific conditions. I have already stated that I am in favour of many taboos being acceptable such as polygamy and group marriage......while I see some significant difficulties with consensual sex between close family members, especially those who have a matter of trust between them such as Parents and Children I do not ascribe a specific moral code to them...I am objective insofar that I would consider arguments that are contrary to current social moral stances on such things.

I do not however think that there is yet sufficient evidence or argument to overturn such laws and morals as they relate to incestuous relationships...the risks far outweigh the benefits both for the individual and society.
 
e36Adz said:
Sorry I wasn't trying to cheery pick but you raised an important point. A lot of people like yourself do believe that 'certain' practices are outdated, but my point was that someone who believes that Gods laws are the highest laws, will also believe they can never be outdated. Hence why it is difficult for the two opposing parties to see eye to eye.
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If there is a god; that god will value reason and understanding above all, humanity has evolved greater powers or reason and understanding thus attitudes and practices of right and wrong evolve over time.

e36Adz said:
But most of that is dictated by the society you have been brought up in. Some societies may have abhorrent practices which seem perfectly normal to the people living there if that is what they have grown up in. Can we tell them they are wrong? Do we just go by our own desires, judgements? Who is right and who is wrong, or is everyone right?
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I don't follow the values of the society I was brought up in; I pick what fits best with my own moral code, if I followed all the values I was brought up with I would be an antisemitic homophobic. I have the choice of free will and my choices always are made on balance with what I consider to be morally right.
 
two questions.

e36Adz


Morally right for an adult man to marry a 13 year old?



craterloads

Morally right to impregnate a woman without her permission?
 
Castiel said:
Why is it childish?

and how are my morals in the wrong place?

I have explained that I am morally ambiguous about it, given specific conditions. I have already stated that I am in favour of many taboos being acceptable such as polygamy and group marriage......while I see some significant difficulties with consensual sex between close family members, especially those who have a matter of trust between them such as Parents and Children I do not ascribe a specific moral code to them...I am objective insofar that I would consider arguments that are contrary to current social moral stances on such things.

I do not however think that there is yet sufficient evidence or argument to overturn such laws and morals as they relate to incestuous relationships...the risks far outweigh the benefits both for the individual and society.
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My "uuggh" being childish.

Given the discussed situation and being morally ambiguous towards said situation, i would consider that as lacking of morals, considering its so clear cut.
 
Craterloads said:
nope, but my morals tell me two brothers having sex with each other is disgusting.

No explaining is needed on this one....
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I would find two brothers having sex distasteful also....I would find two men having sex distasteful...however that is not a moral position, it is simply a personal preference. I can no more help how I feel about it as I can change whether I like a certain food or not.....

However, the fact that I find it distasteful is not the problem of the homosexual couple...it is my problem and it is one I need to deal with and this is where my morals over-ride my distaste, as I would never base a judgement on the individual or their relationship based on the fact that I don't like to watch men have sex....
 
e36Adz said:
Which is exactly what people brought up in certain societies do! If society tells them homosexual marriage is normal, they seem to blindly agree.
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Probably because it's not one of those things that hurt anybody. I can't see why it would be questioned (should religion or another controlling force not exist).

Someone saying x should not be allowed because unproven y said so however does need questioning.

e36Adz said:
Searching for answers and being open to accepting the truth, is hardly following things blindly.
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It is if you search for all the answers in a holy book.
 
Castiel said:
I would find two brothers having sex distasteful also....I would find two men having sex distasteful...however that is not a moral position, it is simply a personal preference. I can no more help how I feel about it as I can change whether I like a certain food or not.....

However, the fact that I find it distasteful is not the problem of the homosexual couple...it is my problem and it is one I need to deal with and this is where my morals over-ride my distaste, as I would never base a judgement on the individual or their relationship based on the fact that I don't like to watch men have sex....
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This debate has gotten off topic, to what was being discussed earlier anyways.

It has gone down this path since you stated

Castie said:
Why is it actually MORALLY WRONG for two people who love each other to get married?....
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thats why brotherly incest was bought into the picture.
 
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