Man claims stroke turned him gay

TheBigCheese · 17 Apr 2012 at 23:43

fus said:
There aren't any. He's talking absolute nonsense (although I suspect that you know this already )

Indeed, cobblers all round, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, especially when banded about as fact, but who are we to argue, he was told at school!

The Halk · 17 Apr 2012 at 23:51

Man shocked at own mortality decides to come out of closet.

ubersonic · 18 Apr 2012 at 00:46

|Thomas| said:
It has absolutely nothing to do with it being offensive or not, homosexuality is not a mental disorder and it's as simple as that.

Whether it is caused by physiological factors, probably, I don't know enough about it.

I never said it was a mental disorder, I said it was caused by irregularities in the brain, the link you posted from the APA is actually saying that it is a biological issue and not a psychological one (as they previously thought when they classed it as a medical disorder)

TheBigCheese said:
Point me to some academic articles to validate your point, if you've done it at school you should be able to find some fairly easily, as to my knowledge (and I'm happy to be proved wrong) there isn't any evidence to back up your argument.

Heres the base science:
"This finding indicates that INAH [part of the hypothalamus] is dimorphic with sexual orientation, at least in men, and suggests that sexual orientation has a biological substrate."

Heres some sources:
http://allpsych.com/journal/homosexuality.html
http://www.viewzone.com/homosexual.html
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/a-difference-not-a-defect/
http://web.archive.org/web/20010619161036/http://www.utexas.edu/courses/bio301c/Topics/Gay/Text.html

I would like to stress I have gay friends and I have nothing against gay people, but somebody on page one asked the question of why people are gay so I answered it, tbh its quite surprising in this day and age some people still think it might be caused by environmental/psychological factors when its been known for so long its a biological cause.

|Thomas| · 18 Apr 2012 at 09:51

ubersonic said:
I never said it was a mental disorder, I said it was caused by irregularities in the brain, the link you posted from the APA is actually saying that it is a biological issue and not a psychological one (as they previously thought when they classed it as a medical disorder)

You did say, on the other hand:

ubersonic said:
It's what I was taught in school, if you google "homosexuality brain disorder" a lot of stuff will come up.

The point I, and others, are making is that homosexuality isn't a mental disorder or any other kind of disorder (or "mental problem" as you refer to in your first post). What if, for example, people who are more optimistic in life have a different shaped brain to those who are pessimistic, is this a mental disorder? Or vice versa?

This does not mean homosexuality cannot have physiological causes, I'm not saying that at all. If fact the evidence for a biological cause is compelling, but this is not the same as saying it's a brain disorder.

I would like to stress I have gay friends and I have nothing against gay people, but somebody on page one asked the question of why people are gay so I answered it, tbh its quite surprising in this day and age some people still think it might be caused by environmental/psychological factors when its been known for so long its a biological cause.

If you were friends with me and said I had a mental problem I certainly wouldn't be your friend for long.

Marky · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:01

This story kind of reminds me of the film "I love Phillip Morris" (I highly recommend you give it a watch

)

Supercow · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:05

So a stroke turned him gay.
Going by that kind of logic, electro shock treatment can then turn gays intro straights.

bhavv · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:23

ubersonic said:
I would like to stress I have gay friends and I have nothing against gay people,

And this is the most pathetic defence anyone can come up with regarding their blatant homophobia / racism / any other prejudices.

You clearly said that you think that Homosexuality is a mental disorder. This is not a belief that is verifyable by any reputable scientific body or organisation in the world.

What 'biology' or any other area of science 'suggests' and 'hypothesizes' is not a validation that science supports any of your incorrect opinions on what is and isn't classifiable as a mental disorder.

RDM · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:29

There is the possibility that sexuality isn't really a binary (or trinary) state and more a sliding scale and the stroke could have changed to enough to slide him closer to one end of said scale. Then there is a question of just how much of sexuality is cultural rather than physiological.

bhavv · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:32

Are you suggesting that culture somehow supports and promotes peoples sexuality?

Supercow · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:34

bhavv said:
Are you suggesting that culture somehow supports and promotes peoples sexuality?

In the same way that it can oppress one's sexuality, the reverse can also be true.

Fact remains - we don't know but a combination of factors seem likely (combination between nature and nurture)

RDM · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:34

bhavv said:
Are you suggesting that culture somehow supports and promotes peoples sexuality?

I am suggesting that it is a possibility.

ubersonic · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:55

|Thomas| said:
You did say, on the other hand:

Saying you can find information on something by Googling something I put in quotes does not mean I believe what is in the quotes, especially when I have categorically stated otherwise.

|Thomas| said:
The point I, and others, are making is that homosexuality isn't a mental disorder or any other kind of disorder (or "mental problem" as you refer to in your first post).

I know, I one of the other people making that point! And I did not call it a mental problem, in fact I said it wasn't.

|Thomas| said:
What if, for example, people who are more optimistic in life have a different shaped brain to those who are pessimistic, is this a mental disorder? Or vice versa?

No, if that were true it would just be another irregularity, like being left handed, the is nothing wrong with some people being different.

|Thomas| said:
If you were friends with me and said I had a mental problem I certainly wouldn't be your friend for long.

I am a getting a bit tired defending myself against illusionary accusations...

bhavv said:
And this is the most pathetic defence anyone can come up with regarding their blatant homophobia / racism / any other prejudices.

You clearly said that you think that Homosexuality is a mental disorder.

I said it is not a mental disorder and that to insinuate such would be homophobic, and I have even stressed this point in further posts >.>

bhavv · 18 Apr 2012 at 10:56

^^ you definitely wouldn't have been taught in any science class any of the opinions you have falsely posted regarding sexuality in this thread. You are referring to science as a false authourity to support your homophobic insecurities, similarly to when atheists try and use science to support that there is no God.

RDM said:
I am suggesting that it is a possibility.

So do you suggest that being raised by straight parents promotes the development of straight children, and being raised by gay same sex parents promotes the development of gay children?

King Damager · 18 Apr 2012 at 11:04

It's an interesting concept... If it is something to do with how your brain works, or how it is 'laid out' as such, then I could understand that something like a stroke could change that....

As for Environment, I think it has an influence on whether you surpress your feelings or not. If you're outrightly gay, or outrightly straight I doubt it would have an effect. If you were borderline, then I'm sure parents, and culture could influence which side you choose to go with as such...

kd

bhavv · 18 Apr 2012 at 11:06

Culture wouldn't ever affect or change which gender you are sexually attracted to, just as much as christian straight camps don't actually cure homosexuality, and 'ex gays' are simply self hating closet queens.

Metalface Mark · 18 Apr 2012 at 11:07

My next door neighbour from when I was growing up is a gay, he was camp from a young age and even in primary school people would joke that he was a gay. It was still a shock when he came out as a gay but this combined with another boy in my class to turned out to be a gay made me convinced its 100% genetic.

ubersonic · 18 Apr 2012 at 11:08

bhavv said:
^^ you definitely wouldn't have been taught in any science class any of the opinions you have falsely posted regarding sexuality in this thread. You are referring to science as a false authourity to support your homophobic insecurities, similarly to when atheists try and use science to support that there is no God.

So you are saying that my opinion that the is nothing wrong with being gay and that we are fine the way we are made is wrong? because that is the only opinion I have expressed (of course I have also posted a couple of scientific facts and when requested backed them up with credible source, but thats not opinion).

bhavv · 18 Apr 2012 at 11:12

There are no scientific facts on sexuality, and no conclusion within science that homosexuality is a mental disorder as you seem to think it is. I've studied sexuality at university level and read into this topic a lot, none of your conclusions are supported by science, and your random links don't support your conclusions either.

You seem unable to spot the difference between scientific research, speculation and testing of any hypothesis and solid 100% factual conclusions.

ubersonic · 18 Apr 2012 at 11:18

bhavv said:
There are no scientific facts on sexuality

Yes the are, try reading the previous pages

bhavv said:
and no conclusion within science that homosexuality is a mental disorder as you seem to think it is.

No, because as I have said many times in this thread it is not a mental disorder, however like I said in my first post it is caused by irregularities in the brain (like many things are), homosexuality is not a disorder it is merely a difference to the normal, and the is nothing wrong with being a bit different.

Im beginning to think that your deliberately misreading my posts to try and annoy me but it won't work

bhavv said:
I've studied sexuality at university level and read into this topic a lot, none of your conclusions are supported by science.

Yes they are, read up for links and stuff, the university of Texas one is good, check this bit out:

This finding indicates that INAH [part of the hypothalamus] is dimorphic with sexual orientation, at least in men, and suggests that sexual orientation has a biological substrate.

bhavv · 18 Apr 2012 at 11:20

Good god, reading about sexuality from the university of Texas, are you actually being serious or just trolling now?

And wait, what you actually quoted doesn't even conclude 'mental disorder' in any way whatsoever.

Having a biological link =/= 'mental disorder'.