Distance Selling Regs - Question on returns

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Soldato
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Evening peeps,

Quick question for you on the returns part of the DSR. I ordered a couple of items from an online retailer last week which included free shipping in the price. Neither of the items arrived in time for me to be able to use them at the weekend, so I had to buy alternatives at a local shop and now wish to return the original items for a refund.

I've contacted the retailer to begin the returns process and although they have no problems accepting the goods back, their T&Cs state that any returns on items which were shipped with their free delivery (which is everything as they don't have an option to upgrade to a paid-for service :confused:) are subject to a £3-5 fee to cover costs!

Now I can understand a retailer not refunding the original postage cost if I had paid for it, as they have no obligation to do so under the DSR, but surely as all their prices already include 'free' shipping they aren't allowed to charge this fee?! It's going to cost me a fiver to post the items back to them anyway so I don't want to lose another fiver just because they fancy charging a fee they're not entitled to.

Am I right in thinking they're being cheeky here?
 
Complete ****. They cannot charge you and in fact have to also refund the original postage as well. You get everything you paid in full. They cannot charge you for anything at all.
 
You are entitled to a refund including original postage. If you're paying for the return postage they should refund all of your original payment imo.

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/business_leaflets/general/oft698.pdf

3.48 The DSRs require you to refund any money paid by or on behalf of the consumer in relation to the contract to the person who made the payment. This means the full price of the goods, or deposit or pre-payment made, including the cost of delivery. The essence of distance selling is that consumers buy from home and receive goods at home. In these circumstances, almost every case of home shopping will involve delivery of the goods ordered and so delivery forms an essential part of the contract
 
Under the DSR the retailer has to refund the shipping costs you paid to have the goods sent to you.

If you'd paid £50 for the goods and £10 for the delivery they would have to refund £60.

As you didn't pay anything for the delivery there's simply nothing to refund to you.

You have to cover the cost of retrning the items.
 
Postage refunding only covers delivery to you, so returning them is all on you.

The charge however is a bit shady, doesn't sound right.
 
Just to add to that, retailers are not allowed to make further charges, such as restocking or administration fees to claw back money lost when customers cancel an order.

However, if the retailer wants you to send goods back and pay for their return, they need to make this clear in their contract. If the consumer sends the goods back at the retailer's expense, or fails to return them at all, the retailer is allowed to charge the direct cost.
 
Fenris said:
The charge however is a bit shady, doesn't sound right.
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Thats because it isn't allowed.

They cannot override your statutory rights. They could put in their T&C's that "Every return must be accompanied by a dead badger otherwise no refund will be given". Doesn't make it legal. In fact, when you mention that to them they just reply with "Now you are just being stupid".
 
as an online retailer i would say you are responsible for returning the items since there was nothing wrong with them.

I would class the return as a change of mind and refund all your money back (since its free postage they cant charge you) but not return postage.

there will be some stuff about it in the DSR's but im not going to check.
 
just to echo what others have already said: they are not allowed to make that charge. They have to refund all initial costs. You are responsible for return postage ONLY IF the retailer specifies that in the T&Cs.
 
Thanks for all the help. I've dropped them an email querying the legality of their returns policy so will see what they come back with.

I've also noticed that there is no mention of the consumer being responsible for return postage costs so I'll use that one against them as well!
 
scratch said:
I've also noticed that there is no mention of the consumer being responsible for return postage costs so I'll use that one against them as well!
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DON'T!!! The DSR covers postage paid for delivery but not the cost of the return postage unless the product is faulty.

The business is under no obligation to refund return P&P costs for returns because you've changed your mind (which is essentially your claim from a legal perspective).

You have a reasonable cause to question this 'admin fee' they are claiming you owe them, you are on very shakey ground trying to claim they have to pay for the return postage as well and you don't want to harm your case with regards to the first issue.
 
estebanrey said:
DON'T!!! The DSR covers postage paid for delivery but not the cost of the return postage unless the product is faulty.

The business is under no obligation to refund return P&P costs for returns because you've changed your mind (which is essentially your claim from a legal perspective).
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They most certainly are, unless they made it clear in advance on their T&Cs.
 
The Halk said:
They most certainly are, unless they made it clear in advance on their T&Cs.
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This is an interesting explanation....


I want my postage back! Delivery Charge refunds under Distance Selling Regulations

12.07.10




The Distance Selling Regulations have been in force for almost 10 years now, but some thorny issues keep coming up. And whether or not retailers are required to refund delivery charges appears to be one of them, following an investigation carried out by the BBC.

The answer is quite simple: Yes, they do.

The Regulations apply when a consumer purchases a product from a retailer at a distance, for example over the internet, the telephone, or by mail order. In most cases (there are of course some exceptions) they are given a cooling off period of seven days from the day after the date they receive the product. This seven day period may also be extended if the retailer hasn't provided all the mandatory information required by the regulations by this time.

If the consumer cancels the contract within that seven days, they are entitled to a refund of all money that they have paid in relation to that contract. This includes anything paid for postage and packing.

This isn't a new issue. Back in 2002, the Office of Fair Trading had discussions with online booksellers on this very point, eventually convincing them to refund delivery charges. Many felt that this would greatly increase the overheads of online retailers as compared to offline retailers which don't have to bear delivery costs in relation to returned goods (and which are, in fact, not required to accept returns of non-faulty goods in any event). However, the rationale behind the obligations is that in order to encourage internet shopping, consumers must have the same ability to inspect the product, at no cost, as they would have had if they had gone into a shop.

Retailers don't, however, have to bear the cost of the return. Retailers conducting online sales may recover the cost of the products being returned, provided they draft their terms and conditions appropriately.

Under the Regulations, the consumer is only required to retain possession and take reasonable care of any goods which they are returning following cancellation. They are not actually obliged to return them, unless the retailer has required them to do so in their terms and conditions. However, if that vital term has been included, either the consumer must bear the cost of returning the product, or the retailer may make a charge, not exceeding the direct costs of recovering it.

The Regulations also provide a cancellation period for services and other requirements on online retailers. Look out for future alerts from Wragge & Co's internet law experts for updates on these topics.

http://www.wragge.com/alert_6130.asp
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Now, it's interesting how that is worded. It doesn't say the retailer must refund you the cost of return P&P, it says they can 'recover the costs' themselves from you for returning an item.

I suspect this is what the retailer in question is doing when it is claiming the £3-5.
 
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T&C's can be adjusted to reflect whatever you like, and as a consumer you dont have any proof they have changed. Its also within the rights of a company to change their T&C's at any time without notice.

You have no right to return postage so dont bother asking.

Restocking/admin fees are actually allowable in some circumstances, i'll dig out the legislation.
 
T&Cs and anything that makes part of a contract should be supplied with the contract thats why any decent retailer (bricks and mortar or online) will supply those T&Cs either at the order stage or at the dispact time. Its going to be very hard to rely on those T&Cs as a retailer if you have to later and you have not supplied them.
My belief is that purely displaying them but not giving them so they could be changed makes them harder to rely on in court (I forget the case law I saw)

You cannot ever reduce someones rights below statuatory law with T&Cs they will be simply struck through.

I do not believe you can do any restocking fee with DSR regulations, as soon as some restocking/admin fee would apply the item is likely to fall outside DSR.

Retailers can recover the fee for products being returned if they end up having to arrange it. Under DSR unless T&Cs specifically state you can as a consumer have to return the goods you can claim back your money (inc del costs) and say "pick up your item yourself from here". UNLESS the T&Cs state (as is highly likely) the consumer is responsible for making the return.
 
From a guide to DSR for businesses found the relevant bit I said about above on T&Cs

"Information to be provided once consumers have
decided to buy
If you provide pre-contractual information in a form that does
not allow it to be stored or reproduced by the consumer, such
as during a phone call or on a website, then you must confirm
in writing, or in another durable medium (such as e-mail or
fax) accessible to the consumer that can be kept for future
reference and which cannot be edited. We do not consider
that information on a website is durable as it can be altered
after the consumer has accessed it."
 
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