Are you a feminist?

[TW]Fox · 16 Jun 2012 at 14:57

James J said:
Advertisements against 1 parent should be made illegal as they act like single fathers don't exist and that women are always in the right when it comes to child care and wellbeing, which (newsflash!), they aren't.

Why do you need adverts banned?

Dr House · 16 Jun 2012 at 14:58

My PA is on maternity, she is taking 3 !!!!! YEARS leave and I bet you she will pop out another baby after that.

Thats the last time I employ a women in Czech.

Castiel · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:05

Captain Planet said:
No one stated that men make better leaders it is just naturally common that the man adopts a leadership role in the household/family unit and the woman more a support role. Being the "leader" doesn't make you the better (being in the forces I know that all too well ). Nothing is "forcing" the natural differences, they just are. My other half is absolutely of the same belief on this, she thinks her role as a woman is to support me in everything I do. After all said and done the woman usually wears the trousers, so to speak, doesn't she?

Like they say, behind every great man...

And if the woman is the ambitious career orientated person and the man is in the traditional support role?

These are not gender specific roles, they are simply roles that exist in some family dynamics.......my family for example has been one where at one time or another both my wife and I have fulfilled those roles at varying times dependant on the circumstances, also each of us has varying strengths and weaknesses in regard to who assumes leadership or primacy in any given situation.

Essentially natural role fulfilment should be defined by the individual, their abilities and their needs, not by their gender.

Skillmister · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:08

James J said:
The laws when it comes to paternity vs maternity will never be equal. Most companies don't even acknowledge fathers even exist, especially single fathers. Just look at all the adverts on TV every single day with rubbish like "mums know best" and "mums shop at asda" etc. There are tonnes of feminist adverts on TV which give the false sense that its normal and fine to think this way.

Because no father has ever been a major influence on an olympian.

James J · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:10

[TW]Fox;22152645 said:
Why do you need adverts banned?

Simple, because our low IQ society is gullible and believes everything they see and hear on the TV...

James J · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:10

Skillmister said:
Because no father has ever been a major influence on an olympian.

Exactly -.-

[TW]Fox · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:13

James J said:
Simple, because our low IQ society is gullible and believes everything they see and hear on the TV...

Rubbish. Who cares if people advertise towards Mums? You are making an issue out of something that doesn't matter. The majority of family units contain at least a Mum. Therefore products and services are advertised at them.

paradisiac · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:17

[TW]Fox;22152738 said:
Rubbish. Who cares if people advertise towards Mums? You are making an issue out of something that doesn't matter. The majority of family units contain at least a Mum. Therefore products and services are advertised at them.

im a single dad (well half the week) so im not worthy of being advertised to?

James J · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:24

[TW]Fox;22152738 said:
Rubbish. Who cares if people advertise towards Mums? You are making an issue out of something that doesn't matter. The majority of family units contain at least a Mum. Therefore products and services are advertised at them.

Rubbish, seen as most families also contain a father and single fathers also exist, just as single mothers do. I care as it really annoys me that mothers get empowered by adverts like this being the norm, yet fathers get nothing. You fail to realise how powerful marketing is to the general public, especially in how opinions can easy change from such techniques.

[TW]Fox · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:26

paradisiac said:
im a single dad (well half the week) so im not worthy of being advertised to?

They are a business, the advertisements are designed to generate maximum awareness and from that, maximum sales. So they pick the largest group. Don't take it so personally.

Your view seems to be the same sort of view that makes people scared to say things 'Fireman' and instead say 'Fireperson'...

paradisiac · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:28

[TW]Fox;22152812 said:
They are a business, the advertisements are designed to generate maximum awareness and from that, maximum sales. So they pick the largest group. Don't take it so personally.

so why not have it 'P&G Proud Sponsors of PARENTS!!'? or 'Parents shop at iceland'.......how is using parents instead of mums being any less interesting for mums, they are of course, still a parent?

James J · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:36

[TW]Fox;22152812 said:
They are a business, the advertisements are designed to generate maximum awareness and from that, maximum sales. So they pick the largest group. Don't take it so personally.

Your view seems to be the same sort of view that makes people scared to say things 'Fireman' and instead say 'Fireperson'...

I know that adverts are designed to generate maximum awareness to increase sales, yet there are rules and boundaries though for a reason. The word "parent" covers all bases so that should be used instead, especially if equality is to be sought socially and culturally.

Your failure to realise that means you don't know what the basis of equality even is, let alone means.

Kenai · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:42

paradisiac said:
so why not have it 'P&G Proud Sponsors of PARENTS!!'? or 'Parents shop at iceland'.......how is using parents instead of mums being any less interesting for mums, they are of course, still a parent?

Less targeted and when the entire point is likely to target mums, why deliberately not do it just to pander to a bunch of people your advert isn't aimed at anyway?

paradisiac · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:45

Kenai said:
Less targeted and when the entire point is likely to target mums, why deliberately not do it just to pander to a bunch of people your advert isn't aimed at anyway?

so Iceland only want women in their shop? is that not discrimination?
obvs I couldn't really care less as I don't think I have ever been influenced by an advert, but the point is still their, women cannot demand they get treated equally, unless they are prepared to accept that they have to give men a thought too.

Kenai · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:49

paradisiac said:
so Iceland only want women in their shop? is that not discrimination?
obvs I couldn't really care less as I don't think I have ever been influenced by an advert, but the point is still their, women cannot demand they get treated equally, unless they are prepared to accept that they have to give men a thought too.

No, but Iceland may feel (or have research to suggest) women (mums specifically) are more likely to respond to such targeted advertising and change their shopping habits than men would be, so choose to aim the advertising specifically at women rather than make it less focussed by using more wooly terms just to pander to people who wouldn't likely be influenced by such advertising in the first place.

paradisiac · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:52

Kenai said:
No, but Iceland may feel (or have research to suggest) women (mums specifically) are more likely to respond to such targeted advertising and change their shopping habits than men would be, so choose to aim the advertising specifically at women rather than make it less focussed by using more wooly terms just to pander to people who wouldn't likely be influenced by such advertising in the first place.

but, if we took something like kwikfit or a similar car based company and the adverts all said 'dads/men take their cars to ***' it would be labelled as sexist and women would be in uproar that the company assumes women don't have cars and such. my point was, it should be a 2 way thing, and not all aimed at making womens lives better, it should be about bring both sexes to an equal standing.

Kenai · 16 Jun 2012 at 15:54

paradisiac said:
but, if we took something like kwikfit or a similar car based company and the adverts all said 'dads/men take their cars to ***' it would be labelled as sexist and women would be in uproar that the company assumes women don't have cars and such. my point was, it should be a 2 way thing, and not all aimed at making womens lives better, it should be about bring both sexes to an equal standing.

What, like Yorkie did for years with their 'Not for girls' campaign? I don't honestly recall there being much outrage about that?

I honestly think you're almost looking for a problem that isn't there.

James J · 16 Jun 2012 at 16:15

Kenai said:
What, like Yorkie did for years with their 'Not for girls' campaign? I don't honestly recall there being much outrage about that?

I honestly think you're almost looking for a problem that isn't there.

It wasn't well received and is one of the most complained about adverts made, especially in the US. He's right though, advertisement needs to be on a level peg, same as everything else as thats the basis of equality.

paradisiac · 16 Jun 2012 at 16:21

James J said:
It wasn't well received and is one of the most complained about adverts made, especially in the US. He's right though, advertisement needs to be on a level peg, same as everything else as thats the basis of equality.

and I believe it was heavily criticised in Norway too I think, or one of the Scandinavian countries. also Liverpool council banned one of their promotions for being sexist.

alexakasloth · 16 Jun 2012 at 16:36

I'm for equality, equal pay, promotion opportunities etc but wouldn't call myself a feminist because I'm not female and don't face that agenda. (To me, equality just seems normal so I'm not an activist). As far as womens magazines go I don't believe this is a feminist issue, it's about attracting a partner the same way that Men's Health conjures up an ideal man for it's readers to aspire to and then allow women to judge how well a man fits into that ideal (which judging by the ladies at work seems to be Joey Essex...sigh).
And towards the person who commented on opening doors that's just being a gentleman, the same as giving up your seat to an elderly, disabled or pregnant ladies, it's good manners and some ladies have that as well.

That's not to say everything is equal, you guys have raised the issue of paternity and law which is not something I'm experienced in or educated about so can't discuss, but it does sound interesting.