What is happening to society?

[mp260767]

Do they know the difference between right and wrong? Yes.

Do they choose to ignore this? Yes.

with a few exceptions i agree.

they know that :

a) there hardly ever likely to get reported/caught.
b) given a slap on the wrist and told not to do it again.

i'm not against re training/educating people in prison , but if there repeat offenders or make no effort to improve then they give up those rights as far as i'm concerned.

as for human rights the vast majority of the time it only seems to benifit the scumbags.

the law in this country is an ass and does more to benefit the criminals than it does the people affected by the crimes.

 

[InKursion]

This is what collapse looks like, similar was seen in the USSR, Argentina, East Asia and today in Greece.

People have been whispering about collapse since forever. It's called decadence. It crops up every 30-40 years, right before some new phase of vitality and innovation comes forward. Whilst empires and nations certainly do collapse (for a variety of reasons), more often than not culture and social life simply has a bitching and whimpering period known as decadence.

 

[shoes]

with a few exceptions i agree.

they know that :

a) there hardly ever likely to get reported/caught.
b) given a slap on the wrist and told not to do it again.

i'm not against re training/educating people in prison , but if there repeat offenders or make no effort to improve then they give up those rights as far as i'm concerned.

as for human rights the vast majority of the time it only seems to benifit the scumbags.

the law in this country is an ass and does more to benefit the criminals than it does the people affected by the crimes.

I made this point earlier - basically we do very little to deter crime and spend way too much money for very little results. In another thread I advocated the three strikes rule. I still do. If you're so ******* stupid that you commit a third crime knowing that this is the deal then society doesn't require your services and you can quite happily rot in your unheated, unlit prison cell for all I care.

Unless of course you have one of the 10, 727 mental disorders which constitute mitigation

 

[Horse Pop]

Deterrence doesn't work as well as you might imagine.

See:
The death penalty.

It's actually got far more to do with how likely people think they are to get caught.

 

[Haggisman]

Do they know the difference between right and wrong? Yes.

Do they choose to ignore this? Yes.

That's arguable.

They've been taught by their parents' actions that using violence to get your own way is "right". So while they may know the difference between "right" and "wrong", their idea of "right" and "wrong" is slightly different to yours and mine - in the end, that's all "right" and "wrong" are... ideas, who's to say which ones are correct?

trust nobody! when the politicians, mp's, councillors are corrupt then this will obviously ripple into the police f"a"rce. greed fuels nothing but violent crime and a corrupt society. Now that every major religion is being shoved into a corner and demonised their moral standards are also being forgotten as Athiasm and it's flakey and constant changing moral values are infecting us all.

What ever happened to the Britian of the 50's? People were kind, curtieous, men were gentlemen and women were ladies. Forward 50 years later there are very few gentleman and ladies. A kid would rather slam a door in an old ladies face than keep it held open for her.

Society and civillization is going down the pan until Britian starts waking up and re-instating and teaching those Christian values which Jesus tought you all thousands of years ago.

Yeah that sounds great, because "Christian values" never encouraged the drowning and burning of innocent young women, the slaughter of thousands of innocent muslims, and sexual abuse against innocent children.

Well that's hardly a problem; aside from everyone being forced to pay for it. I think it's awesome when a school assigns kids who struggle with certain things a bit of extra help in the form of a learning support person. They're usually super laid back people who I had more fun talking to than most of my peers.

It's also a problem when people who have had heavily supported learning throughout their whole lives are suddenly thrust into a situation on their own and don't know how to cope.

 

[steve-h]

In another thread I advocated the three strikes rule. I still do. If you're so ******* stupid that you commit a third crime knowing

I bet you'd let a government set the laws as well as enforce them wouldn't you?

3 rapes, fair enough. 3 times caught smoking a plant... not so much.

It's also a problem when people who have had heavily supported learning throughout their whole lives are suddenly thrust into a situation on their own and don't know how to cope.

They'll be smarter and more capable for having that support at the same time though.

 

[cosmos55]

Usually there is another reason, maybe she had a huge drug debt and that is why they beat her as well.

 

[steve-h]

Usually there is another reason, maybe she had a huge drug debt and that is why they beat her as well.

ah, drugs at fault again... just like in that bath salts zombie attack... oh wait

 

[Haggisman]

They'll be smarter and more capable for having that support at the same time though.

Oh yes, they'd be fantastic at doing whatever they'd learnt while being supported. I can't imagine they'd be particularly proficient at learning and adapting to deal with unfamiliar situations however, as they'd be used to having that support to lean on.

This was one of the things that was drummed into us at uni. What we were actually working on was irrelevant, as chances are it would be obsolete by the time we graduated. It was far more important that we learn how to learn, quickly and effectively on our own.

 

[shoes]

I bet you'd let a government set the laws as well as enforce them wouldn't you?

3 rapes, fair enough. 3 times caught smoking a plant... not so much.
.

No, it'd be limited to certain crimes and not others.

Any crime against the person would pretty much be covered - assault - all forms apart from self defence or defending your property regardless of thread to yourself, rape, murder, attempted murder, violence towards children, animals and the vulnerable, theft of anything except food, vandalising someone's or state property, causing death by wilful negligence, racism/hate crimes, robbery, mugging, burglary, benefit fraud including deliberately accepting a job offered to you when claiming JSA.. loads more but I can't be bothered to type.

People willing to carry out the above, repeatedly, should not be welcome in society.

 

[Richdog]

What of it? 50 years ago 99% of violent crime went unreported. Nowadays, say for instance, 80% of violent crime goes unreported. We are undoubtedly, through the spread of 24/7 live media coverage and an ever more hyper-connected media world, reporting far more crime. Newspapers sell more when they sell tragic stories. The television news adds a bit more drama - and hence makes its viewing figures go up - when it reports on graphic crimes in the local area, or else a scandal. It's titillating.

I'm not saying every crime is still reported. My point was that, proportionally, our media is reporting more crimes than ever before. That's part of the reason why it seems like 'society is going down the drain', even though many crime statistics - especially violent crimes and homicides - have actually been in steady decrease for years and years. Crime is actually going down but reporting of said-crime is going way up. Result? Threads like this that talk about society nearing apocalypse, even though it's statistically safer to live nowadays than ever before.

There is in my mind no doubt that many parts of the UK are worse in terms of open violence than they were 30 years ago. The increase of benefits families and single mothers pumping out directionless scrotes is well above what it was 30 years ago, and in my hometown the breakdown in community relations is very apparent and its affected much of my family. Add to that an increase in crime especially on council estates like my grandmothers (it used to be quite pleasant 15 years ago, now she's been mugged twice) where the drug trade is getting steadily busier, and despite what the MET office say about overall crime decreasing, I think that violent crime is if anything much more noticeable nowadays, increased media coverage notwithstanding.

I think the issue is a continually lowering standard of morals and what is considered acceptable to do to another person, the humanity seems to be gradually leeching its way out of the lowest common denominators.

 

[Twirlywoos]

Again you seem to be ignoring reality. Is it really the kids with parents busy persuing careers that are causing these problems?

It's one of many factors and the above was one of them. How can anyone feel safe and secure when those entrusted with power and responsibility fail in their duties?

How can David Cameron even try and build a better society when the foundations which build a better society (family values/morals and community spirit and cohesion) are rotten?

 

[Twirlywoos]

Are you actually being serious

You have absolutely NO clue what your talking about!

I worked as a youth worker for 7 years before the scummy tories made me redundant and in those 7 years I speacilized in what idiots here would call 'chav' young adults.

Over the years of working and mentoring these group of individuals it became very aware to me that the saying 'violence begets violence' is very true and significant.
Which when you think about it makes perfect sense considering millions of years of evolution has taught us we are a product of our environment.

The troubled young adults I worked with that had tags, asbos, convictions... etc for violent crimes such as ABH, GBH, robbery, criminal damage ..etc , the vast majority of them had parents that either physically, sexually or psychologically abused them!
All that does is teach young people that violence or psychological abuse is an except-able reaction/emotion and that it's the norm to behave in such a way!

So before you stark spouting ignorant nonsense again I suggest you get off your ass and do some proper research rather than being spoon feed utter dribble and bigoted ignorance from stupid papers like the daily fail and the sun

I'm not brainwashed by the gutter tabloids which is Britian's best selling newspaper.

Plus your "experiences" do not count as a physiological report for the masses so before you get emotionally biased I suggest you look at the wider picture.

 

[Haggisman]

It's one of many factors and the above was one of them. How can anyone feel safe and secure when those entrusted with power and responsibility fail in their duties?

How can David Cameron even try and build a better society when the foundations which build a better society (family values/morals and community spirit and cohesion) are rotten?

Unfortunately, at the moment parents simply can't win.

Unless you are lucky enough that one parent has a well paid job, you're left with the following scenarios:

Neither parent works and both look after the child - you teach your child that it's ok not to work as the state will pay for everything.

One parent works, the other stays home to look after the child - you don't have the money to provide the opportunities you would like, and are constantly stressing about money so can't focus on the child.

Both parents work. Ok, so you can provide a nice secure home and all the opportunities the child could ever want. Unfortunately the parents are never around.

 

[InKursion]

There is in my mind no doubt that many parts of the UK are worse in terms of open violence than they were 30 years ago. The increase of benefits families and single mothers pumping out directionless scrotes is well above what it was 30 years ago, and in my hometown the breakdown in community relations is very apparent and its affected much of my family. Add to that an increase in crime especially on council estates like my grandmothers (it used to be quite pleasant 15 years ago, now she's been mugged twice) where the drug trade is getting steadily busier, and despite what the MET office say about overall crime decreasing, I think that violent crime is if anything much more noticeable nowadays, increased media coverage notwithstanding.

I think the issue is a continually lowering standard of morals and what is considered acceptable to do to another person, the humanity seems to be gradually leeching its way out of the lowest common denominators.

Maybe in specific areas, yes, crime will undeniably go up due to poverty and dereliction, local economic depression, etc. But the thing is that the 'general impression' does not correspond to the 'general' national crime statistics, at all. Instead you have newspaper tabloids in the business of peddling scaremongering and hate articles about "single mothers and little scrotes" as you talk about - demonizing all single mothers and young youths in the process, and instilling this false sense in the grumbling older generations that "it's all going to pot!" Well, it isn't. Not according to any empirical fact.

 

[Retikulan]

No, it'd be limited to certain crimes and not others.

Any crime against the person would pretty much be covered - assault - all forms apart from self defence or defending your property regardless of thread to yourself, rape, murder, attempted murder, violence towards children, animals and the vulnerable, theft of anything except food, vandalising someone's or state property, causing death by wilful negligence, racism/hate crimes, robbery, mugging, burglary, benefit fraud including deliberately accepting a job offered to you when claiming JSA.. loads more but I can't be bothered to type.

People willing to carry out the above, repeatedly, should not be welcome in society.

Is accepting a job considered benefit fraud? Isnt accepting a job offer when claiming JSA the whole point?

 

[shoes]

Is accepting a job considered benefit fraud? Isnt accepting a job offer when claiming JSA the whole point?

Ah yes, missed out the vital 'not' accepting a job.

 

[Richdog]

Maybe in specific areas, yes, crime will undeniably go up due to poverty and dereliction, local economic depression, etc. But the thing is that the 'general impression' does not correspond to the 'general' national crime statistics, at all. Instead you have newspaper tabloids in the business of peddling scaremongering and hate articles about "single mothers and little scrotes" as you talk about - demonizing all single mothers and young youths in the process, and instilling this false sense in the grumbling older generations that "it's all going to pot!" Well, it isn't. Not according to any empirical fact.

It's hard for them not to be stereotyped when there are so many baby factories out there producing said poor scrotes who have no starting chance in life.

The nature of crime and violence has changed though, and nowadays there is much more chance of people encountering random violence, either in town centres while out drinking, or walking through dodgy parts of town at night.

Crime, violence and scrotes have always been there of course, but imo the nature of it is getting worse, with few taboos.

 

[gothic_hobbit]

blame rap music

I blame grime personally.

 

[Scotty123]

I'll blame the Tories. It's cool to do so.