A man caught doing 180mph in a police chase on the M6....!!

[rossk26]

With all this happening half a mile ahead, you have completely overlooked... braking? Changing in to another of the three, four, five etc. lanes a motorway may have? You are contriving scenarios increasingly more elaborate and unlikely, and continue to remove the several options for avoiding the accident people are providing, like the most obvious - stopping - which a car capable of 180 MPH will be able to do in a third of a mile, if not a quarter of mile.

Oh, sure, if the absolutely unbelievable happens an airship might crash in to the motorway half a mile ahead of me, my brakes simultaneously fail, and I'll crash in to it. Yup, you have me there ross, I couldn't possible get out of that one!

I have a funny feeling this 'scenario' is going to start occuring closer than half a mile now..

When did I say the car spun out half a mile ahead of you?

 

[PMKeates]

And those of us who have done vmax on the autobahn know that things don't always happen in the distance, they can happen much closer, like your ever so nice German lorry pulling out for no reason.

But that's only on a busyish road.....

To be honest you've actually highlighted the biggest hazard - someone just pulling out very close in front of you, not half a mile ahead while a meteorite simultaneously destroys all the other lanes.

 

[InvaderGIR]

"police accident investigator"

You can take up your proof with him.

As for your photo, that looks like the size of a dog, you do not know and I don't either know the size of the deer my colleage hit. Right now, I am taking the words of the police over yours.

I think that is perfectly fair. Unless you go out and hit a big deer doing 150mph, come back and tell me in person it was survivable.

Most deer that you'll see in the UK are around the size of a large dog, they are not the size of a horse (which you appear to be implying they are). Part of the reason that looks like the size of a dog is that it is mashed around the engine, there isn't much deer left.

He would have been if the deer hit the windscreen rather than the front bumper / grill, people die in places such as Canada due to hitting elk, whilst larger than a small deer it's not hard to see an adult doing enough damage to kill you.

I'm not denying the chances of it happening, but on a motorway etc. the likelihood of the deer hitting the screen before the bonnet is much lower than on smaller roads. I've seen the damage a deer does to cars first hand, the E60 would survive a lot better than the cars I've seen hit them.

 

[Philz0r]

looks sort of like a fox, furry.

 

[PMKeates]

When did I say the car spun out half a mile ahead of you?

You don't even surprise me now.

"police accident investigator"

You can take up your proof with him.

As for your photo, that looks like the size of a dog, you do not know and I don't either know the size of the deer my colleage hit. Right now, I am taking the words of the police over yours.

I think that is perfectly fair. Unless you go out and hit a big deer doing 150mph, come back and tell me in person it was survivable.

The police accident investigator from which you do not have a first hand account whom you have probably invented to support your particular stance in this argument, can jog on, to be honest.

At a 180mph there is a much higher chance of someone doing something unexpected, a much higher chance of you not reacting to this quick enough, a much higher chance of your car not slowing down quick enough, a much higher chance of you hitting the vehicle, a much higher chance of you killing occupants of both vehicles, and should you avoid them there is a much higher chance of you losing control and the car hitting something else (yes, even with DSC activated).

It isn’t rocket science, as the speed increases, the risk does also. At more modest speeds, such as 100-120mph, this increased risk can be significantly mitigated by only doing these speeds when the traffic is low, the weather is clear, the car is suitable and when you know the road. As you climb in speed, this stuff starts being outweighed by the risk of other people doing something stupid, as you are far more at the mercy of other people’s cars and driving than your own.

I agree to some extent; it's certainly harder to maintain very high speed in safety than very low speed. It just isn't impossible, and it's done every single day by many people without any great risk.

 

[Firestar_3x]

To be honest you've actually highlighted the biggest hazard - someone just pulling out very close in front of you, not half a mile ahead while a meteorite simultaneously destroys all the other lanes.

Yep, but 9 times out of 10 you've assessed his driving before you get too close / pass him so you've got a good idea if he's going to do something stupid or not.

 

[rossk26]

Very low probability of that happening though.

Happened to me, and I've only been driving 6 years. Had I been doing anything excess of 100mph, both myself, my girlfriend and the occupants of the vehicle which just spun in front would have died.

I've also witnessed a pile up too. But hopefully PMKeates would know better than to do triple figures on certain roads...

Actually

 

[InvaderGIR]

looks sort of like a fox, furry.

A fox would go under the car (I know from experience ) and they don't have anywhere near that much pelt. That is a deer as is backed up by the statement from the driver of the BMW when it was reported a few years ago.

 

[Raymond Lin]

Most deer that you'll see in the UK are around the size of a large dog, they are not the size of a horse (which you appear to be implying they are). Part of the reason that looks like the size of a dog is that it is mashed around the engine, there isn't much deer left.

When deer run, or jump, they leap, and gain height....hot ot. over bonnet, in your face.

Sure, it is a probability and not an absolute certainty. But would you rather stop in time than risk it? You seem to suggest, from 1 photo, that hitting a deer will mean it will be absorb by the engine.

Well, it didn't with the Q7, it "flew"!

 

[Firestar_3x]

not denying the chances of it happening, but on a motorway etc. the likelihood of the deer hitting the screen before the bonnet is much lower than on smaller roads. I've seen the damage a deer does to cars first hand, the E60 would survive a lot better than the cars I've seen hit them.

Yep, the larger deer are in parks etc anyway, reason they hit the windscreen first is due to leg length, if you hit one side on you sweep the legs out from under them and they come up over the bonnet etc.

 

[Gaygle]

And those of us who have done vmax on the autobahn know that things don't always happen in the distance, they can happen much closer, like your ever so nice German lorry pulling out for no reason.

But that's only on a busyish road.....

Exactly, which is why i had no idea where this 1/2mile argument came from! And that's in Germany where the lane discipline on motorways is far far greater than ours.

Vicky Pollard in her trashed Citroen Saxo with one mirror, with a cigarette in one hand, doing makeup with the other and with 3 kids in the car, rushing to get them to school isn't going to expect Mr 180mph RS5 driver caning it down the motorway.

I've had enough close shaves at 70-80mph let alone adding a ton of extra speed onto that.

 

[PMKeates]

Well, it didn't with the Q7, it "flew"!

Oh, so you have such a detailed account of this Q7 accident you know exactly what the deer did? Are you the police accident investigator?

Yep, but 9 times out of 10 you've assessed his driving before you get too close / pass him so you've got a good idea if he's going to do something stupid or not.

If you are driving at very high speed you cannot drive along in your own world - you have to be constantly looking at everything. It's quite hard work. So yes, assessing the road attitude of other vehicles is key.

I've had enough close shaves at 70-80mph let alone adding a ton of extra speed onto that.

But were those close shaves at 70-80 in the sort of scenarios where anyone would consider doing 180? I've had near misses at 80, but that's not to say I'd be doing 180 if I could have...

 

[Gaygle]

Please, enough with the deers, foxes, badgers and dogs on the motorway.

I've seen more bicycles laying in a lane on the motorway than i've seen animals.

 

[Firestar_3x]

Happened to me, and I've only been driving 6 years. Had I been doing anything excess of 100mph, both myself, my girlfriend and the occupants of the vehicle which just spun in front would have died.

I've also witnessed a pile up too. But hopefully PMKeates would know better than to do triple figures on certain roads...

Actually

I've had a truck come the the central reservation at me, however this once in 140k or whatever I've done over 11 years, It's all about probability of that event happening combined with your time at risk.

 

[InvaderGIR]

When deer run, or jump, they leap, and gain height....hot ot. over bonnet, in your face.

Sure, it is a probability and not an absolute certainty. But would you rather stop in time than risk it? You seem to suggest, from 1 photo, that hitting a deer will mean it will be absorb by the engine.

Well, it didn't with the Q7, it "flew"!

I never said that just that photo is evidence? I've had first hand experience with cars that have hit deer and on numerous occasions have also experienced deer jumping about in front of me when travelling at speed. I'm not new to this situation at all.

Generally speaking the deer will hit the front grill and bounce off provided it isn't mid jump when you collide with it. If it hits the front grill the car will stop extra quickly and have the front end mashed in, the deer will likely get up and walk off.

Deer don't fly so I'm unsure on what you're on about there.

 

[Raymond Lin]

You don't even surprise me now.The police accident investigator from which you do not have a first hand account whom you have probably invented to support your particular stance in this argument, can jog on, to be honest..

Your argument is calling me a liar?

Lol, I do hope that your next accident don't land on my desk. I really do. That, i am being serious, as much as I detest your attitude right now, I really do hope you don't get into an accident, it won't be pretty in your speed.

 

[Philz0r]

i bought up the half mile thing a few pages back. at the time it just seemed like a good basis to form a "what if"rather then go straight for the plane crashes and wild bull stampeeds senarios

 

[InvaderGIR]

i bought up the half mile thing a few pages back. at the time it just seemed like a good basis to form a "what if"rather then go straight for the plane crashes and wild bull stampeeds senarios

I tend to find low flying trains a right PITA when I do 250mph down the M5.

 

[Gaygle]

I agree to some extent; it's certainly harder to maintain very high speed in safety than very low speed. It just isn't impossible, and it's done every single day by many people without any great risk.

Just because a very very very small percentage people manage to do very high speeds on the motorway every day without incident, doesn't mean "there is no great risk". The higher risk factors don't magically disappear, these people just get lucky that nothing unexpected happens when they are doing this speed.

 

[PMKeates]

Your argument is calling me a liar?

Lol, I do hope that your next accident don't land on my desk. I really do. That, i am being serious, as much as I detest your attitude right now, I really do hope you don't get into an accident, it won't be pretty in your speed.

No, I'm highlighting that you have entered this debate with second-hand experience of someone who has never invesitgated a car travelling at 150 MPH hitting a deer, talking to someone about if they had a smaller car instead of a Q7 they might have died.

Just because a very very very small percentage people manage to do very high speeds on the motorway every day without incident, doesn't mean "there is no great risk". The higher risk factors don't magically disappear, these people just get lucky that nothing unexpected happens when they are doing this speed.

I stand behind there is "no great risk". I agree with you that there are higher risk factors, but you can somewhat mitigate them, and they aren't so high as to consider the action unsafe.