Strict Liability Law - Drivers to be auto blamed for all accidents with cyclists

[Deleted member 66701]

the idea that those most likely to cause injury or loss of life take more care around those more vulnerable than them.

You shouldn't need legislation to state that though (which is obvious). More education is needed.

As I said - if people were nicer to each other (and if both cyclists AND motorists were willing to be in less of a rush) we wouldn't have this "conflict".

 

[Swordfish]

How about pedestrians?

I've had three offs resulting in road rash and damage to bikes as a direct result of pedestrians using crossings when the red man was showing.

If you had insurance you would then use the legal section to pursue therm through the courts.

yup! i got 2 parts broken on my bike by pedestrians running into me wherez MY MONEY SUCKAAAs!!

Where you on the road or the pavement? How did they run into you?

Everyone must be made to be accountable for their actions on the road, Car drivers, Bike riders, cyclists, scooters etc.

As a car driver one of my biggest hates is when sitting in traffic I see cyclists and motorbikes weaving in and out to get to the front. Then the cyclists get off the bike and push it through the lights or usually just ride right onto the pavement and through a crowd of pedestrians who are walking where they should be !

 

[rogan]

If you had insurance you would then use the legal section to pursue therm through the courts.



Where you on the road or the pavement? How did they run into you?

Everyone must be made to be accountable for their actions on the road, Car drivers, Bike riders, cyclists, scooters etc.

As a car driver one of my biggest hates is when sitting in traffic I see cyclists and motorbikes weaving in and out to get to the front. Then the cyclists get off the bike and push it through the lights or usually just ride right onto the pavement and through a crowd of pedestrians who are walking where they should be !

The problem is they just walk away, what can you do to stop them? Once they're gone they're gone then you cant hold anyone accountable.

If you hit a ped/cyclist with a car, chances are they aren't going anywhere wether its their fault of not,

most incidents i;ve had with peds walking out on me have left me in the **** and they just carry on their way

 

[Swordfish]

The problem is they just walk away, what can you do to stop them? Once they're gone they're gone then you cant hold anyone accountable.

If you hit a ped/cyclist with a car, chances are they aren't going anywhere wether its their fault of not,

most incidents i;ve had with peds walking out on me have left me in the **** and they just carry on their way

Do you wear a helmet cam?

There is a lot in this thread that I agree with and a lot that I don't and to be honest most cyclists on the road are a bigger danger to themselves than they are from me as are other road users due to how they fail to observe the basic rules of the road.

If everyone simply paid a bit more attention, knew the laws of the orad and had more patience then things would be a lot better.

I for one would not be happy to be automatically guilty just because I was driving a car and someone else was riding a bike.

Time for a dash cam methinks.

 

[grudas]

Where you on the road or the pavement? How did they run into you?

Everyone must be made to be accountable for their actions on the road, Car drivers, Bike riders, cyclists, scooters etc.

As a car driver one of my biggest hates is when sitting in traffic I see cyclists and motorbikes weaving in and out to get to the front. Then the cyclists get off the bike and push it through the lights or usually just ride right onto the pavement and through a crowd of pedestrians who are walking where they should be !

no way would i ride on the pavement one girl ran into me out of nowhere - i was maybe doing 8-10mph approaching a red light, ready to stop.. and she just jumped of the pathway and right into the side of my bike.. she managed to stuff her umbrella into my back wheel which then pushed it up and broke my mudguard.. she pulled it off and ran off! i didn't even have time to see what happened..

30 quid down the drain.

2nd one was an old lady who literally crossed the road without looking and i smashed into her and bent my bars.. thank god both times i managed to get away without a mark on me..

but both parts needed replacing and what can i do to them? chase them? beat them up? no way am i getting repaired what was broken.

 

[rogan]

Do you wear a helmet cam?

There is a lot in this thread that I agree with and a lot that I don't and to be honest most cyclists on the road are a bigger danger to themselves than they are from me as are other road users due to how they fail to observe the basic rules of the road.

If everyone simply paid a bit more attention, knew the laws of the orad and had more patience then things would be a lot better.

I for one would not be happy to be automatically guilty just because I was driving a car and someone else was riding a bike.

Time for a dash cam methinks.

Nope, because splashing £200 on something I don't want seems stupid, I'd rather spend £200 on many many other things before that.

I agree with you on some points, but if your getting at me paying more attention I'm not sure how a guy at a ped crossing, hes got a red, on his phone, doesn't look at all, just decides to start crossing (i guess he couldnt hear any cars) and walks right into my front wheel is in anyway my fault,

He gets winded by my bars, I get a £200 of damage, he looks at me, decides if it was his fault, obviously was, walks off.

Camera footage wouldn't have helped me there.

Cyclists are definitely at more danger from drivers than they are themselves, to make that assumption your assuming all cyclists break the rules.

 

[Orcish-Horde]

Stumbled across this belter on BBC News -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-22155209

A group (Campaign for Strict Liability) are wanting to get this law passed at least in Scotland to begin with.

Personally I think its wrong. A driver is presumed guilty and has to prove their innocence by proving the guilt of the cyclist instead. That just turns the whole "Innocent until proven guilty" aspect of law on its head.


They say it will reduce accidents. I will leave this quote from the Campaign for Strict Liability:




So is it to reduce accidents or just to get compensation?

Well the likely out come regardless of guilt will be an injured or die cyclist. Given that some drivers are a danger to all around them its only right that they are presumed guilty until they can prove other wise. Time to start fitting all cars with 360 video recordings.

 

[[DOD]Asprilla]

If you had insurance you would then use the legal section to pursue therm through the courts.

I have insurance. Most of the cyclists in this thread have stated that they have insurance. You are usually covered in the personal liability section of your house and contents.

In case you missed it I was making a point about cyclists being insured and identifiable and yet no-one is calling for the same for pedestrians when they too cause accidents.

As a car driver one of my biggest hates is when sitting in traffic I see cyclists and motorbikes weaving in and out to get to the front. Then the cyclists get off the bike and push it through the lights or usually just ride right onto the pavement and through a crowd of pedestrians who are walking where they should be !

As a cyclist, on of my biggest hates is cars who take stupid risks to get past or overtake too close when they are only going to get stopped at the next set of lights where I will filter past them again.

Nothing wrong with dismounting and pushing the bike though the lights. As soon as you are dismounted you are a pedestrian.

 

[Tefal]

I

As a car driver one of my biggest hates is when sitting in traffic I see cyclists and motorbikes weaving in and out to get to the front. !

filtering on a motorcycle is perfectly legal.

of course it should only be done when safe.

 

[Tefal]

anyone got a link to those little keyring sd card camera s that were popular on here a while back iiirc they were about 20 quid an pretty decent for a bike cam/car cam

 

[[DOD]Asprilla]

anyone got a link to those little keyring sd card camera s that were popular on here a while back iiirc they were about 20 quid an pretty decent for a bike cam/car cam

The main downside is their poor performance in low light and unfortunately it's in those conditions that you'd probably need it most.

 

[Swordfish]

As a cyclist, on of my biggest hates is cars who take stupid risks to get past or overtake too close when they are only going to get stopped at the next set of lights where I will filter past them again.

Nothing wrong with dismounting and pushing the bike though the lights. As soon as you are dismounted you are a pedestrian.

Which are you a cyclist or a pedestrian? It seems that many cyclists are wanting it both ways. If you are cycling to a destination then remain a cyclist until you reach your destination and store your bike accordingly.

Wonder what the reaction would be if I stopped my car at a red light got out and pushed it through.

 

[Swordfish]

filtering on a motorcycle is perfectly legal.

of course it should only be done when safe.

Pushing through minute gaps with their boots etc scraping my car. It happens.

 

[rogan]

Swordfish your logic is ridiculous

 

[[DOD]Asprilla]

Which are you a cyclist or a pedestrian? It seems that many cyclists are wanting it both ways. If you are cycling to a destination then remain a cyclist until you reach your destination and store your bike accordingly.

Wonder what the reaction would be if I stopped my car at a red light got out and pushed it through.

I switch between both by dismounting though I prefer not to as it ruins my cleats. Not sure what your issue with it is other than the fact you can't do the same in your car.

 

[Swordfish]

Swordfish your logic is ridiculous

Thank you for your statement. Care to elaborate?

 

[Swordfish]

I switch between both by dismounting though I prefer not to as it ruins my cleats. Not sure what your issue with it is other than the fact you can't do the same in your car.

My issue is that many, many cyclist believe themselves to be above the laws of the road and they want it both ways.

 

[[DOD]Asprilla]

My issue is that many, many cyclist believe themselves to be above the laws of the road and they want it both ways.

So why didn't you give an example instead of something that is not above the laws of the road?

Can I raise the issue of speeding, the large number of uninsured cars on the road, amber gambling and a list of other things as long as my arm, or would that be off topic?

Pushing through minute gaps with their boots etc scraping my car. It happens.

So we agree that vandalism is wrong but filtering isn't vandalism.

I don't think I've every actually seen a car get scratched by a filtering cyclist / motorcylist / mopedist and yet it seems to have happened to almost everyone on the internet who isn't one of those things.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

Which are you a cyclist or a pedestrian?

If you're riding a bike, then you're a cyclist. If you're pushing the bike you're a pedestrian (apart from some obscure legislation in the case of Public Rights of Way designated as footpaths).

It's not rocket science.

There's a left turn TL controlled junction on my commute that if I get there at the wrong time I could be sat there a while waiting for the light to go green so instead I just cycle into the ASL area and push my bike round the corner on the footpath and re-mount on the road. Perfectly legal and I've even done it in front of a copper, who commended me on not just riding through the red light!

My issue is that many, many cyclist believe themselves to be above the laws of the road and they want it both ways.

But dismounting and pushing a bike on the footpath isn't against the law! In fact the Highway code even recommends it in some instances!

Roundabouts (76 to 78)

77
You may feel safer walking your cycle round on the pavement or verge.

Wonder what the reaction would be if I stopped my car at a red light got out and pushed it through.

I'd like to see you try but:-

1: You'd still be a person in charge of a motorised vehicle
2: and according to one you could be charged with all the offences attributed to driving through a red light.

My summary of this thread from Swordfish's contributions:-

Regular cyclists know more about the rules of the road than motorists that don't cycle often!

 

[mufc802]

The proposed law is a bad idea but maybe harsher penalties should be given for dangerous drivers. You can get dangerous cyclists but they are highly unlikely to kill anyone but themselves which is why they can get away with minor breaks of the highway code. On the other hand, a driver going through a red light is absolutely unacceptable for obvious reasons.

Also why does everyone keep going on about helmets, its a personal choice and there's a reason its not compulsorily - same with headphones. I like to listen to music when commuting and sod anyone who disagree's as long as I can hear emergency sirens then what is the problem?