Graphics card help please

ByronicHero · 12 May 2013 at 12:06

Hello.

Recently I started to have black screen freezes when playing games which were "fixable" only by turning my PC on and off again. Re-installing drivers didn't work and it wasn't a temperature issue as far as the evidence suggested so I removed my graphics card (geforce 430) and tried playing some games on the integrated graphics to see if that fixed the problem. It appears to have, so this has necessitated my replacing the card.

I do enjoy some gaming but don't need to be able to play everything on high graphics settings though I would like to be able to play most games smoothly at some graphics level.

My computer is modest (i3 2100 @ 3.10GHz) and I am happy to spend up to 100 - 150 pound for a card that would be worth it.

So essentially I am asking for suggestions. I have done some cursory research but I am very farm from being an expert.

Many thanks in advance.

Gregster · 12 May 2013 at 12:27

I would look for a 7850 or 660. Both of those will be ideal for a bit of light or even heavy gaming. The I3 could be a bottleneck but not something worth worrying too much over.

LtMatt · 12 May 2013 at 12:32

I'd recommend either a 7790 or a 650ti maximum with that cpu as any higher will be a bottleneck. I've seen a 7850 get bottlenecked in sleeping dogs which is a gpu limited game with an i3 sandy bridge processor overclocked.

Gregster · 12 May 2013 at 12:45

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-fx-pentium-apu-benchmark,3120.html

Worth a read to see what a bottleneck is and how it works. Some interesting results.

LtMatt · 12 May 2013 at 12:57

Worth a read to see how a faster i3 with HT bottlenecked a 7850 in several games.

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18497496

Just be aware OP that if you do get a 7850 or equal gpu it will never get used to its full potential in games as the person linked above was getting bottlenecked with an i3 3220 and that had hyper threading enabled giving it an extra 2 threads over your cpu. In games which benefit from more than 2 physical cores you won't be stressing your gpu much imo.

mickyflinn · 12 May 2013 at 13:04

The biggest gain will from a new gpu and for your price range The 650ti boost 2gb version is what to get.

YOUR BASKET
1 x Gainward GeForce GTX 650Ti Boost Golden Sample 2048MB GDDR5
PCI-Express Graphics Card £137.99
Total : £148.79 (includes shipping : £9.00).

Best Graphics Cards For The Money: April 2013

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/gaming-graphics-card-review,review-32671.html

LtMatt · 12 May 2013 at 13:10

mickyflinn said:
The biggest gain will from a new gpu and for your price range The 650ti boost 2gb version is what to get.

YOUR BASKET
1 x Gainward GeForce GTX 650Ti Boost Golden Sample 2048MB GDDR5
PCI-Express Graphics Card £137.99
Total : £148.79 (includes shipping : £9.00).

Best Graphics Cards For The Money: April 2013

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/gaming-graphics-card-review,review-32671.html

+1

The 650ti is a bit faster than a 7790 but either card will suit your processor well.

ByronicHero · 12 May 2013 at 13:12

LtMatt said:
I'd recommend either a 7790 or a 650ti maximum with that cpu as any higher will be a bottleneck. I've seen a 7850 get bottlenecked in sleeping dogs which is a gpu limited game with an i3 sandy bridge processor overclocked.

Gregster said:
I would look for a 7850 or 660. Both of those will be ideal for a bit of light or even heavy gaming. The I3 could be a bottleneck but not something worth worrying too much over.

Thanks both of you for the advice.

There is some chance that I will update my CPU at a later date if it seemed necessary so I don't want to invest in a card I am likely to want to replace but of course I also don't want to unnecessarily waste my money. If spending 20 more pound or close is going to offer any significant improvement then that seems like a reasonable investment.

I wish I were more informed about all of this really but I've only recently started trying to learn everything and there is of course plenty to learn! For example, searching the cards suggested on overclokers yielded various - to my eyes similar, if not identical - results so I am not necessarily sure which exactly is being recommended. I am certain this is due to my incompetence and not any lack of clarity on your parts but any more guidance would be appreciated.

Thanks again.

mickyflinn · 12 May 2013 at 13:14

Get the 650ti boost Reading the link i posted should clarify that.

LtMatt · 12 May 2013 at 13:16

If you do plan to upgrade your cpu then a 7850 or 660 will be a fine choice but an i3 will definitely hold those cards back in the majority of todays games. Otherwise the 650ti looks the best buy for your system.

ByronicHero · 12 May 2013 at 13:16

mickyflinn said:
The biggest gain will from a new gpu and for your price range The 650ti boost 2gb version is what to get.

YOUR BASKET
1 x Gainward GeForce GTX 650Ti Boost Golden Sample 2048MB GDDR5
PCI-Express Graphics Card £137.99
Total : £148.79 (includes shipping : £9.00).

Best Graphics Cards For The Money: April 2013

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/gaming-graphics-card-review,review-32671.html

LtMatt said:
+1

The 650ti is a bit faster than a 7790 but either card will suit your processor well.

That works for my price range, and certainly looks more impressive than my old 430

If this is the consensus opinion that I am happy to go with it.

On a slightly different note: when I was cleaning the dust out of my unit to ensure that temperature issues were not what was causing the crashes I accidentally wiped most of the thermal paste away - is it necessary for me to buy some and reapply a layer/where do I get it from.

Thanks.

mickyflinn · 12 May 2013 at 13:19

ByronicHero said:
On a slightly different note: when I was cleaning the dust out of my unit to ensure that temperature issues were not what was causing the crashes I accidentally wiped most of the thermal paste away - is it necessary for me to buy some and reapply a layer/where do I get it from.

Thanks.

I would

YOUR BASKET
1 x Gainward GeForce GTX 650Ti Boost Golden Sample 2048MB GDDR5 PCI-Express Graphics Card £137.99
1 x Arctic Silver Céramique 2 Thermal Paste (2.7g) £2.99
Total : £151.78 (includes shipping : £9.00).

Gregster · 12 May 2013 at 13:22

LtMatt said:
Worth a read to see how a faster i3 with HT bottlenecked a 7850 in several games.

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18497496

Just be aware OP that if you do get a 7850 or equal gpu it will never get used to its full potential in games as the person linked above was getting bottlenecked with an i3 3220 and that had hyper threading enabled giving it an extra 2 threads over your cpu. In games which benefit from more than 2 physical cores you won't be stressing your gpu much imo.

It will never get used to its full potential is very wrong. There isn't that many games that use all the cores and it is only of late that game devs have started to use more CPU cores. In some instances it will be a bottleneck but in the biggest majority of games, it will not hinder it at all.

Take this Assassins Creed 3 bench results with a 690 and various chips.

As you can see, a GTX 690 (a £900 GPU) is being held back by 10 fps on the minimum. I would happily use an I3 with either a 7850 or a 660 and not worry about the odd 1 or 2 fps in the very rare games.

I do wish people wouldn't scaremonger and blow things massively out of spec so much

LtMatt · 12 May 2013 at 13:56

Not sure what planet you live on Greg.

Up to you OP but i think id go the advice Mickey and myself offered.

~>Dg<~ · 12 May 2013 at 14:05

personally i would get a second hand i5 2500k for 100 quid and sell you cpu and put that money to the other 50 quid and get a second hand ati 6950 or 560 ti

a lot better all round.

BAMBI · 12 May 2013 at 14:55

What power supply do you have?

From your description its not definitive that the problem is your graphics card (even though its most likely).

You may also need a new PSU for the GPUs being suggested so worth factoring that cost in.

Kaapstad · 12 May 2013 at 15:21

LtMatt said:
Not sure what planet you live on Greg.

Up to you OP but i think id go the advice Mickey and myself offered.

I think you guys have picked the wrong card to compare on those platforms. The GTX 690 is the only high end Nvidia card that will run PCIe 3.0 out of the box on X79 which does tend to skew the results. The 2600k, 2700k and 3770k are better CPUs to game on than anything on X79. I would be a little concerned if someone produced a graph showing a HD 7970 or Titan running better on X79 than the other setups.

Gregster · 12 May 2013 at 15:27

Gregster said:
I would look for a 7850 or 660. Both of those will be ideal for a bit of light or even heavy gaming. The I3 could be a bottleneck but not something worth worrying too much over.

LtMatt said:
Not sure what planet you live on Greg.

Up to you OP but i think id go the advice Mickey and myself offered.

A 7850 isn't going to bottleneck anywhere near like a 690. Not sure what you are out to prove but telling the OP to only get a max of a 650TI or a 7790 is poor advice.

Ohhh and Tomb Raider on a I3 2100 with a 7970 looks fine to me.

ByronicHero · 12 May 2013 at 15:29

BAMBI said:
What power supply do you have?

From your description its not definitive that the problem is your graphics card (even though its most likely).

You may also need a new PSU for the GPUs being suggested so worth factoring that cost in.

I have no idea actually. What would indicate that I would need to replace it?

Indeed, although as the problem stopped once I took out the card I assumed that was a reasonable indication. This approach leaves plenty of room for me to be wrong but I didn't really know how else to begin trying to fix the problem.

Kaapstad · 12 May 2013 at 15:40

There is something very strange about those graphs, the 3930k and 2600k are both basically sandy bridge. The difference is the 2600k is clocked higher and has a slightly more efficient performance per core. So the question is why is the 2600k getting beat by the 3930k. Have the reviewers got their test rigs setup fairly and correctly.