Radical benefits shake-up

If someone can sit on his **** all day and make more money than I do working full time, then it's clearly dodgy system. About time they looked into fixing it.
 
spankingtexan said:
And that is why salary must rise, Rent and council tax levels are killing all, this race to the bottom is absurd, I'm amazed so many people fall for it.
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Lol and you've fallen for hippie rubbish
Yeah just raise wages, where's the money for that coming from? Increase uk corporation expenditure even more compared to most of the world, that'll be fantastic for our economy.

We have to cut tax buren so people have more money, things can be simplified thus wasting less money think scrapping VED and similar and combining them into other taxes, running departments more effectively, spending less in certain areas, increasing expenditure in areas with a high return potential. That's the trouble discusing things like this, its all interwoven.
Also simplify tax and benefits, tax free allowance of say £20k then flat 40% tax.
 
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Erm glaucus putting words into people mouths again...
all I did was say a fact I never mentioned any hippy rubbish about raising wages.....

if anything your falling for tory rubbish thinking people on benefits get more money than someone working full time..

the only time it may be true is with families where only 1 person works.
but then if you take into account child tax credits , working tax credits etc..... it's an entirely different story
 
arknor said:
Erm glaucus putting words into people mouths again...
all I did was say a fact I never mentioned any hippy rubbish about raising wages.....

if anything your falling for tory rubbish thinking people on benefits get more money than someone working full time..

the only time it may be true is with families where only 1 person works.
but then if you take into account child tax credits , working tax credits etc..... it's an entirely different story
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Think your flogging a dead horse mate, the Government has cast its spell :D
 
arknor said:
Erm glaucus putting words into people mouths again...
all I did was say a fact I never mentioned any hippy rubbish about raising wages.....

if anything your falling for tory rubbish thinking people on benefits get more money than someone working full time..

the only time it may be true is with families where only 1 person works.
but then if you take into account child tax credits , working tax credits etc..... it's an entirely different story
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Or you know making a mistaking and pressing the wrong quote button.
Pretty obvious is was meant fir the post above yours as it makes no says with your post.

Single working people are not generally allowed any benefits. I also realise few will be on that, it needs to be capped a lot lower than that for single people.
So having a cap at almist 23k is insane, hardly fallen fir government is it.
 
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What's going to happen if the idiots General Population suddenly wake up and realise that it's not high benefits but actually their low wages and high cost of living (Housing especially) and greedy taxes that they should actually be aggrieved about?

Only in the UK could someone working on low wages moan someone on benefits was getting more money than them and instead of being smart and asking for more wages or less taxes they want something taking away from someone else which won't be of any benefit to them whatsoever, do you really think the Govt. is going to tax you less if they save any money?
 
Glaucus said:
Or you know making a mistaking and pressing the wrong quote button.
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erm for some reason I could hav sore you quoted me? did you ninja edit after quoting me by accident?
if not the heat must be getting to me and I should take a break.
Single working people are not generally allowed any benefits. I also realise few will be on that, it needs to be capped a lot lower than that for single people.
So having a cap at almist 23k is insane, hardly fallen fir government is it.
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if they earn under a certain amount they can get working tax credits, council tax reductions and I'd expect a contribution towards their housing benefit if they are really in need of it.

https://www.gov.uk/working-tax-credit/overview
1. Overview

You could get Working Tax Credit if:

you’re aged 16 or over
you work a certain number of hours a week
you get paid for the work you do (or expect to)
your income is below a certain level

The basic amount of Working Tax Credit is up to £1,920 a year - you could get more (or less) depending on your circumstances and income.
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https://www.gov.uk/housing-benefit/overview
1. Overview

You could get Housing Benefit to help you pay your rent if you’re on a low income.

Housing Benefit can pay for part or all of your rent. How much you get depends on your income and circumstances.

You can apply for Housing Benefit whether you’re unemployed or working.
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It's not you (glaucus) who appears to be saying people working get less money than people who don't anyway.
and I agree a cap to high is insane.
 
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Glaucus said:
Lol and you've fallen for hippie rubbish
Yeah just raise wages, where's the money for that coming from? Increase uk corporation expenditure even more compared to most of the world, that'll be fantastic for our economy.

We have to cut tax buren so people have more money, things can be simplified thus wasting less money think scrapping VED and similar and combining them into other taxes, running departments more effectively, spending less in certain areas, increasing expenditure in areas with a high return potential. That's the trouble discusing things like this, its all interwoven.
Also simplify tax and benefits, tax free allowance of say £20k then flat 40% tax.
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Whatever dude, rising costs of living but stagnant salary is becoming unsustainable, the working population are now having to rely on benefits to top up their pathetic salaries, salaries I might add are still well above benefit levels, you are just falling for Tory propaganda who's only aim is to punish the poor so they can have a larger slice of the cake.
 
The divide and conquer tactics being used by the Conservatives is brilliant, it's almost Machiavellian in nature.

They've managed, by spin, to turn the working poor and the working middle classes against the non-working poor.

The National Assistance Act 1948 is an Act of Parliament passed in the United Kingdom by the Labour government of Clement Attlee. It formally abolished the Poor Law system that had existed since the reign of Elizabeth I,and established a social safety net for those who did not pay National Insurance contributions (such as the homeless, the physically handicapped, and unmarried mothers) and were therefore left uncovered by the National Insurance Act 1946 and the National Insurance (Industrial Injuries) Act 1946. It also provided help to elderly Britons who required supplementary benefits to make a subsistence living, and obliged local authorities to provide suitable accommodation for those who through infirmity, age, or any other reason were in need of care and attention not otherwise available. The legislation also empowered local authorities to grant aid voluntary bodies concerned with the provision of recreational facilities or meals.
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Clement Attle is probably turning in his grave. Yes, something needs to be done about the total expenditure on benefits. People should always be encouraged to work and should be better off working, however it would be shameful for society to uproot families or plunge them into poverty.

I don't see a problem with my taxes supporting those in need. However I don't demonise everybody on benefits as being scum (as Robgmun so ineloquently put)

Carry on.
 
doofer said:
What's going to happen if the idiots General Population suddenly wake up and realise that it's not high benefits but actually their low wages and high cost of living (Housing especially) and greedy taxes that they should actually be aggrieved about?

Only in the UK could someone working on low wages moan someone on benefits was getting more money than them and instead of being smart and asking for more wages or less taxes they want something taking away from someone else which won't be of any benefit to them whatsoever, do you really think the Govt. is going to tax you less if they save any money?
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Gob smacking enit. ;)
 
arknor said:
they don't but people like to make out they do.
usually they don't count tax credits etc as benefits :rolleyes: or part of their "wage"
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Oh really, what about me I'm on about £9000 a year and that's a bit lower than cap. I wonder if I'm better off quitting work at 19 and just knocking up some local chav.
 
MikeTheNative said:
Oh really, what about me I'm on about £9000 a year and that's a bit lower than cap. I wonder if I'm better off quitting work at 19 and just knocking up some local chav.
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did you check if you are eligible for working tax credits or housing benefit?
I can guarantee you won't be better off unemployed.
Even people with a disability are better off working because DLA is not means tested
 
doofer said:
What's going to happen if the idiots General Population suddenly wake up and realise that it's not high benefits but actually their low wages and high cost of living (Housing especially) and greedy taxes that they should actually be aggrieved about?
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They won't. The Government has put a lot of effort into the spin making everything the fault of those on benefits. Your average Joe on the street has swallowed this hook,line and sinker.

Only in the UK could someone working on low wages moan someone on benefits was getting more money than them
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Most of the thousands of jobs that have been created recently are minimum wage jobs. Tells you something.
 
MikeTheNative said:
Oh really, what about me I'm on about £9000 a year and that's a bit lower than cap. I wonder if I'm better off quitting work at 19 and just knocking up some local chav.
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Well, if you're on £9000 a year and live on your own then it's almost certain you're claiming benefits and not paying tax, maybe you're at home with parents who pick up the bulk of the household bills.
 
It tells us nothing because people on minimum wage are likely eligible for working tax credits and part of there rent via housing benefit....

quit your job and tell us how much better off you would be on minimum wage please.....
Tory people convinced all you naive people that people on minimum wage get no benefits...... when a lot of them do
If anything it shows the minimum wage is a joke and to low or the government wouldn't have to subsidise peoples wages
 
spankingtexan said:
Well, if you're on £9000 a year and live on your own then it's almost certain you're claiming benefits and not paying tax, maybe you're at home with parents who pick up the bulk of the household bills.
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Yes I am living at home, but it is depressing that I'm working 40 hours a week and some lazy t**t could be getting almost double the amount of money I do for just turning up to the job centre once every two weeks.
 
arknor said:
It tells us nothing because people on minimum wage are likely eligible for working tax credits and part of there rent via housing benefit....
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It tells that people in those jobs need help from the Government to stay afloat yet these same people are the ones, in general, bemoaning those who don't work getting benefits to keep them off the breadline.

Even some middle class people rely on benefits (mostly child benefit) to prevent them from struggling given the cost of housing/living. Yet these people also bemoan* those who aren't working from getting a similar safety net.


* Don't get me started on the right-wing nature of this forum! :p
 
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