Who here is a teacher?

Raymond Lin said:
Then you renegotiate in a proper way, not hold the nation's children as ransom.

Any other job you would sit down with your boss and talk over it, if you don't like it, you quit and find something else. What you don't do is sit and home and not go to work, or worse still, stand outside the office with a banner and chanting ! It is terrible etiquette if you ask me.
Click to expand...

The government (Gove) aren't interested in sitting down and talking it over.

They have ideological reasons for doing what they are doing and have made it quite clear that they aren't interested in listening to education professionals about anything.

If it takes strike action to get the government to engage in the discussion you're talking about then so be it.
 
easyrider said:
Thats because it doesn't effect you.

So I quit my job after 30 years service and find another just like that?

who is going to employ a 50 year old and doing what?

BS
Click to expand...

So standing outside with a banner is the way to go? I really don't think that is the way to show the children you are teaching how it is done when things don't go your way !

Surely with 30 years of professional experience, which from this thread has illustrated, that the teaching profession are very difficult to get into and demands high qualifications with constant training, then surely you can get another job of equal salary quite easily?
 
Raymond Lin said:
Surely with 30 years of professional experience, which from this thread has illustrated, that the teaching profession are very difficult to get into and demands high qualifications with constant training, then surely you can get another job of equal salary quite easily?
Click to expand...

Not if every teacher in the country tried to do it! :p

Bear in mind this isn't one employee's disagreement with a private company – there are about 425,000 teachers all of whom are being affected in the same way by these changes.

It's not as simple as 'don't like it get a different job'.
 
Just to forewarn all teachers posting in this thread, I will be cross checking posting times against school opening hours and will be informing the relevant authorities accordingly. See me after.
 
Castiel said:
As was I originally pointing out that value is not necessarily dependent upon specific entry requirements.
Click to expand...

Value is usually derived from the need, the ability to get and the prerequisite skill set. Both are needed, both are not short of good applicants (most teachers going in now need a 1st or 2:1), but one has significantly higher entry criteria.
 
Irish_Tom said:
I'm not a teacher but I do work for a number of schools, colleges and universities. My partner is a teacher, both my parents were, most of my partner's family are or were so I've got a pretty good knowledge of the education sector.



The problem is that the government keep changing the pay and conditions so that they aren't what people signed up for.

The government renegotiated teachers' pay and pensions back at the start of the recession so that the pay scale bands were adjusted, a pay freeze was enforced and pension contributions were increased. The negotiations were tough but the Unions eventually agreed and most teachers thought they had 'done their bit' towards the cuts and austerity.

Then the government decided to extend the pay freeze and limit any increases to 1%, as well as increasing pension contributions (again). This was the cause of the strikes in 2011/12.

Now the government are talking about scrapping national pay scales and introducing performance related pay. Both ideas have their merits but they also have disadvantages and the Unions have to stand up for their members.

Tie in all of the above with the massive upheaval of the entire education system by Gove and it's not hard to see why some teachers feel they are being unfairly targeted.
Click to expand...

Virtually all public sector roles (aside from a select Civilian Servant positions) have had big changes/threats to pensions, yearly pay increases, prospects and performance related targets. Once again, teaching isn't unique to experience these things. Just seems that Teachers are more outspoken and able to get away with striking more frequently as they are not dealing with Law & Order, or Public Health.
 
on the subject of "performace related pay" it sounds like a good diea but it wil only encourage cheating like the leauge tables did. if you're going to get paid more if the kids all pass thier coursework with near full marks you're going to just give them the answeres.
 
RedvGreen said:
Virtually all public sector roles (aside from a select Civilian Servant positions) have had big changes/threats to pensions, yearly pay increases, prospects and performance related targets. Once again, teaching isn't unique to experience these things. Just seems that Teachers are more outspoken and able to get away with striking more frequently as they are not dealing with Law & Order, or Public Health.
Click to expand...

I wasn't suggesting other public services aren't under the same pressures – I was just explaining to Raymond why teaching unions have been striking (something he admitted he didn't understand).

Maybe if the other public services were a bit more vocal the current government wouldn't get away with as much 'reform'.
 
Raymond Lin said:
So standing outside with a banner is the way to go? I really don't think that is the way to show the children you are teaching how it is done when things don't go your way !

?
Click to expand...

So now your against encouraging young people to stand up and protest?

Priceless

Peaceful protest challenging establishment should be encouraged.
 
easyrider said:
So now your against encouraging young people to stand up and protest?

Priceless

Peaceful protest challenging establishment should be encouraged.
Click to expand...

Now you are being ridiculous.

When people protest, like the poll tax, something you can't escape no matter where you are, what profession you are and who you are.

You choose to be a teacher, you choose to stay a teacher.

Do you know what the strike looks like? A bunch of kids who are throwing toys out of their pram because things don't go their way.

It looks 10 times worse every year they do it, and they lose public support in doing so. I used to sympathise with them, now it's "not again, what the hell?!"

The correct course of action is to push for legislation, by getting MP behind them and push through a law or at least a commitment from the govnment that teacher's pension or rates of salary increase is ring fenced.

Standing outside Westminster with banners shouting looks like a bunch of amateurs instead of professional that they are.
 
Last edited:
Raymond Lin said:
The correct course of action is to push for legislation, by getting MP behind them and push through a law or at least a commitment from the govnment that teacher's pension or rates of salary increase is ring fenced.

Standing outside Westminster with banners shouting looks like a bunch of amateurs instead of professional that they are.
Click to expand...

It hasn't worked. Hence the need to strike.
 
Diagro said:
Teachers are not 9-5 more 7:45-5:30

Also I think being responsible for 30 four year olds as my missus is is much more important than chucking drunks in a cell for the night. I have watched road wars I know what its all about ;)

Do police teach your children all day everyday? No

Oh and another thing for all parents here, Dont teach your child the alphabet using the capital letter sounds.
They have to learn using the sounding letters such as a b c d not ADCD
Click to expand...

For someone asking for respect of your partners profession you seem to be awfully dismissive of other professions.
 
Xordium said:
Value is usually derived from the need, the ability to get and the prerequisite skill set. Both are needed, both are not short of good applicants (most teachers going in now need a 1st or 2:1), but one has significantly higher entry criteria.
Click to expand...

The requirements for a PCGE or SCITT are simply to have a degree, there is no specification as to what grade degree, other than that it should be either in the subject you wish to teach or you can take a SKE..the only other requirement is a grade c or above at GCSE in English and Maths. In some cases a degree is not necessary at all. Some University Programs such as Warwick state preference is given to candidates with a 2:1 (and then only in certain subjects, namely English, History and Drama), but that is it. It is not a necessity to have a 2:1 or First, a 2:2 is sufficient.

And I disagree with you, value is defined by the value to society as a whole, not only as regards to the prerequisites for gaining formal qualification or job status. The qualifications a job demands doesn't necessarily imply that that job is of higher social value than another.

In my opinion Teachers are certainly not more valuable than Police Officers to society, in fact I don't think the two are even comparable on a scale of value in that context...which is precisely what I have been saying from the outset.
 
Castiel said:
The requirements for a PCGE or SCITT are simply to have a degree, there is no specification as to what grade degree
Click to expand...

You are competing with a number of other people. The overwhelming majority of candidates who get on are either 1st or 2:1 not all as I acknowledged.

There is a big difference between the bare minimum stipulated criteria and what you would actually need to actually get on the course. As it stands now if you want to get on you need a 2:1 or a 1st - I know as that was the first thing they wanted to know from me when I was exploring this profession as a possibility.

And if value is defined by the benefit to society then why have the wages of binmen been reduced?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom