Poll: PETITION: PLEASE BRING MORE SIZES OF MICHELIN SUPERSPORTS TO UK!!

[Fr0dders]

So explain Clarkeys findings then?

Eagle F1's are poor for track driving and from what I can see don't last along. CS5 in reviews seems very similar to CS3.

I'm not interested in track performance. I drive a road car on the road.

I'm not disputing this is a great dry weather track tyre that isn't lethal in the wet like fox says, but it think it's a bit far to call it

the best tyre money san buy

As for this

Compared to F1AS2 in this review:-
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/michelin-pilot-super-sport-page-10

Still fad?

Very little hardcore fact in this test either, more subjective opinions

 

[Gibbo]

How do they compare to the Advan AD08?

The AD08 is a semi slick and a superb tyre, especially for driving hard on, but the AD08 seems to either be just good on some cars and sensational on others, no doubt due to them having mega stiff sidewalls. I'd say dry grip the AD08 might just edge them, wet and cold grip the SuperSports are without a doubt better, plus much longer lasting too.

The SuperSport seems loved by all performance car owners, look at how well adopted they have being by:-
e46/e9x M3 owners
GTR owners love them rating them better than the o.e. Semi slick and lasting far longer.
911 owners crying as they are not n rated but taking risk of using them as they are so good.

In short if you own a performance car, particular heavier ones and drive hard on road with odd bit of track driving the SuperSport does seem un rivalled.....

 

[Gibbo]

I'm not interested in track performance. I drive a road car on the road.

I'm not disputing this is a great dry weather track tyre that isn't lethal in the wet like fox says, but it think it's a bit far to call it

Clarkey was on about road driving, did you read what he said?

Plus how are they not great value, seems from user feedback they last twice as long as F1AS2 and don't cost twice as much.

 

[jamoor]

I doubt someone from Michelin will read an act on this.

Have you tried Costco?

 

[Muffin`]

I doubt someone from Michelin will read an act on this.

Have you tried Costco?

I don't think Costco will act of behalf of Gibbo either

 

[Gibbo]

I'm not interested in track performance. I drive a road car on the road.

I'm not disputing this is a great dry weather track tyre that isn't lethal in the wet like fox says, but it think it's a bit far to call it



As for this



Very little hardcore fact in this test either, more subjective opinions

Are you blind?
Lap times, lateral G, braking distance test, feedback through the steering wheel, all done same day, same car, same driver.

Seems comprehensive to me and reports exactly my findings on F1AS2 tyres, poor feedback, average dry performance, superb wet performance but not a drivers tyre. But a great road tyre for all year round use.

Is this why you don't like the review because the F1AS2 did not win? I just don't see how you can claim it's not hardcore fact when it's conducted on a special test track, with braking distances, lateral G, lap times and comments on feedback/handling in a controlled environment.

 

[Kenai]

Are you blind?
Lap times, lateral G, braking distance test, feedback through the steering wheel, all done same day, same car, same driver.

Seems comprehensive to me and reports exactly my findings on F1AS2 tyres, poor feedback, average dry performance, superb wet performance but not a drivers tyre. But a great road tyre for all year round use.

Is this why you don't like the review because the F1AS2 did not win? I just don't see how you can claim it's not hardcore fact when it's conducted on a special test track, with braking distances, lateral G, lap times and comments on feedback/handling in a controlled environment.

It's probably because you've linked directly to the summary that waffles a bit and declares it the winner and it's not immediately obvious the review continues for another 10 pages worth of tests and data etc.

 

[Housey]

Goodyear make CRAP track tyres, most heavy track day users (the really rapid ones) will tell you Goodyear are to be avoided as they get all wobbly. Now on road that has some advantages as it adds to the damping when you hit bad surfaces, which is important to road handling and can have some significant positive impact. I put Goodyears best at the time tyres on my RS4, they were without question worse than Bridgestones and even Pirelli's I had on before, they didnt suit the car and felt soft. They also had a terrible habit of understeering at slow speeds, so pulling out of a garage forecourt at say 10mph they could wobble into understeer. All the tyre tests were telling me they were ace but for me on that car they were absolutely not and I could take people out in the car and prove it, demonstrate why consistently.

We have 2 sides here. We have people who buy them and want to share experiences (many who have buyer justification) and we have people who believe everything they read in tyre tests and feel the very unscientific approach, as most actually state, can be applied to all cars, all conditions, which it simply can't. Yes its a marker and yes it has merits, but different pressures, different set ups different weights, different driven wheels will all have effect on the tyre as will the persons right foot.

Cars and the bits on them can not be quantified by spreadsheets and pie charts. You need to get em on, go drive em an compare em. You might get it wrong, you might look for different things, you may never get near the limits to prove anything but it shouldn't be dismissed as internet folk law. I believe I am always objective, if I see something crap even when I have just bought it I will say so. I also appreciate that it is just my opinion but my experience of these tyres has been very good. They grip very well in all conditions, especially the wet instilling lots of confidence and they last very well. However they are far too noisy and not soft enough to warrant a significant ride improvement over run flats. For me therefore I won't buy them again for this car, but they really are very good on an F10 530D and no tyre wold offer a significantly safer or better handling compromise, no matter what tyre tests wish to tell me.

 

[Kenai]

The problem comes in who you can trust to make those subjective judgements.

When it comes to the general public, you end up with ratings like this:

Matador MP 46 Hectorra 2 (Average of 46 reviews)
Dry Grip
92%
Wet Grip
87%
Road Feedback
81%
Progressiveness
78%
Wear
88%
Comfort
87%
Buy again
90%

Michelin Pilot Super Sport (average of 45 reviews)
Dry Grip
96%
Wet Grip
89%
Road Feedback
95%
Progressiveness
87%
Wear
84%
Comfort
84%
Buy again
92%

Only a complete madman would assume they're anywhere near alike, yet ask a selection of joe public and that's exactly what you get - unless you know the person giving you the opinion and you know their frame of reference, the 'unscientific' controlled test is always going to be a more reliable indicator, even if it's not 100% applicable to every car and scenario the same.

 

[Housey]

The problem comes in who you can trust to make those subjective judgements.

When it comes to the general public, you end up with ratings like this:

Matador MP 46 Hectorra 2 (Average of 46 reviews)
Dry Grip
92%
Wet Grip
87%
Road Feedback
81%
Progressiveness
78%
Wear
88%
Comfort
87%
Buy again
90%

Michelin Pilot Super Sport (average of 45 reviews)
Dry Grip
96%
Wet Grip
89%
Road Feedback
95%
Progressiveness
87%
Wear
84%
Comfort
84%
Buy again
92%

Only a complete madman would assume they're anywhere near alike, yet ask a selection of joe public and that's exactly what you get - unless you know the person giving you the opinion and you know their frame of reference, the 'unscientific' controlled test is always going to be a more reliable indicator, even if it's not 100% applicable to every car and scenario the same.

As you get older you realise who to listen to and who to ignore and sadly, most of the time it's people who have just made a buying decision.

 

[Type_R]

Fortunately they make them and sell them in the UK for the M3 (E92):

245/35/19
265/35/19

Mine are on my 220Ms ready to be fitted as my summer tyres as soon as the weather turns good

 

[gord]

I can get them in my size fortunately. They will be my next tyre however.

Front 225/45/18
Rear 245/45/18

I push my car a lot so it's good to have tyres that I can trust - though to be fair the Potenzas did brilliantly round the track.

Aren't you in a Z4M? That rear profile isn't right is it?

 

[rjk]

I don't need a tyre review to understand that the PSS is a superb tyre.

Being friends with a person who has an impressive car history, a list of performance tyres used in the past, and two 300bhp+ sports cars means you get to experience some things first hand.

Going round Donny in the 911 on road tyres and keeping up easily with other cars on slicks.

A drive on a wet road at silly speeds whilst retaining the cars composure on a supposedly poor wet performance tyre.

There are some things that an internet/magazine generic tyre review doesn't tell you.

Whilst a lot of people aren't going to want a sports performance tyre on their car, I would imagine that most performance car enthusiasts would want a tyre like the PSS and would happily accept any supposed downsides to the tyre as the performance benefits are worth it.

 

[Simon]

Clarkey was on about road driving, did you read what he said?

Plus how are they not great value, seems from user feedback they last twice as long as F1AS2 and don't cost twice as much.

Odd as I got 14k from my AS2 rears and that includes a full day at donington. The didn't bead up like the S001s and they only lasted 6k. However I also changed the rear toe at same time so not conclusive.

Tyres differ from car to car. There is no rule that applies to all.
Scrub radius dictates tyre twist. And remember tyre twist is the only reason a car changes direction. So what is vague on one car might be ideal on another. Sure one might be more responsive. But what if it's too responsive and makes thing skittish ?

R&D is a sunk cost already. The real cost is the tyre moulds which are very expensive. You need to be able to sell enough tyres of a particular size to justify the investment in that mould. Your going to need hundreds of tyres in one size on this petition to make sense

 

[Will]

Wouldn't mind having them as a choice in my size (215/45 r17)....be a nice option to compare against the AD08, probably better as a summer only road tyre (I have spare wheels with different rubber for november to march), but slightly worse than the yokohama on track. Given I hope to do only 1 or 2 track days a year the supersport might be a better compromise.

 

[Simon]

Oh and the F1AS2 have been amazing in this weather. Heavy rain, standing water on muddy broken B-roads with a load of height changes and corners and I can drive with full confidence whilst carrying decent speed. No point compromising in this regard on a daily driver for a bit of something you think you need for those few track days a year.

 

[esK`]

215/45/18 please! Running Hankook Ventus S1 Evo 2 K117 at the moment, nice tyres but I want better!

 

[rjk]

Your going to need hundreds of tyres in one size on this petition to make sense

That's the thing. The range of PSS in the USA is massive and covers a much wider selection of sizes. They have the tyres available in loads of sizes that they simply don't offer in the EU

 

[Muffin`]

A company as big as Michelin will know exactly what sizes are worth selling tyres for

 

[Simon]

That's the thing. The range of PSS in the USA is massive and covers a much wider selection of sizes. They have the tyres available in loads of sizes that they simply don't offer in the EU

How many are E marked ?