Persecution of Gays

[Tuppy_Glossop]

Realy? Let me ask you, is family important whether same sex or natural?

I'm fairly certain his emphasis was on 'natural', not on family. Nobody is arguing that having caring adults acting as parents helps a child (worth mentioning that not all parents are of the caring kind). The question is what a same-sex couple cannot offer that a mixed-sex couple can.

 

[oulton]

To suggest that promoting acceptance of LGBT people and same sex relationships will encourage teenagers to be gay is like suggesting that black people can turn people black because racial equality is promoted in schools.

Not really the same thing, is it?

 

[Sliver]

Realy? Let me ask you, is family important whether same sex or natural?

Family is important but the parents sexuality is irrelevant. You keep stating over and over that a family should be 'natural' which in your view is a man and a woman with offspring and that this is how our utopia should be. This is a pointless line of argument. Do you not realise how many children in traditional family environments are abused, both sexually and mentally by their parents ? Who the hell said that having a mum and a dad makes everything natural ? Is being molested by your pervert dad natural ?

My point is it's not about sexual orientation regarding how well a child will develop, it's about having loving, decent parents who care for and treat their children well. I'm quietly confident that Elton John's adopted son will grow to be a healthy, happy and well balanced and tolerant adult. Probably heterosexual too !

 

[phonemonkey]

Why is it different? Do you believe people choose to be gay?

 

[phonemonkey]

Not really the same thing, is it?

Why is it different? Do you believe people choose to be gay?

 

[oulton]

I'm quietly confident that Elton John's adopted son will grow to be a healthy, happy and well balanced and tolerant adult. Probably heterosexual too !

heterosexual, I doubt it!

The whole single sex family thing is a social experiment at best and could lead to a whole generation of extremely screwed up people.

 

[oulton]

why are you quoting yourself phonemonkey?

Are you aware of any 'gay genes'? I'm pretty sure there aren't any because they wouldn't be inherited thats for sure

So if there are no gay genes, we must accept that sexuality is a product of our nurture, and in that case, being immersed in a society which celebrates homosexuality (above heterosexuality) must surely influence sexual development.

 

[Tuppy_Glossop]

Humans learn different things from both male and females. From females they learn how to deal with things emotionally etc and from males they learn how to deal with things more practically.

So you're an expert in developmental psychology ? And are the parents the only human contact a child has ?

Studies have been done that show men born from single mother house holds vs boys raised by mother and fathers have different results.

Everybody is different. Siblings from the same same-sex couple family can be very different emotionally and practically. I'm very different from my brother.

I don't remember the exact figures and studies as i am not that in to it. But it was something like 90% of the young males arrested in a specific state in the us were raised by single mothers. The lack of a father figure in the household often leads to similar results.

Bit light on detail here. Your statistic is meaningless out of context.

 

[phonemonkey]

I was an accident. I was trying to add a quote of your post to mine but it reported quoting both. Does it matter too much? Would you like to answer the question?

 

[Sliver]

heterosexual, I doubt it!

Your assertion implies a choice is made. This is fallacious and contradicts all of the available evidence as to why a minority of people are gay. Statistically, Elton's son will be heterosexual. You can not teach someone to be gay. Either they are or they are not.

Edit ---> This is what the science says, and it clearly points to a lack of choice for determining sexuality. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_and_sexual_orientation

 

[AJK]

Please provide evidence for why the "natural" family is so important.

Really?

Yes, really. Do you not want to answer the question?

Humans learn different things from both male and females. From females they learn how to deal with things emotionally etc and from males they learn how to deal with things more practically.

Source for that?

I don't remember the exact figures and studies as i am not that in to it.

Brilliant.

 

[oulton]

I was an accident. I was trying to add a quote of your post to mine but it reported quoting both. Does it matter too much? Would you like to answer the question?

please refer to my edit.

Silver also.

Are you aware of any 'gay genes'? I'm pretty sure there aren't any because they wouldn't be inherited thats for sure

So if there are no gay genes, we must accept that sexuality is a product of our nurture, and in that case, being immersed in a society which celebrates homosexuality (above heterosexuality) must surely influence sexual development.

What do you think about my point?

 

[zenf]

why are you quoting yourself phonemonkey?

Are you aware of any 'gay genes'? I'm pretty sure there aren't any because they wouldn't be inherited thats for sure

So if there are no gay genes, we must accept that sexuality is a product of our nurture, and in that case, being immersed in a society which celebrates homosexuality (above heterosexuality) must surely influence sexual development.

Are you suggesting there weren't any gay people before it became socially acceptable? And even if people are influenced by society into being a particular sexuality (evidence?), that still doesn't mean it's a choice.

 

[phonemonkey]

why are you quoting yourself phonemonkey?

Are you aware of any 'gay genes'? I'm pretty sure there aren't any because they wouldn't be inherited thats for sure

So if there are no gay genes, we must accept that sexuality is a product of our nurture, and in that case, being immersed in a society which celebrates homosexuality (above heterosexuality) must surely influence sexual development.

There is evidence of the gay gene but why some people are LGBT is largely unknown, it's not a choice. I received exactly the same education as my sister, at home and at school, in relation to sex and relationships. I went to school in Scotland at a time when teachers weren't allowed to talk about same sex relationships, being gay or their opinions on equality for LGBT people. I am bisexual and my sister is straight. Surely we should have the same orientation since we grew up with the same cultural experience of sexual relationships?

I don't know any LGBT people who would seek to 'recruit', it's certainly not my aim. I would however like to make sure that no child faces the bullying, physical assaults, isolation, self recrimination and fear that I felt growing up. I see it as levelling the playing field and giving every child the best possible start, If that's your view of promoting homosexuality over heterosexuality then so be it. I doubt we'll ever agree

 

[Sliver]

Silver also.



What do you think about my point?

This is what the science says, and it clearly points to a lack of choice for determining sexuality. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology...al_orientation

I believe, based on the available evidence, that being gay is a combination of nature and nurture. I'm not saying it's 50/50. If I had to take a punt, given what I know, I would say it was more nature than nurture.

Why do some people love Marmite and some hate it ? Isn't this analogous to being gay ? We're all born with a blueprint of genetics given to us by our parents, and when these genes mix and become us, whose to say our future sexuality is not cast in that moment ? If I lived in a society where everyone but me loved Marmite, that wouldn't make me suddenly like Marmite would it ? I'd still hate it right ? Same thing with being the child of gay parents. Elton John's son might live in a very gay world, but it has no bearing on his sexuality.

 

[Woden]

I don't know enough about "the system" to comment but any child they adopt will have to face prejudice because they will be an easy target from other children at school and even as an adult they will face prejudice. They will be labelled and all sorts and i don't think that is fair as they were not given a choice.

Kids pick on each other, there will always be something. I was bullied for wearign glasses, maybe we should ban those too? Get a grip.

Prejudice will decrease surely? As you said yourself, we are getting more acceping.

There is also the influence from the parents which undoubtedly will effect the child's sexuality and how they think about men and women.

Yes, this is why straight parents never have gay kids ...

 

[oulton]

This is what the science says, and it clearly points to a lack of choice for determining sexuality. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology...al_orientation

I believe, based on the available evidence, that being gay is a combination of nature and nurture. I'm not saying it's 50/50. If I had to take a punt, given what I know, I would say it was more nature than nurture.

Why do some people love Marmite and some hate it ? Isn't this analogous to being gay ? We're all born with a blueprint of genetics given to us by our parents, and when these genes mix and become us, whose to say our future sexuality is not cast in that moment ? If I lived in a society where everyone but me loved Marmite, that wouldn't make me suddenly like Marmite would it ? I'd still hat it right ? Same thing with being the child of gay parents.

Sliver, we make so many unconscious choices in life that we are simply not aware of. To use the marmite analogy, usually someone acquires a taste for marmite through repeated exposure to it. The same goes for many habits. The older I get the more I remind myself of my father. Why? Because we are similar genetically, but also because his sense of humour, his character and his way of living rubbed off on me when growing up. This is how human beings work, we are influenced by what we experience. And because of this I find the proliferation of homosexual propaganda in society worrying.

 

[Caged]

Using your argument though homosexuality didn't exist when it was illegal or people were persecuted for it. The suggestion that equality is making more people gay is quite funny, surely all it's doing is making people feel more able to express that, which is a good thing. Nobody should be worried by this, except perhaps backwards parents who would feel some sort of shame if their child turned out to be gay.

 

[schnoodles]

Sliver, we make so many unconscious choices in life that we are simply not aware of. To use the marmite analogy, usually someone acquires a taste for marmite through repeated exposure to it. The same goes for many habits. The older I get the more I remind myself of my father. Why? Because we are similar genetically, but also because his sense of humour, his character and his way of living rubbed off on me when growing up. This is how human beings work, we are influenced by what we experience. And because of this I find the proliferation of homosexual propaganda in society worrying.

"Propaganda"? I don't remember ever encountering any "propaganda". I'll be sure to watch out for those sneaky gays trying to turn me though!

 

[schnoodles]

The suggestion that equality is making more people gay is quite funny

It also suggests that there's something to fear. I'm not sure what the problem with more gay people would be, exactly.