can the police use your dashcam for proof that you were speeding?

DRZ · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:03

PACE section 19:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1984/60/section/19

They can and will take it to stop you deleting it.

Burnsy2023 · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:06

mattyg said:
So the police can seize photographers equipment too then.

In most circumstances, yes. There are exemptions for press though. Section 19 - 22 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 governs what we can and cant' do.

Burnsy2023 · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:08

mattyg said:
I know its not an official gov site
http://www.policewitness.com/support/faqs/

Unless there is some case law I'm missing, that seems wrong to me.

DRZ said:
PACE section 19:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1984/60/section/19

They can and will take it to stop you deleting it.

Whilst we have the power to do so, I don't know any officer that actually would. Well not unless it was warp speeds.

mattyg · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:15

mattyfez said:
Next up, dash cams that upload to your phone/cloud storage via Bluetooth/rf/whatever

"this SD card in your cam is empty"

"yes officer, I neglected to turn the camera on today".

Already out I thought.
http://www.actioncameras.co.uk/blackvue-dr500-wifi-in-car-camera

May have to use a recording function on the phone though

The Running Man · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:15

When g4s take over they'll get paid by the ticket so expect a crackdown:/

asim18 · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:51

Steampunk said:
I doubt they could get you for speeding unless your cam is an accurate speed measuring device

erm... Once again (amazingly), speed is merely distance over time. A camera is already an accurate time measuring device, then by using the footage an investigator can return to the scene and accurately measure the distance travelled, therefore the speed figure you calculate using this basic equation will automatically be accurate.

xs2man · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:51

Steampunk said:
I doubt they could get you for speeding unless your cam is an accurate speed measuring device, or you've got your speedo clearly in shot. I can see a traffic cop trying it on, but if you went to court and asked the police to tell you exactly how fast you were going based on your film and their guestimate, they'd look a bit silly saying "fast, but I don't know how fast".

However, if they've got film of you driving like an idiot, crossing solid lines, overtaking at zebras and so on, they'd do you for that instead, regardless of your speed.

If the police are going to use a recording like that in court against you, it would be pretty simple to determine an average speed. It is just distance over time afterall. Not exactly rocket science.

Housey · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:53

asim18 said:
erm... Once again (amazingly), speed is merely distance over time. A camera is a completely accurate time and distance measuring device therefore the speed figure you calculate using this basic equation will automatically be accurate.

Establishing the speed of a car from a video is not the biggest challenge associated with obtaining a conviction.

Burnsy2023 · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:56

Housey said:
Establishing the speed of a car from a video is not the biggest challenge associated with obtaining a conviction.

Like I said, whilst this is possible, most officers have too much work to get that video evidence into a usable state for a conviction.

asim18 · 23 Apr 2014 at 21:57

Housey said:
Establishing the speed of a car from a video is not the biggest challenge associated with obtaining a conviction.

Exactly what I'm saying. Year 6 science stuff, not a challenge at all.

DXP55 · 23 Apr 2014 at 22:10

I have a Roadhawk and it tells me how fast I am going at any given time complete with google map reference.

So looking at footage of me doing 110 down M54 I reckon they could do me.

Dave

ps - joking about 110

Meridian · 23 Apr 2014 at 22:33

Generally actual police officers aren't that interested in your speed, unless you were going a LOT more than the limit. They leave that to the road-side speed traps. They would be interested in evidence of Due Care and Attention or other such offences though.

Housey · 23 Apr 2014 at 22:44

Burnsy2023 said:
Like I said, whilst this is possible, most officers have too much work to get that video evidence into a usable state for a conviction.

In a case where the car is stopped at scene and a camera is removed perhaps, but in the case of a YouTube video very hard even with all the time in the world.

mattyg · 23 Apr 2014 at 22:53

xs2man said:
If the police are going to use a recording like that in court against you, it would be pretty simple to determine an average speed. It is just distance over time afterall. Not exactly rocket science.

But if playback is faster or slower than the speed it was recorded at then there will be a difference

xs2man · 24 Apr 2014 at 00:10

mattyg said:
But if playback is faster or slower than the speed it was recorded at then there will be a difference

Pretty simple to play it back at 1x speed though. Basic software.

ajf · 24 Apr 2014 at 01:15

The Running Man said:
When g4s take over they'll get paid by the ticket so expect a crackdown:/

Sorry, slight diversion from main topic, but what do you mean here?
What are they taking over?

xs2man · 24 Apr 2014 at 01:36

I guess he is talking about privatisation of at least some of the police force.

spoffle · 24 Apr 2014 at 01:45

xs2man said:
Pretty simple to play it back at 1x speed though. Basic software.

I think he's hinting at the fact that it's easily open to abuse, if they play it back faster (intentionally) they could claim you were driving faster.

There would be a limit of how much playback could be sped up of course, but it could be used to push speeds past speed limits without it being obvious that it's been sped up.

Gaygle · 24 Apr 2014 at 03:56

spoffle said:
I think he's hinting at the fact that it's easily open to abuse, if they play it back faster (intentionally) they could claim you were driving faster.

There would be a limit of how much playback could be sped up of course, but it could be used to push speeds past speed limits without it being obvious that it's been sped up.

And therefore committing perjury, perverting the course of justice and misconduct in a public office to name a few likely offences. Jail time would be all but certain.

And you reckon someone would do that to make it look like someone did 35mph instead of 30?

stuman · 24 Apr 2014 at 05:18

how could you be sure that the camera was recording in real time? and not creating footage that was sped up/ slowed down.

it comes down to calibration. speed guns have to be calibrated. police cars have their speedo's calibrated. i doubt that a cheap dash-cam would have any calibration accreditation at all.