Poll: Should Labour turn left or right?

[D.P.]

I don't think Labour could get any more right if they actually tried.

Labour is currently further right than almost every single conservative government of the 20th century.

 

[Glaucus]

Oh look more missing the point. No one has said labour caused the recession, they did however make it far worse.

Lets of proof if you want to go google, but you want as you want even admit the obvious.

 

[joeyjojo]

Oh look more missing the point. No one has said labour caused the recession, they did however make it far worse.

Lets of proof if you want to go google, but you want as you want even admit the obvious.

Made it worse?? Please show me an article from an expert that says so. The closest thing I can find to that with a quick search is the opposite, that a Tory government would have made it worse - they were against Labour's (insufficient!) bank regulations, and against a stimulus program in 2009 (that undoubtedly began the recovery).

http://voxpoliticalonline.com/2015/...worse-if-the-conservatives-had-been-in-power/

 

[silversurfer]

The whole political spectrum is rebased to the left right, as evidenced by the large amount of debt and GDP proportioned in government.

This is not normal but its been ongoing for so long that many think coservatives are really right, I think at most they are central. Labour has always been strongly left, but in this scenario blair is probably correct

labour is currently further right than almost every single conservative government of the 20th century.

even thatcher, they were about to price fix the cost of energy where this is the reverse all those privatisations

 

[D.P.]

Oh look more missing the point. No one has said labour caused the recession, they did however make it far worse.

Lets of proof if you want to go google, but you want as you want even admit the obvious.

How did Labour make it worse?The economy was starting to recover from the recession until the Conservative's austerity kicked in and dropped growth lack a sack of potatoes.

 

[Von Smallhausen]

This country is in desperate need of a good centre left party.

 

[jigger]

Oh look more missing the point. No one has said labour caused the recession, they did however make it far worse.

Lets of proof if you want to go google, but you want as you want even admit the obvious.

Worse than what? Nobody could have prepared the UK for what happened to the point it would have made any difference. Maybe if we had communist rule for few decades beforehand.

 

[Caged]

Glaucus if you're going to argue badly can you please at least check that your fingers are landing on the right parts of the keyboard? Your posts are horrific to read.

 

[Glaucus]

Glaucus if you're going to argue badly can you please at least check that your fingers are landing on the right parts of the keyboard? Your posts are horrific to read.

No, and it's hardly badly. Some people are so politically aligned. They can't even say their party did any wrong. It was all 100% Right. It's laughable.

 

[Caged]

Well other than the unfounded accusations about a bunch of public sector employees literally doing nothing I guess.

That post was a lot more readable though so thanks.

 

[Glaucus]

It's far from unfounded though. It is well known they employed people in public sector that did little, rather than spending it on national projects and infrastructure. This is easy to find evidence if you want it. I have no interest in spending hours baby feeding people.

 

[Caged]

It's not my job to back up your claims

 

[elmarko]

It's far from unfounded though. It is well known they employed people in public sector that did little, rather than spending it on national projects and infrastructure. This is easy to find evidence if you want it. I have no interest in spending hours baby feeding people.

This still isn't evidence of systemic economic mismanagement which is currently believed within the public domain.

I'll let you into a little secret.

Every single political party in the last 100 years has run a deficit, spent on useless pet projects, ignored the findings of scientific bodies & has generally mismanaged to economy with little difference between them.

There are plenty of good reasons not to vote for the Labour party, as there are plenty to not vote for the Conservatives. Poor economic performance is not one of them for either. The economic crash would have happened regardless as to who was in power, there is evidence to suggest it would have been worse had they Conservatives been in power (due to less regulation) - but we may have had marginally less debt (but a weaker economy).

The real failing of Labour was to have power & a majority for the time they did & squander it by failing to make a huge impact on inequality, child poverty, targeted infrastructure projects & other traditionally 'left' issues. The Conservatives on the other hand will actively exasperate these, which in my view is enough reason to avoid voting for them.

To give a rational comparison, in their time in office the Conservatives had let infrastructure projects languor, ignore the findings of pretty much every single study they commission, fail every single economic or debt related target they set, cause notable harm to our economic recovery (we are supposed to be in the middle of a boom) - to note this view is supported by a vast majority of economists.

 

[bazaarboy]

This still isn't evidence of systemic economic mismanagement which is currently believed within the public domain.

I'll let you into a little secret.

Every single political party in the last 100 years has run a deficit, spent on useless pet projects, ignored the findings of scientific bodies & has generally mismanaged to economy with little difference between them.

There are plenty of good reasons not to vote for the Labour party, as there are plenty to not vote for the Conservatives. Poor economic performance is not one of them for either. The economic crash would have happened regardless as to who was in power, there is evidence to suggest it would have been worse had they Conservatives been in power (due to less regulation) - but we may have had marginally less debt (but a weaker economy).

The real failing of Labour was to have power & a majority for the time they did & squander it by failing to make a huge impact on inequality, child poverty, targeted infrastructure projects & other traditionally 'left' issues. The Conservatives on the other hand will actively exasperate these, which in my view is enough reason to avoid voting for them.

To give a rational comparison, in their time in office the Conservatives had let infrastructure projects languor, ignore the findings of pretty much every single study they commission, fail every single economic or debt related target they set, cause notable harm to our economic recovery (we are supposed to be in the middle of a boom) - to note this view is supported by a vast majority of economists.

Here's one example of Labour's mismanagement.

Under Gordon Brown's stewardship the then Labour government sold 400 tonnes of treasury gold for about 3.5 billion dollars.

The agreed sale price per ounce was the lowest in 20 years, if it was sold in the 1980s it would have resulted in 2-3 times more, and if it was not sold it would be worth 5 times more now.

 

[SlugForAButt]

Here's one example of Labour's mismanagement.

Under Gordon Brown's stewardship the then Labour government sold 400 tonnes of treasury gold for about 3.5 billion dollars.

The agreed sale price per ounce was the lowest in 20 years, if it was sold in the 1980s it would have resulted in 2-3 times more, and if it was not sold it would be worth 5 times more now.

+1

Nothing more needs saying...

 

[elmarko]

+1

Nothing more needs saying...

By 'a vast majority of economists', presumably you're referring to the two thirds of a group of economists who were asked which said the coalition's policies had helped the economy? That's not quite man-made climate change is real level support. There were 33 of them, 22 of whom disagreed with the proposition that the Government’s policies since 2010 have had a “positive effect” on the economy. I can't help be feel you're overplaying your hand quite a bit...

Here's one example of Labour's mismanagement.

Under Gordon Brown's stewardship the then Labour government sold 400 tonnes of treasury gold for about 3.5 billion dollars.

The agreed sale price per ounce was the lowest in 20 years, if it was sold in the 1980s it would have resulted in 2-3 times more, and if it was not sold it would be worth 5 times more now.

I agree with the benefit of hindsight it was indeed a stupid economic choice, but it's frankly peanuts compared to the cost to the UK economy in terms of lost growth as a result of George Osborne's policies he intends to continue.

There is still very little in the terms of solid evidence to support the notion that Labour are significantly worse than the Conservatives regarding economic management. I fully appreciate you are blinded by ideological support & can't be impartial on the matter, but it doesn't make your arguments any more compelling. I'm not defending Labour, I'm pointing out your hypocrisy.

 

[Caged]

Here's one example of Labour's mismanagement.

Under Gordon Brown's stewardship the then Labour government sold 400 tonnes of treasury gold for about 3.5 billion dollars.

The agreed sale price per ounce was the lowest in 20 years, if it was sold in the 1980s it would have resulted in 2-3 times more, and if it was not sold it would be worth 5 times more now.

Here's a lot of reasons why it's not relevant:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5788dbac-7680-11e0-b05b-00144feabdc0.html#axzz3Zry4S5bw

Yes it may have been worth 5 times as much now. It may also have been worth half what it sold for.

 

[SlugForAButt]

I agree with the benefit of hindsight it was indeed a stupid economic choice, but it's frankly peanuts compared to the cost to the UK economy in terms of lost growth as a result of George Osborne's policies he intends to continue.

There is still very little in the terms of solid evidence to support the notion that Labour are significantly worse than the Conservatives regarding economic management. I fully appreciate you are blinded by ideological support & can't be impartial on the matter, but it doesn't make your arguments any more compelling. I'm not defending Labour, I'm pointing out your hypocrisy.

Please explain why my personally thinking that Labour is financially incompetent is "hypocrisy".

 

[StriderX]

Please explain why my personally thinking that Labour is financially incompetent is "hypocrisy".

Its only incompetence, if one realises the situation in 2007 before doing something to mitigate...Blair and co. did not, neither did the opposition.

Regardless, its really easy to use rhetoric to justify ones argument for supporting the Tories, fact is that the only downside to labour is the lame-duck leadership through its ranks. (Tories are only marginally more interesting tbh)

 

[Tefal]

The real failing of Labour was to have power & a majority for the time they did & squander it by failing to make a huge impact on inequality, child poverty, targeted infrastructure projects & other traditionally 'left' issues.

and dick about 40 billion away on two rather pointless wars.

that would have been a nice boost to have come the crisis.