Greece Elections

[dowie]

What Greece is going through now could never be described as "relative stability". It's facing zero economic growth, high levels of unemployment, high levels of poverty, and the emigration of all of its skilled workers. If you think that's the sort of thing that leads to a quick recovery then you're going to be surprised.

where have I indicated that I thought a recovery through taking bailouts and implementing austerity measures would be quick?

You're right though, that is, essentially, the choice facing the Greek people. Stay in the Euro under constant pressure from unreasonably unmoving lenders or leave and face total uncertainty. It is a terrible decision that a country must make, but i commend Tsipras for trying to put it to a referendum although probably too late.

I wouldn't commend him at all, he's a weak leader

The strange thing is that i don't even think Germany or the ECB or anyone else really wants Greece to leave. The Euro was supposed to be a union for life, and Greek exit would have huge impacts on the rest of the Euro. Without that promise of stability and certainty a lot of investors are likely to be turned off.

I don't think they've got much choice, they've tried negotiating with the current govt and they get more demands, silly threats and silly tricks/pr stunts like suddenly announcing a referendum... which their negotiating partners only get to hear about in the news.

 

[Nate--IRL--]

...... but i commend Tsipras for trying to put it to a referendum although probably too late.
.

Just to pick up on this, he is abdicating his responsibilty in a rather cowardly fashion. He has called for a referendum about a deal that does not exist. He has also said he is campaigning against this mythical deal telling the electorate to vote No (for something the does not exist)

Rather than working to actually get a deal (good or bad) he simply announced a referendum out of the blue. His negotiating team in the talks, found out about it on twitter for Christ sake.

They drove the car off the cliff, turned around and handed the car keys to the electorate in the back seat.

Nate

 

[Jokester]

Indeed.

 

[deuse]

Note the ELA is about keeping the banks afloat - lending to the Greek state still stops on Tuesday

Nate

I can't see the EU doing that. If Greece leave then it's goodbye EU(thank god)

Greece will be better off leaving the EU in about 8 years time.

 

[Slam62]

At the end of the day, its probably for the best that it is coming to a head, the strange thing is that the eurocrats don't appear to think they have offered anything, yet Tsipras is having a vote on it.
Maybe they are being naive or maybe there will be a last minute deal.

 

[Nate--IRL--]

At the end of the day, its probably for the best that it is coming to a head, the strange thing is that the eurocrats don't appear to think they have offered anything, yet Tsipras is having a vote on it.
Maybe they are being naive or maybe there will be a last minute deal.

There is noting on the table to vote for - this is what makes the whole situation so surreal. Tsipras is in cloud cuckoo land.

Nate

 

[Slam62]

Hmm so what happens on June 30th, isn't that the date when the IMF payment is due? Presumably the Greeks run out of money and defaults, however at least one credit agency has said not paying the IMF would not constitute default.

 

[Jokester]

ECB stops lending money on 30th June to Greek banks in order to maintain consumer withdrawals. Given that there is now a full blown run on the banks they will presumably run out of actual cash in the day or two after. Riots in majors cities by the end of next week.

Edit: In fact it's today that the ECB will apparently stop giving cash to the Greek banks.

 

[Iraklis F.C.]

I think the banks put limits on what people can take out. Must be pretty desperate there now.

you would be surprised, i dont see any desperation and panic at the moment. Why? because only the minority has some money left in the banks and those who do have very little. Greece has reached a point where almost everybody couldnt care less because they have nothing to loose right now.

And for those who say the situation was better before the elections thats a lie, situation was already critical back then.

I, for one, say this muppet show must end, one way or another. This day in day out show drove me nuts. I prefer a quick death rather than a long and suffering one. AT least we can rebuild after this nemesis and lesson learned, keep your god damn currency and central bank.
Lesson learned...


I will only say this, my grandmother aged 85 who have gone through a world war and a civil war that despite being completely poor they had to eat at least something every day and they have never dependent on their parents to live. Thats not the case anymore, imagine what she told me and step back and think for a while if this drama is worth the hassle

 

[dowie]

you would be surprised, i dont see any desperation and panic at the moment. Why? because only the minority has some money left in the banks and those who do have very little. Greece has reached a point where almost everybody couldnt care less because they have nothing to loose right now.

I think that might change unfortunately, you're likely to see a fair bit of drama and panic in a few weeks if there is a grexit.

 

[Iraklis F.C.]

psychologically people are prepared, i know things are going to get hairy. But what can i do about it, what can a single man do in all this madness?

But its going to get worse before it gets better

 

[Slam62]

Surely even if we get grexit, Greek Euros will still be valid Euros like any others so if the Greek people have their Euros somewhere safe (under the mattress) they will still be OK.

 

[dowie]

how long would you be OK for if you lost your job and had just the contents of your bank account withdrawn and stuffed under your mattress?

I'd suspect that if they do exit the euro then social security payments won't be worth too much

 

[Iraklis F.C.]

I will only raise an eyebrow if i get a call from the Army, thats when i will start to worry 100%.

 

[Slam62]

Eurogroup seem to have published some sort of offer, which they say Greece turned down, or something.

Seems like the bailout 'program' ends Tuesday midnight.

I love the smell of back pedalling.

 

[Destination]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33304674

Change of mind. The EU will do anything to keep the club together

Are you reading a different article to me?
Nothing has changed in that article, it reads status quo until Tuesday.

 

[Destination]

Surely even if we get grexit, Greek Euros will still be valid Euros like any others so if the Greek people have their Euros somewhere safe (under the mattress) they will still be OK.

Yes for that month, and next month you won't be paid in euros, you will be paid in magic beans, which no one else bar jack wants.

 

[jkb]

It's certainly not in the EU's interests for countries to think they will be off better if they leave, so I expect Greece to get royally shafted now.

I think they might sacrifice Greece to send a message to the other countries, especially Spain where Podemos has a lot of support and won control of Madrid in the local elections.

 

[George Hincapie]

How much does Greece actually owe?

 

[DIABLO]

I think they might sacrifice Greece to send a message to the other countries, especially Spain where Podemos has a lot of support and won control of Madrid in the local elections.

I tend to agree, i think they will sacrifice them to send a message that the Eurogroup/IMF won't be dictated too by one country let alone a tin pot country like Greece.