Used car advice - big, fast, slick, £3k

danlightbulb

danlightbulb

danlightbulb

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Hi all,

I'm having a dilemma over used car options.

I currently have a 2003 Ford Mondeo TDCi hatchback which is on 190k miles. I've had it 9 years and it was bought by me at 3 years old.

Its getting old and a bit wobbly. I'd like a change.

I've come to understand that the Mondeo is a fairly large car, although it certainly doesn't seem it to me. I have kids and so have bikes and other large things in the boot regularly. The hatchback boot has served me well over the years. I need something at least as big as this.

I've been looking at the BMW 530i, 2001 to 2003 models. Only the sport trim interests me. Test drove a saloon and loved it, but boot (whilst large) still had restricted height. Tourer is the obvious answer but there are not very many around to choose from. One on pistonheads at the moment is £3650 which I think sounds overpriced. £2 to £3k seems the general range for these.

Other than that ive considered the ST220. However these are more pricey, needing up to £5k for a good example. And its still a Mondeo so whilst obviously faster and with the better body kit, fundamentally the same as I have now.

Volvo V70 looks like a hearse. V50 reviews cite it as being too small. Although the 2.5 T5 engine seems reasonably powered and returns low 30's mpg.

Saab 9-5 estates, size ok, looks ok. But they are 4 cyl turbos. For refinement i really wanted to go for a six.

So i'm stuck. I want something that will feel special, yet offer the family space I need.

Any ideas?
 
I can only comment on that ST220 which I had for a year but they are great cars. I sold my mint 2004 for £2650 couple months back. Don't be fooled by all the silly trade prices banging on about how rare they are and charging 4K plus for them. They are quite hard to sell private so you will be able to get many private sellers way down on there asking price and should get a good 2004 for 3k. They are totally different to the normal Mondeo's the whole set up is different and the leather recaro's are great!
I have the ST Focus which has the same engine in that the Volvo T5's you mentioned have I don't think it's as good as the 3.0 V6 in the Mondeo.
No doubt others will tell you the better car is the BMW and to get the 530 but IMO they look so dated now for the money.
Saab's are also a lot of car for the money
 
You'll get a decent st220 estate for £3-3.5k, no need for a £5k budget at all.

It's about the best thing I can think of for the money but some other suggestions:

Legacy spec B (circa £4k I'd say)
Forester XT (look horrendous, good engine)
Saab 95 if you don't mind a car that doesn't handle
Octavia Vrs (£4k is probably just about enough for a mk2 estate)

Personally I don't think you'll find a 530i touring that doesn't need some work - for pretty much any money. They're great cars but they're also old cars now, and will have niggly issues to sort. That said I'd happily have one, but i'd be doing all the work myself
 
I really rate the looks of the E39 530i, but it looks better in saloon than touring (as do most cars). Maybe I'm not seeing it clearly. Is it an old man's car?

Re the ST220, I'd only be looking for the post late 2005 facelift models with the red interior trim and slightly different bodykit. These obviously are a bit newer so a bit more money. Refuse to pay £490 VED though, so only cars up to March 06 are viable, which is a small window to look at. It won't feel drastically different to my current Mondeo though in terms of size or premium feel. Power and driveability yes obviously.
 
The cheap 530i tourings hide plenty of work that needs doing on what are now very old cars. The cheap ones are false economy and good ones are so rare that they do sell for up to 4k. By the time you bring a cheapy up to scratch its cost you that anyway.

I have a 530i saloon which I have had for 9 years. It is an excellent car but the amount of irritating niggly stuff that goes wrong as they age gets increasingly annoying.
 
Fast. Cheap. Reliable. Pick two.

As Fox says, 5 series BMW's at that price range are either well looked after and towards £5k and don't hang about for long or have some potentially costly hidden problems.
 
Won't any car in the age range I'm looking at have niggly issues? My Mondeo always needs a couple of things doing to it each year, whether its brake lines or bushes or track rod ends. Always something. Never a great amount of money, circa £200 to £300 average per job probably, but always something.

Unless I'm buying a significantly newer car then I can't see how I can get away from this. It would be a risk buying a 5 year old 100k miler, as at that point in their lives they are always coming up to some quite major repairs. Clutches, alternators, PAS pumps.


MissChief said:
Fast. Cheap. Reliable. Pick two.
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With all due respect this is a terrible analogy and I hear it a lot. Even a 5 year old M5 at £30k (or whatever they are 2nd hand) is likely to need significant money spending on it. Its fast but neither cheap nor reliable. Then we have stuff like Honda's, which can be all three. Price is generally just a function of age and mileage, condition 3rd. Name a used car that is fast and reliable?
 
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Sounds like u want/expect too much for your 3k budget. Just save up to something like 4K which will get u a better range.
All I would look at with your budget is a 2004 ST220! don't know why u only want the facelift it only had some chrome tat added to the grill and handles. Other than that u might get a Jag X Type 3.0 Sport on a 2004 or maybe a 2005 Saab or Volvo but u don't like the estate and the S40 would be too small.
 
I did have a 5k budget but was advised to spend less and have some in the bank for repairs and maintenance. I could save for a little longer and go to 4k. What could I get then? The real issue here is spending more will get me a newer car, but that newer car is approaching the point in its life where it needs major repairs, not just niggly things fixing. Older cars will have most of these major things done and the niggly bits are left yes but they are cheaper to do.

rodenal said:
Legacy spec B (circa £4k I'd say)
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Great suggestion - but the ones ive seen for sale have are in the highest tax bracket. Plus mpg is in the low 20's combined. Think will be too costly to run.
 
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danlightbulb said:
Won't any car in the age range I'm looking at have niggly issues? My Mondeo always needs a couple of things doing to it each year, whether its brake lines or bushes or track rod ends. Always something. Never a great amount of money, circa £200 to £300 average per job probably, but always something.

Unless I'm buying a significantly newer car then I can't see how I can get away from this. It would be a risk buying a 5 year old 100k miler, as at that point in their lives they are always coming up to some quite major repairs. Clutches, alternators, PAS pumps.
Click to expand...

There's definitely something in this, but I would say the BMW is more likely to leave you wondering why every time you sort the list of little issues it has grown yet again or you notice another little item that you think could be doing with changing in advance.

You'd certainly spend far more time underneath an e39 than a legacy estate, and more money on parts than the Ford (though most common components are pretty reasonable really)
 
danlightbulb said:
Won't any car in the age range I'm looking at have niggly issues? My Mondeo always needs a couple of things doing to it each year, whether its brake lines or bushes or track rod ends. Always something. Never a great amount of money, circa £200 to £300 average per job probably, but always something.

Unless I'm buying a significantly newer car then I can't see how I can get away from this. It would be a risk buying a 5 year old 100k miler, as at that point in their lives they are always coming up to some quite major repairs. Clutches, alternators, PAS pumps.




With all due respect this is a terrible analogy and I hear it a lot. Even a 5 year old M5 at £30k (or whatever they are 2nd hand) is likely to need significant money spending on it. Its fast but neither cheap nor reliable. Then we have stuff like Honda's, which can be all three. Price is generally just a function of age and mileage, condition 3rd. Name a used car that is fast and reliable?
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Nissan GTR? Not heard much about any problems unless you start modifying. I'd expect a £30k M5 to be pretty reliable too. Hence fast and reliable, just not cheap.

When you get to less than £5k then it becomes particularly true. Even something like a Honda CTR at that age/price is likely to need money spent at some point. My Leon Cupra 180 has needed some work(front spring, some exhaust work and regular stuff) and it's now 11 years old. Whether it's really classed as 'fast' is another question mind you.
 
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MissChief said:
Nissan GTR? Not heard much about any problems unless you start modifying. I'd expect a £30k M5 to be pretty reliable too. Hence fast and reliable, just not cheap.
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I used the newish M5 example so my fault here. Its harder to see how this applies to older cars as an older M5 will not be reliable to run nor cheap, but if you're buying a 400bhp monster then running costs are not a concern.

Daily family cars 10 years old the analogy doesn't really work as well, as everything half decent is in the 2k to 5k price range. You could argue an ST220 would be pretty much all three? It may need the odd repair but the repairs will be fairly cheap. If I didn't already have a mondeo I'm sure it would be top of the list.

Im getting the impression that the 530i will need much more frequent odd repairs. Whilst each job will be reasonably priced, the frequency of them will add up.

Legacy spec B would be top of the list if it wasn't for mpg and tax. Anything similar but a tax bracket down and approaching 30mpg?



mjt said:
Is the tax really that bad? In the grand scheme of things £200 over a year is hardly a lot, is it?
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£290 tax bracket (£25 a month) is acceptable and very common in <2006 performance saloons / estates. Post 2006 the same cars hit the £490 / £505 tax brackets and is not acceptable (almost £50 per month).
 
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danlightbulb said:
Won't any car in the age range I'm looking at have niggly issues? My Mondeo always needs a couple of things doing to it each year, whether its brake lines or bushes or track rod ends. Always something. Never a great amount of money, circa £200 to £300 average per job probably, but always something.

Unless I'm buying a significantly newer car then I can't see how I can get away from this. It would be a risk buying a 5 year old 100k miler, as at that point in their lives they are always coming up to some quite major repairs. Clutches, alternators, PAS pumps.
Click to expand...

I bought it as a 4 year old high miler, it is now a 14 year old 200k miler and it really got to the stage where the frequency of yet more stuff going wrong was leading me to resent the car, which is a shame as I really like it. It just got me questioning what was the point - if I was going to sink sometimes thousands of quid into keeping a car on the road each year why drive an old one? One day I found myself on the train as I didn't fancy taking the 530i on a particularly long trip incase yet something else went wrong which when I realised perhaps it was time for retirement.

So I relegated it to occasional use to keep it nice and now drive a current model 5 Series instead, which has cost £0 in repairs but instead costs me in depreciation - though not exactly miles more than I was spending fixing the 530i.

If you are happy to blow loads of cash keeping an E39 on the road they are fantastic cars but then if you are happy to do that why are you looking at cheap cars, just buy a more expensive one. Most of the examples for sale are for sale as the owners have realised this and therefore most of them need extensive behind the scenes refurbishment - ie complete suspension refreshes, etc.

The E39 is a wonderful car - my favourite BMW ever which is why I still have it - but I can't see its value as a daily driver now unless you are very much a home mechanics enthusiast and you enjoy tinkering. I don't and I was paying somebody else to do repairs.
 
^^ makes total sense Fox and I understand the argument. Although the one I test drove seemed in excellent condition (had done 105k miles). A bit of rust developing on the sills and bumper. The one currently on PH for sale at £3.6k has done 125k miles, has a long list of £ spent.

So I should get the newer legacy spec B for a couple k more, stump up for the extra VED and fuel, and expect that over a few years that would be the cheaper total cost of ownership? Edit - no, just can't do it. 23 mpg is too low. I do 12k a year and that would cost me too much.
 
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If you can do work yourself I'd expect the real world cost if both to be fairly even , but where I would expect there go be a big difference is in the annoyance of spending a lot of time fixing small issues vs spending the occasional sum of money on the Subaru.

I have probably spent about as much cash on the fn2 over a similar period of time as I did my e46, but I've had the wheels off the Honda about 3 timed in a year and a half vs a couple of times a month on the BMW

I'd have another though - just not as my only car

The other thing about ved is that if you really want you can pay it monthly now for a very small

It won't do 23mpg either unless you kick around town in it for a lot of your journey. High 20's, the e39 isn't much different
 
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The stated combined mpg is 27 for the 530i and 23 for the Legacy.

I do pay my VED monthly. Currently pay £13. E39 would be £25 ish. Spec B would be £45 ish. Its a big hike and starts to become very noticeable in my monthly bank statements.


Any other cars i should be looking at? The Honda accord estate was an option (I forget the engine variant but it was pretty powerful), but not many around again. I could save for a bit longer to get an extra couple k if that helps things.
 
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To be fair, the tax cost is the least of your worries when looking at this budget. I don't get why some people rule cars out for around £60p per day in tax. If the car is nice, then it is probably worth it. It may well be cheaper too as most everyone else is put off by the, essentially tiny, tax premium.

When you are talking up around the £4k range, you can break into A4 2.0T Quattro Avant territory. That should fulfill your requirements, but I realise VAG motors aren't for everyone.

Or A6 Avant? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2005-05-A...ate-6-Speed-/131618597421?hash=item1ea5146a2d

Not the most economical, and I don't consider them fast, but then nothing you have been looking at I consider fast either. It's probably about average for power vs economy compared to what you're looking at. With ~250 BHP and mid to late 20's on MPG, on average (I hold no regard for the "on a run" figures, as they are essentially useless when talking about actual fuel costs.

Or you could go a bit older, and get the 2.7 twin turbo engine that was in the old S4... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2002-AUDI...ULL-HISTORY-/111793459702?hash=item1a0768d1f6
 
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