North Wales Police deliberately mow down dog

Washout said:
Some moronic folk seem to be portraying the policemen as blood thirsty scumbags who're high fiving eachother over what they had to do. I'd rather think as dog owners themselves they've woken up rather upset at what they were forced to do.
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"Those moronic folk" who think the force mishandled the incident. :rolleyes:

Where did anyone say/imply that they think the officers involved were blood thirsty scumbags. Claiming other people judgement is poor whilst throwing personal insults, nice.

Burnsy2023 said:
You seem very sure of that considering you know so little about what happened. Dog handlers don't take a Dr Dolittle course....
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Would have understood the dog considerably more than your average bobby.
 
thebennyboy said:
I think there is a conflict of interest here considering your profession and that you're likely to be unhappy about someone wanting to complain about a force's conduct.
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I think it is more like he has the most experience with these situations and has the least biased view as he has not only worked as a copper but has also not been one. He understands how incidences can be portrayed differently by the media and that from his experiences, some situations cannot guarantee a safe outcome while pleasing everyone.

Personal insults have been thrown by both sides so far in the thread.
 
leaskovski said:
As someone who had to have his dog put down at the weekend,

I understand you've had an emotional event, but you cannot insult people.

Our dog had only been in the family for 4~5 years. He was a rescue, and in that time he was part of the family. He has left a 33kg hole in our household. My daughter every morning this week has gone downstairs and called for him, shouting his name and looking sad.

Just because you can't bond with anything but your right hand, don't assume that a dog doesn't mean anything to its owners.
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You need to learn that not everyone likes the same things you do.
As for dog's and cat's etc I would never harm one , but I have zero interest in owning one so go and take your "bonding" ****e somewhere else.

Simple fact is a dog was loose on a main road and could have caused an accident which may have resulted in the death or possible permanent injury of a human which I hold in higher regard over the death of a dog.
 
Burnsy2023 said:
You seem very sure of that considering you know so little about what happened. Dog handlers don't take a Dr Dolittle course....
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The other thing is police dogs are trained to heel and come when called, not bite them on the hand when attempting to do so. I imagine they'd do the same thing too given the same situation and a potential risk to life.
 
I can't believe people think this is some dark rural road in deepest darkest Wales.

It is a very well lit straight and wide dual carriageway, the visibility is excellent, the traffic at 3am would have been negligible, the two vehicles that 'swerved' would probably have been the only two on the road at the time. If you did swerve to avoid it there would have been no other car to hit unless you waited 5-20mins for it to turn up. The only time there's ever any sort of 'Traffic' there is on a Bank Holiday week-end or when one of the Irish Ferries is due in or going out

It is 15mins away from North Wales Police Headquarters, and you can regularly see two or more Traffic Cars every few miles on the A55 during the day, they like to hide on the overpasses at night.

I simply do not believe they could not have managed the situation without inhumanely killing the dog or even capturing it alive, it reeks of either incompetence or pure laziness.
 
thebennyboy said:
no doubt this will come back to bite them.
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Troll-Face-psd62868.png
 
doofer said:
I can't believe people think this is some dark rural road in deepest darkest Wales.

It is a very well lit straight and wide dual carriageway, the visibility is excellent, the traffic at 3am would have been negligible, the two vehicles that 'swerved' would probably have been the only two on the road at the time. If you did swerve to avoid it there would have been no other car to hit unless you waited 5-20mins for it to turn up. The only time there's ever any sort of 'Traffic' there is on a Bank Holiday week-end or when one of the Irish Ferries is due in or going out

It is 15mins away from North Wales Police Headquarters, and you can regularly see two or more Traffic Cars every few miles on the A55 during the day, they like to hide on the overpasses at night.

I simply do not believe they could not have managed the situation without inhumanely killing the dog or even capturing it alive, it reeks of either incompetence or pure laziness.
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It ran into the middle of the unlit road forcing traffic, including a car and HGV to swerve to avoid it while officers were on foot on the carriageway.
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Cant blame people for reading OP link
 
doofer said:
I can't believe people think this is some dark rural road in deepest darkest Wales.

It is a very well lit straight and wide dual carriageway, the visibility is excellent, the traffic at 3am would have been negligible, the two vehicles that 'swerved' would probably have been the only two on the road at the time. If you did swerve to avoid it there would have been no other car to hit unless you waited 5-20mins for it to turn up. The only time there's ever any sort of 'Traffic' there is on a Bank Holiday week-end or when one of the Irish Ferries is due in or going out
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https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.2...4!1sEnkOQFnIKTRFiy344B0DNw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Plenty of places along that stretch where it could run off onto other roads, overgrown areas close to the carriage way, large junctions, etc. etc.
 
Can't help but feel for the police in this situation. Guaranteed lose-lose situation if they had let the dog carry on wandering and it had caused a potentially fatal accident. If they had shot it as a number of people are suggesting in this thread there would still be outrage. If they had closd the carriageway there would be outrage 'because it's closed enough already why close it again just for a dog'. etc etc
 
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Burnsy2023 said:
You seem very sure of that considering you know so little about what happened. Dog handlers don't take a Dr Dolittle course....
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Interesting, given that nobody here was there to witness what happened.

doofer said:
I can't believe people think this is some dark rural road in deepest darkest Wales.

It is a very well lit straight and wide dual carriageway, the visibility is excellent, the traffic at 3am would have been negligible, the two vehicles that 'swerved' would probably have been the only two on the road at the time. If you did swerve to avoid it there would have been no other car to hit unless you waited 5-20mins for it to turn up. The only time there's ever any sort of 'Traffic' there is on a Bank Holiday week-end or when one of the Irish Ferries is due in or going out

It is 15mins away from North Wales Police Headquarters, and you can regularly see two or more Traffic Cars every few miles on the A55 during the day, they like to hide on the overpasses at night.

I simply do not believe they could not have managed the situation without inhumanely killing the dog or even capturing it alive, it reeks of either incompetence or pure laziness.
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Speaking as someone who has sat for 45 minutes very late at night on a road (which was well lit and being one of three cars, literally more police cars than public cars) while the police 'rounded up a small pig', I would lean towards this being close to what happened.

I think they could have handled the situation more humanely, and possibly without killing the animal.
 
thebennyboy said:
NWP's statement claims that it happened on an unlit stretch of road between the Conwy Tunnel and the Llanfairfechan roundabout, there is no segment of that stretch of the A55 which isn't lit.
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If google image search is anything to go by those lights aren't actually on much in dark conditions :S

EDIT: Apparently some sections (not at junctions) the overhead lights are off between midnight and 5am?
 
thebennyboy said:
"Those moronic folk" who think the force mishandled the incident. :rolleyes:

Where did anyone say/imply that they think the officers involved were blood thirsty scumbags. Claiming other people judgement is poor whilst throwing personal insults, nice.



Would have understood the dog considerably more than your average bobby.
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Folk talking about karma for the policemen? Even saying "swerve and protect", while an amusing pun implies it's their preferred course of action. If that were the case they would be bloodthirsty cretins. They've already chased it on the motorway, something I'd imagine that's already above and beyond!

Again, you're talking about them taking courses of action that will take time. How long to get a specialist dog handler out? Assuming they could even get a hunting dog under control!
How many vehicles will be endangered before they can safely close the road both ways? If a lorry has already had to swerve plus another car then that's probably two too many.
 
Rroff said:
If google image search is anything to go by those lights aren't actually on much in dark conditions :S

EDIT: Apparently some sections (not at junctions) the overhead lights are off between midnight and 5am?
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Not sure on that one, i assumed they were always turned on. If that's the case then they could probably have overridden the set times remotely. Ironically they recently upgraded the lighting in and around one of the tunnels and actually plan on doing the other soon. :p
 
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Oh they could have just overridden them remotely? Just like they could have got tazer trained officers, specialist dog handlers, zoo staff, firearms officers or closed the road at the drop of a hat?

What aren't you grasping? They had an animal roaming loose on a major road that could have endangered lives. All those other solutions suggested take time, money and or have logistical difficulties. In the time it would take for any of them to be set up someone could have died.
The police officers removed the problem quickly and safely for the public. That is good.
Yes it's sad a dog died but it shouldn't have been there. Or would you like to go to a families house to explain why someone wasn't coming home because they'd crashed at 70mph avoiding a loose animal? Because that's the potential alternative you keep ignoring.
 
I do love reading all the arm chair experts ideas, like all of these wouldn't have been considered both by the officers on the ground and the higher ups in the control room.

It's all very well to get all preachy riding your high horse round your living room.
 
They should have stopped all traffic within 20 miles, called army and station people at the perimeter while traffic is airlifted away to clear obstructions and maintain the safety of the dog. Then they should slowly close the perimeter until they trap the dog between the arms of caring men with soft protective gear ensuring the dog is captured humanely and with love and care. It should then receive a monthly allowance of dog treats due to the traumatic events which occurred.

Am I doing it right?
 
Dis86 said:
Oh they could have just overridden them remotely? Just like they could have got tazer trained officers, specialist dog handlers, zoo staff, firearms officers or closed the road at the drop of a hat?

What aren't you grasping? They had an animal roaming loose on a major road that could have endangered lives. All those other solutions suggested take time, money and or have logistical difficulties. In the time it would take for any of them to be set up someone could have died.
The police officers removed the problem quickly and safely for the public. That is good.
Yes it's sad a dog died but it shouldn't have been there. Or would you like to go to a families house to explain why someone wasn't coming home because they'd crashed at 70mph avoiding a loose animal? Because that's the potential alternative you keep ignoring.
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Most of the A55 immediately surrounding the conwy tunnel and the other two tunnels have a 50MPH limit so they would have been breaking the speed limit.

The fact that all the alternatives supposedly failed either means they didn't bother with them, or they all weren't available which is very unlikely. The road is covered with CCTV cameras and there are many dot-matrix screens along that stretch of road that can be activated by Traffic Wales at any time of day, so saying "it takes time" doesn't sound like the truth. The first people to know about it were probably the traffic controllers who monitor the cameras and can activate the dot-matrix signs to warn motorists straight away. They probably were used to warn motorists, what's to say the people that supposedly nearly hit the animal ignored the warnings? Who's to blame then?

EDIT: It's become abundantly obvious that i'm preeching to the choir at this point.
 
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It doesn't really matter whether it was the easier option than the alternatives, intentionally running over a dog with a car can't be legal.
 
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