Cycle Lanes: Right of Way

Minstadave · 3 Aug 2016 at 19:35

Amp34 said:
TBF it sounds more like the OP is just walking into a carriageway without looking to see if a vehicle is coming. If he did that on a road he would probably been mown down by now.

In that situation a cyclist has every right to say WTF are you doing.

It'll be some middle aged self-righteous Lycra wearing monstrosity carrying out his hobby on a public highway at the inconvenience of others.

Grognak · 3 Aug 2016 at 21:01

Tefal said:
pedestrians always come first as they are the most vulnerable.

you should never be going so fast you cannot stop in a sensible distance.

goes for every form of transport.

vehicle hits stationary pedestrian...vehicles fault.

should have reported him.

Any law to refer to for this? common sense doesn't have much weight when it comes to legalities.

Grognak · 3 Aug 2016 at 21:02

slightly off topic but if im halfway through a zebra crossing and a car passes me close by so I jump back on the ground, is he in the wrong for damages?

Murf · 3 Aug 2016 at 21:12

PermaBanned said:
On a related note, what would you do here? I've often been in the cycle lane going straight on, but had cars cut in front of me at the last second to turn left. Seems like it could be very dangerous, aren't they supposed to give way?

Ah Regent Centre.

. As a cyclist, if the traffic was moving through, I'd take the middle of the left lane just before the junction to avoid getting potentially swiped. If it was stationary, I'd use the cycle lane to get into the advanced stop bit for cyclists. As a motorist, if I was turning left, I'd indicate very early, and check my mirror several times on the approach, and be absolutely certain no cyclist was hooning up the cycle lane.

In short, as a cyclist I'd assume a motorist was about to do something dumb, and as a motorist, I'd be waiting for an idiot out on his bike to appear out of nowhere ignoring my indication!

undergroove said:
I've taken the lane before, at that junction... pulling out of the cycle lane.

Most cars seem to ignore the Advanced Stop Line there too, as well as the fairly clear markings.

On the flipside, I've also biffed another car when turning left (aye, my fault), after car in front stopped and I wasn't driving with full care and attention, not having seen the pedestrian run across the road in front of him!

A rubbish junction, on a rubbish road... will be amusing to see how they handle the Blue House Roundabout changes further on.

Indeed. Although they're tackling the double roundabouts at South Gosforth (Haddrick's Mill) first. About time too as they're the most dangerous junctions in the North East for cyclists.

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/newcastles-most-hated-road-junction-11179698
http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/local-news/gosforth-road-branded-most-dangerous-1363681

PermaBanned said:
Oh god yeah, the proposals as they are are ridiculous. Thankfully the Newcastle Central MP seems to be against them too and she'll be meeting the council to discuss them. Really just needs some clearer lane markings, maybe some traffic lights and widening - which you could do by moving the pedestrian and cycle paths to the other side of the tree line and away from the large volume of fast moving traffic.

I don't mind the plans. It's the busiest junction in Newcastle, and an absolute nightmare for cyclists. Newcastle City Council is on a mission to eliminate most roundabouts and replace with lights. That might be worse for us in the middle of the night when there's no traffic, but they're much better for controlling flow when it's busy.

https://www.newcastle.gov.uk/news-s...grade-blue-house-and-haddricks-mill-announced

DaleTheWhale · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:08

PermaBanned said:
On a related note, what would you do here? I've often been in the cycle lane going straight on, but had cars cut in front of me at the last second to turn left. Seems like it could be very dangerous, aren't they supposed to give way?

100% take the lane 10-20 metres before reaching the start of that junction then move back over once you reach just before the lights, that's what I would do, safest for everyone and make's you visible as cars are forced behind you, not next to you.

SexyGreyFox · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:15

Minstadave said:
It'll be some middle aged self-righteous Lycra wearing monstrosity carrying out his hobby on a public highway at the inconvenience of others.

Not during the week, they are usually called commuters, most own cars and can get to work quicker on a cycle.
The type you are on about go out on a Sunday morning.

Minstadave · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:17

SexyGreyFox said:
Not during the week, they are usually called commuters, most own cars and can get to work quicker on a cycle.
The type you are on about go out on a Sunday morning.

In Rutland they've out every day

Nevakonaza · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:23

Nasher said:
By law your supposed to have a bell and lights. A few years ago there was a big crackdown in Cambridge on cyclists by the police and people were getting fined for not having them (as well as riding on footpaths).

Its the opposite where i live,police dont care..i ride on the path always,I dont have a bell..i do have lights though and dont ride like a idiot fast on the pavement.

I was stopped one night by the police but that was just to ask what i was doing out at 3am,Told them i was on my way to work and off i went with no issue,They didn't even say anything about me been on the pavement.

And to be honest,i couldn't give two flying ducks if they had given me a fine or something..im safer on the pavement,especially how they drive around here giving cyclists no space,no cycle lanes etc.

Orionaut · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:27

I have to say, I have always wondered what the logic is of the "Forward Boxes" for cyclists at junctions actually is?

"Lets encourage the slowest and most vulnerable road users to go to the front of the queue so that everybody else now has to get past them when the lights change"

(I have no problem with forward boxes for Motorcyclists)

Even better!

"Lets encourage all the slowest and most vulnerable road users to filter their way to the front of the queue, getting past people who have already passed them before, so that they are now going to have to do so all over again"!

:rolleyes:

SexyGreyFox · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:36

Orionaut said:
"Lets encourage the slowest and most vulnerable road users to go to the front of the queue so that everybody else now has to get past them when the lights change"[/I]"!

Even at my age I'm usually at the opposite traffic lights before the car by my side has put it into gear.

Nexus · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:38

Orionaut said:
I have to say, I have always wondered what the logic is of the "Forward Boxes" for cyclists at junctions actually is?

"Lets encourage the slowest and most vulnerable road users to go to the front of the queue so that everybody else now has to get past them when the lights change"

(I have no problem with forward boxes for Motorcyclists)

Even better!

"Lets encourage all the slowest and most vulnerable road users to filter their way to the front of the queue, getting past people who have already passed them before, so that they are now going to have to do so all over again"!

I guess you don't cycle, as otherwise you would realise it's quite sensible for a number of reasons:

- If you filter into the ASL box, it lessens the chance of somebody turning left on the Cyclist at the junction. This is one of the most common cycling deaths with lorries involved.

- On a multi-lane carriageway, a Cyclist is likely to be in the left lane (or cycle lane) as other vehicles will be moving faster. By entering the ASL, this puts them into a position where they can now be in the furthest across lane if they intend to turn right, which lessens the danger of crossing lanes in fast moving traffic.

- A third benefit is that you are not sat behind vehicles inhaling their exhaust fumes.

I would also add that things are changing, in London for example, many recently updated junctions on routes heavily used by Cyclists have a traffic light indicator for Cyclists that goes just a bit before the main lights, to allow them to set off. I would imagine we will start to see more of that in cities.

PermaBanned · 3 Aug 2016 at 22:46

Orionaut said:
I have to say, I have always wondered what the logic is of the "Forward Boxes" for cyclists at junctions actually is?

"Lets encourage the slowest and most vulnerable road users to go to the front of the queue so that everybody else now has to get past them when the lights change"

(I have no problem with forward boxes for Motorcyclists)

Even better!

"Lets encourage all the slowest and most vulnerable road users to filter their way to the front of the queue, getting past people who have already passed them before, so that they are now going to have to do so all over again"!

The main advantage is that it greatly improves visibility at junctions, especially for HGVs. It prevents other motorists from assuming the coast is clear just because they see a break in the traffic, which is how a lot of cycle related accidents occur. And it gives cyclists a safe opportunity to turn right without having to take the lane, which many inexperienced cyclists are uncomfortable with when they can't go at the same speed as the traffic to change lanes. Supposedly they're surprisingly effective at reducing the number of incidents.

Greebo · 3 Aug 2016 at 23:10

Nevakonaza said:
Its the opposite where i live,police dont care..i ride on the path always,I dont have a bell..i do have lights though and dont ride like a idiot fast on the pavement.

I was stopped one night by the police but that was just to ask what i was doing out at 3am,Told them i was on my way to work and off i went with no issue,They didn't even say anything about me been on the pavement.

And to be honest,i couldn't give two flying ducks if they had given me a fine or something..im safer on the pavement,especially how they drive around here giving cyclists no space,no cycle lanes etc.

That's slack it should have been a fixed penalty ticket for that

sneakysnail · 4 Aug 2016 at 00:50

speaking of right of way, any one else agree that we should have roads that are bicycle free? we have restrictions where HGV's can go and you can't take a bike on the motorway why should you be allowed to go on a 50-60 mph main road between two towns and clog the roads up? drives me insane, on an empty road my commute is 15 mins, at normal commuter times without bikes its 20ish, with all the bikes during the summer it's 30-35mins. It wouldn't be so bad if they put some effort into it but these cyclists don't want to break a sweat or take the back roads like the normal sane non ******** cyclists do. Seems like the only way to stop them is to ban them from the road, god knows how much abuse they get everyday.

Amp34 · 4 Aug 2016 at 01:09

Once we create more car free roads in town I'm all ears.

v0n · 4 Aug 2016 at 02:16

edit, already said

pitkin · 4 Aug 2016 at 07:03

Some people do seem to think it's fine to just step out in front of cyclists though. They wouldn't do it to a car. As a pedestrian you are supposed to make sure it's safe to cross the road before you step off the pavement. As a road user you are not supposed to make any maneuver that would cause another road user to have to suddenly change direction or make a sudden stop.
Honestly, cyclists appear to be easy targets to some people, but there are many idiots on the roads, whether it's on two or four wheels, or even pedestrians. Some people just seem to have a lack of consideration for others on the roads nowadays.
There are a lot of inconsiderate, arrogant cyclists, but then the exact same can be said for car drivers and pedestrians as well.

Greebo · 4 Aug 2016 at 07:08

Agreed. You have the remember that a cycle is treated as a carriage in law and pretty much the same as a car.

So if the op had said there was a three lane road and he often goes and stands in the middle of the first lane waiting for a gap in the traffic in lanes two and three and cars keep coming along in his lane and start touting their horn and shouting abuse, would he be surprised?

SexyGreyFox · 4 Aug 2016 at 07:42

pitkin said:
Some people do seem to think it's fine to just step out in front of cyclists though. They wouldn't do it to a car.

I can't count how many times I've said "Would you have done that if I was a car?" to pedestrians and motorists or to pedestrians "Good job I wasn't a car".

slinxy · 4 Aug 2016 at 08:32

Tell me just clear something up, the cycle lane I'm taking about is part of the pavement, and as my legal friend has confirmed to me; should be considered as part of the pavement and not one of the ones that are part of the road; that's on the other side.