Armchair Lawyers Part 2: Sacking a new staff member

james.miller said:
That would suggest there has been previous meetings and the employee already knows what's up.

correct me if im wrong?
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Yeah maybe so, so fire them off now or at least tell them their contract isnt being renewed so they can try and find another job.

Dont use and abuse them for minimum wage and then stiff them at the last.
 
Are there other people employed doing the same role for the same pay, that are performing to the company's expectations better, without taking taking shortcuts to the detriment of themselves (eg. not taking their minimum 20min break for working more than six hours) and/or the company?

At these previous meeting before this "final" one, has the employee not only been told what is upsetting management, but also been given coaching to rectify any quality/performance issues?
 
MooMoo444 said:
If you have various reasons then just give them their notice. It is only a week or so.
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If they can cause issues within the business then I would send them away that day with the weeks pay - I've worked places where someone has been put on notice (2 weeks and 1 month) and they've ended up causing issues, not only with other staff but some instances hiding or even (we think) destroying source documents.

If they are client facing or in a position to cause issues to the business it is just better to send them packing, with their pay, immediately (get Systems Dept to lock their login as well).

I have had one situation similar to OP in last 5 years and just apologised that it wasn't working, wished them the best and told them they would have to go immediately. They were escorted from the business. It was pretty horrible but they were client facing so could really have done some damage (turns out she was that type of person to do such a thing).
 
They dont work in an office, they work for a cleaning/garden clearing company. Their pay is minimal and OP stated:

It's not working out for various reasons, they're to blame, we're to blame it doesn't matter, what does matter is we've given them the opportunity and unfortunately in this situation it's not worked out as we'd both hoped
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Which probably means that OP expected something of them that was not agreed on when originally employed. Due to the employee not fulfilling the request eg. working times they are unable to work or whatever, they want to sack them after the busy period but want to do it without seeming unfair.

The fact he is asking this question is proof that he feels the situation could result in him being accused of unfair dismissal.

You see it all the time, 6 month trial contracts on minimal wage prior to Christmas just to reap extra profits, then axe the employee so they maximise their own profits during a quieter period.
 
Funny thing is, never bothered looking at OP profile a while ago. Genuinely know one of the girls that work (or use to?) for the business, as its only in Woking and i am round the corner in Weybridge.

Its a small world, too small to post on the internet asking for ways to get a free pass when they want to dismiss someone despite accepting some blame for the situation.
 
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Surfer said:
Its a shame you felt they were good enough to work basically 4 months for you and then just decide its not working. Nice of you to let them work over Xmas though...

When will you tell them it ain't working? Xmas eve?

If you were a decent employer you would try give them as much notice as possible...so they can find another job.
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i'll be telling them tonight, with the idea of giving them up to xmas to go. It's not xmas that they'd be working but up the break before xmas and when they find another job they can go before then if they'd like. happy she'd have enough time to find another job now?
 
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james.miller said:
That would suggest there has been previous meetings and the employee already knows what's up.

correct me if im wrong?
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that is correct. everyone over analyses on this forum and fills the blanks with their own ideas.


nick.lidgett said:
Exactly, sounds like pure greed to me, keep them on for the busy run up to xmas and then give them the bullet just before they break for the holidays. really nice.

Im glad I dont work for the OP, his whole post stinks.
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Again you've filled in the blanks with your own ideas. The christmas run is the quietest time of year for us. We make a loss in fact some times over Christmas. If it was greed, i'd get rid of them now and not replace. I'll be replacing this person the second they go so costs are identical.
 
Given your previous thread about spying on employees to catch them out and recording what they do on the PC, its not surprising people will jump to conclusions of you being an unfair boss.
 
Why don't you try employing someone part time to look after your HR instead of posting on a forum that your going to sack someone?

I'm sure there are companies out there that act like umbrella HR and look after lot's of little companies like yourself that can deal with this situation and inform the employee also.
 
becuase it really is a simply question that doesn't need too much analysis. people will know the answer. Just as the same if i've got a question regarding a website and need help to check it, yeah i could go to a company that does this thing, or i could ask ocuk coders for some quick help :)
 
Fairly sure the answer is no said:
becuase it really is a simply question that doesn't need too much analysis. people will know the answer. Just as the same if i've got a question regarding a website and need help to check it, yeah i could go to a company that does this thing, or i could ask ocuk coders for some quick help :)
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If you're relying on a computer forum for employment law advice on how to shaft your employees and whatever else then perhaps you should consider a job that doesn't involve you having direct impacts on other people's lives.
 
[FnG]magnolia;30217706 said:
If you're relying on a computer forum for employment law advice on how to shaft your employees and whatever else then perhaps you should consider a job that doesn't involve you having direct impacts on other people's lives.
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Grave digger?
 
People are being hard on OP, unless you've managed staff yourself then you probably don't understand just how poor some people can be, sometimes you do need to let people go. I do wonder how much the OP has attempted to help the employee improve to the required standard though, given they've only been there since September
 
Fairly sure the answer is no said:
that is correct. everyone over analyses on this forum and fills the blanks with their own ideas.




Again you've filled in the blanks with your own ideas. The christmas run is the quietest time of year for us. We make a loss in fact some times over Christmas. If it was greed, i'd get rid of them now and not replace. I'll be replacing this person the second they go so costs are identical.
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DONT LEAVE BLANKS THEN :mad:
 
Technically you can give no reason. It is bad form though and good practice to give a reason even if you arent legally required to do so.
 
To get back on topic, most people would follow a three stage process of dismissal in a clear-cut case: let the person know you're considering it, hold a meeting to discuss the situation and let them come back to you with something, an appeal of sorts. As we're still in the probationary waters, it really isn't that complicated. Then you either give them that extra chance to improve or hand them their notice under the terms of your contract. Be fair and don't string your employee along if it's clearly not working and isn't going to work going forward. An extensive written confirmation of dismissal with reasons for it isn't really a requirement for anyone with <2 years' worth of service at the company. Indeed, the trial period is designed to establish whether both of you are suitable for each other as employer/employee.
 
Avenged7Fold said:
They dont work in an office, they work for a cleaning/garden clearing company. Their pay is minimal and OP stated:

Which probably means that OP expected something of them that was not agreed on when originally employed. Due to the employee not fulfilling the request eg. working times they are unable to work or whatever, they want to sack them after the busy period but want to do it without seeming unfair.

The fact he is asking this question is proof that he feels the situation could result in him being accused of unfair dismissal.

You see it all the time, 6 month trial contracts on minimal wage prior to Christmas just to reap extra profits, then axe the employee so they maximise their own profits during a quieter period.
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Agree 100%. The OP is admitting to not telling the full story which gets alarm bells ringing. He/She is hoping they can sack someone "for not working out" yet if they are so bad why keep them on until just before Xmas.

OP wants to basically shaft someone and came here asking is it legally OK.
 
ICDP said:
Agree 100%. The OP is admitting to not telling the full story which gets alarm bells ringing. He/She is hoping they can sack someone "for not working out" yet if they are so bad why keep them on until just before Xmas.

OP wants to basically shaft someone and came here asking is it legally OK.
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From previous threads by the OP, I wouldn't be surprised if this assessment is accurate.
 
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