NHS holds on to top spot in healthcare survey

dowie · 16 Jul 2017 at 03:02

cu3ed said:
That's another laughable thing when people complain about Gps on the UK. In the US the local doc get a cut for the brand drugs they advertise on TV. And getbpaid/ bribed more for pushing certain drug brands. Some here really seem to have no clue what it is like to be treated in other lands.

by 'other lands' you just mean the US, which no one really wants to copy and is a bit of an anomaly as you can see from the previous data posted

if you want to look at other lands as in other developed countries - they've mostly got pretty good health services and decent outcomes for various diseases... see Japan, Switzerland, Australia, Germany, France etc..

Energize · 16 Jul 2017 at 03:37

Evangelion said:
Just to remind everyone how good we have it:

Life expectancy is determined by lifestyle factors though, you can't solely credit the NHS for having a good life expectancy.

V F · 16 Jul 2017 at 05:42

dowie said:
by 'other lands' you just mean the US, which no one really wants to copy and is a bit of an anomaly as you can see from the previous data posted

if you want to look at other lands as in other developed countries - they've mostly got pretty good health services and decent outcomes for various diseases... see Japan, Switzerland, Australia, Germany, France etc..

In 2017 you'd think it would have been standard by now.

Minstadave · 16 Jul 2017 at 07:29

dowie said:
Why on earth do people assume we'll try to adopt the most inefficient model - practically no one is in favour of that even people whoo'd advocate moving towards a privatised system. I can't really take people seriously when they make silly claims like 'the Tories' want a US style healthcare system - who is proposing that then? There are plenty of countries that have substantial private sector involvement in healthcare, some of them are doing a much better job than the UK's NHS.

If you look at some of the ties that the Hunt has been making with Kaiser Permanente, the opening up of the NHS to private industry, wholesale chunks being sold off to Virgin and the need post Brexit for tight relationships with the US you have to wonder what direction it's going.

dowie · 16 Jul 2017 at 08:40

Minstadave said:
If you look at some of the ties that the Hunt has been making with Kaiser Permanente, the opening up of the NHS to private industry, wholesale chunks being sold off to Virgin and the need post Brexit for tight relationships with the US you have to wonder what direction it's going.

Not particularly, see previous post, plenty of countries have significant private sector involvement in healthcare and have better outcomes than we do. No one in government is pushing for a US style system over here, it is just hyperbole that is brought up whenever any form of privatisation is considered.

davido_labido · 16 Jul 2017 at 08:57

I honestly think the NHS is great, it isn't perfect by any stretch of the imagination and if there was more funding and less silly politics I think it would ease the concerns of others.

I have private healthcare and insurance (Bupa), yet I have never felt the need to ever use it, every time I have been injured or been ill, I have popped into hospital (whether it was via ambulance or to A&E) and I have been looked after each time. Ok, sometimes I had to wait a while in A&E, but that was when I had broken bones rather than anything serious. I honestly think the NHS is great.

My father also has private health care and he has had heart attacks. He was rushed into A&E first, then moved to a private clinic... he actually asked to be put back on the ward as he preferred to have the company of all the other people there. He hated being in the private area and as he doesn't watch TV or use technology much, he just didn't care about the benefits.

That being said, Dad has used bupa for other little operations that weren't as important (in grown toe nail and some basic keyhole surgery). Getting these sorted on the NHS would have taken a month or two, he got them done on bupa in a day or two and was even picked up and dropped off as he couldn't drive for either op

StriderX · 16 Jul 2017 at 12:59

Maybe Private care could be drafted for minor problems, just make it mandatory then.

Then fine anyone coming into A&E for a cough.

V F · 16 Jul 2017 at 13:16

StriderX said:
Maybe Private care could be drafted for minor problems, just make it mandatory then.

Then fine anyone coming into A&E for a cough.

I wouldn't know but seriously? Even paper cuts I've heard... I used to think this was just people taking the biscuit.

I remember when I was 14, slit my thumb open accidentally with a swiss knife and never went to the doctor or hospital. Unless it is hanging off I don't see the need to visit.

StriderX · 16 Jul 2017 at 13:20

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ple-visit-ae-when-they-shouldnt-a6954296.html

1. Broken false finger nail that wouldn't come off

2. Splinter in finger

3. Needing emergency contraception

4. Shaving cut, that wasn't visible

5. Paper cut

6. Months of back pain, but not seen a GP

7. Sore throat

8. Hiccups

9. Unable to sleep

10. Run out of medication

I'd like to blame old people and chavs primarily.

Sankari · 16 Jul 2017 at 13:35

(Source).

Woden · 16 Jul 2017 at 13:58

I can't really say anything bad about the NHS. When my son was born last year I nearly lost both him and my wife.

My wife had pre-eclampsia to the point out nearly killed her, they had to give her a ton of drugs just to bring her blood pressure down enough to do an emergency C-section at 31 weeks.

My son needed CPR at 2 minutes old, and a month in intensive care.

If there was no NHS and I couldn't afford insurance, how much would that have cost me?

Energize · 16 Jul 2017 at 13:58

Evangelion said:
(Source).

I love anonymous anecdotes.

V F · 16 Jul 2017 at 14:01

StriderX said:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...ple-visit-ae-when-they-shouldnt-a6954296.html

I'd like to blame old people and chavs primarily.

Michael Brice said:
One contributing factor I would suggest is simply human nature associated with modern lifestyles that expect. If something is free then many people regard it as a right to use as and when the want regardless of consequences to the community of which they are a member. There must be a balance or consequence for clearly inappropriate usage of A&E services.

StriderX · 16 Jul 2017 at 14:04

V F said:
...

So chavs, I consider literally anyone a chav if they don't show some semblance of intelligence/wisdom.

It's certainly not difficult to think for a few seconds in a logical manner about how stupid it is to hurt the NHS by going there because you have a bloody broken nail.

Sankari · 16 Jul 2017 at 14:17

Energize said:
I love anonymous anecdotes.

An anecdote that is strongly supported by available data. Read these articles.

'The American Healthcare Failure.'

'5 Huge Problems Nobody Told You About American Healthcare.'

'Cost, not access, is underlying problem facing American healthcare.'

'More Money, More Problems: How Profit Hijacked U.S. Health Care.'

'Americans Are Putting Off Medical Treatments Because They Can't Pay.'

davido_labido · 16 Jul 2017 at 14:20

I can't agree enough about it being chavs and druggies that are usually the ones wasting the resources.

Quite often there are quite a few people there with injuries that didn't even need a plaster never mind needing the emergency room.

I also remember when I got a shard of metal in my eye, I ended up almost getting arrested as there was a smackhead there with cuts to his hands and he kept on walking past people and trying to smear them with blood and wiping it on chairs etc. I don't know if it was intentional or if he was just not sure what was happening, but the staff were concerned about it and called security. Security just called the police. This was at North Staffs. Now, I am quite a tolerant person but I was already quite concerned about my eye as I could barely see and it was a right mess. He ended up trying to smear blood on an older lady sat next to me so tried to push him away and then he took a dislike to me so I gave him a bit of a slap. The police came just as I hit him and I got grabbed by them, the nurses actually told the officer what happened and in the end, the bloke got arrested (but still treated!!!)

The nurses took it in their stride though and just carried on like it is an everyday occurrence. The police stayed the whole time the druggy was in there, I left before he did, so I don't know if he was taken to the station after, but the resources he wasted that night were ridiculous.

Oh, after pressing enter, I remembered on a Sunday morning I got knocked out whilst playing rugby and my coach took me A&E to get checked out after, I was out cold for a while and it was our teams policy to get checked out. My coach ended up throwing a couple of drunks out of the hospital... at 10 on a Sunday morning!! I was only about 14 or 15 at the time, didn't think much of it. Thinking back on it though, for me to have seen so many little issues in A&E, I dread to think what the staff there go through.

My partner is a nurse, but she is a neonatal specialist, so she doesn't get to see the trash as often.

Minstadave · 16 Jul 2017 at 14:25

It's easy to blame the druggies and the drunks, and yes they take up a lot of time in A&E but they always have, it attracts the dregs of humanity.

In my 10 years of practising the number of dregs seems pretty static, what has changed is the inability of the general population to cope and self manage along with the risk adverse nature of primary care pushing more and more into secondary care.

I'm a paediatrician and the rubbish that makes it through A&E or primary care to see people like myself is staggering at times. The "could this rash be chickenpox?" or "he's been vomiting since lunchtime!" kind of nonsense that Granny would have sorted out in prevous generations is now making it onto the ward.

Feef · 16 Jul 2017 at 14:27

I've never had to wait more than about 5 mins to see a doctor here, though I've only been 3 times in 5 years. Was the single most striking difference comparing it to the UK, really couldn't believe people could just drop by any time of day and get seen immediately.

Think it costs me about £18/month, though if I was employed full time with a single company, my employer would be paying 2/3 of that and it'd go through my taxes.

V F · 16 Jul 2017 at 14:29

StriderX said:
So chavs, I consider literally anyone a chav if they don't show some semblance of intelligence/wisdom.

It's certainly not difficult to think for a few seconds in a logical manner about how stupid it is to hurt the NHS by going there because you have a bloody broken nail.

I was thinking this was a bigger problem.

Needing emergency contraception

That should be an on the spot fine for wasting their time. That could apply to anyone.

adolf hamster · 16 Jul 2017 at 17:16

V F said:
I remember when I was 14, slit my thumb open accidentally with a swiss knife and never went to the doctor or hospital. Unless it is hanging off I don't see the need to visit.

i've only been twice (for myself), once when i was about 4 and i'd managed to get a pretty sizable gash on my eyebrow, and the second time when our flue backed up and we had carbon monoxide poisoning (which is the only time i've had an ambulance as well, but then i couldn't walk more than 15ft before collapsing)