Yea and probably other benefits, but that's the issue that is trying to be solved by rising the NLW/NMW that it is up to companies to pay a living wage to their employees and not for the state to subsidise it through tax credits. Once it hits £9 / hr giving a basic salary of £17,550 on a 37.5 hr job you won't be eligible for virtually any tax credits.
McDonalds workers due to strike for £10 an hour...
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yeah tbh i thought hats what it was i dint realize it was only 7hr/13k worth.
surprising how many people must be dependent on those tax credits.
it may acoutally work out cheaper to as you say raise NLW see price of goods rise but then lower taxes to compensate for the reduction in tax credits now needed.
not that that would happen, even if nlw was icnreased tax would not reduce.
surprising how many people must be dependent on those tax credits.
it may acoutally work out cheaper to as you say raise NLW see price of goods rise but then lower taxes to compensate for the reduction in tax credits now needed.
not that that would happen, even if nlw was icnreased tax would not reduce.
Yea, the "working poor" is a big issue and has been now for some time, and only got worse after the financial crash as it's always the people at the bottom, most dependent on the state, who get hit the hardest at every economic contraction.
Also, the high cost of living which has been driven by the out of whack housing costs (rent or buy) is again one of the problems for the low earners in society
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That's my argument.
State handouts exist now to subsidize the low wage economy. Rather than companies paying a fair wage to their staff they are happy to let the state provide handouts paid for by the taxes of those who are on marginally more than those on the bottom.
Privatisation of the profits and socializing the costs of their businesses.
It's going to take a long time to break the addiction of state subsidies and it has to make a start at the top with those most capable to deal with the changes. If big companies paid respectable wages so that their staff didn't have to exist on state handouts then it would go a long way to bucking that trend.
There's already quite a bit of automation across Europe. Any newly fitted McDonalds now has self-service ordering points. These were a blessing when i was in Italy, as you could swap it to English and not have to worry about trying to tell the server what you're trying to order.
The result of these machines means less staff needing to work behind the till and more focused towards cooking/preparing/serving the food.
When I worked in the UK I used to consult for large operations, mainly retail based. One of the main issues the store managers and the regional managers used to have was trying to get anyone to work over 16 hours because it impacted their tax credit.
The operations had the hours to give, but there was literally ZERO incentive for them to work anything else because the state used to top them up anyway.
Overtime was difficult to hand out to the shop floor employees, so some of the operations used to ask them to do it, and then give them whatever it was in lieu off in another week.
The British economy is in a poor state, you strip away working tax credits, or you increase the minimum wage and this gets passed down to the customer in some form or the other.
The operations had the hours to give, but there was literally ZERO incentive for them to work anything else because the state used to top them up anyway.
Overtime was difficult to hand out to the shop floor employees, so some of the operations used to ask them to do it, and then give them whatever it was in lieu off in another week.
The British economy is in a poor state, you strip away working tax credits, or you increase the minimum wage and this gets passed down to the customer in some form or the other.
Benefits system sounds like it needs a massive reshake. You should never be discouraged from getting a job or working more hours because it'll cut your benefits and make you worse off.
No wonder we have so many benefit spongers.
No wonder we have so many benefit spongers.
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I have raised this recently in meetings at my dead end job in regards to the shoddy conditions our polish agency staff are treated by us. One young woman has only been getting 2 days of work a week despite being very good, punctual, hard working and a clear requirement of a larger work force. What on earth would stop someone in this situation quitting and signing on and being better off. Give someone regular decently payed work that puts them into a better situation than they would be sitting on the dole and you will see a huge spike within job applications country wide.
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Btw, catering is terribly paid so I wouldn't be confident about them getting what they want. For context, you get eg. senior chef de parties on something like £8.60/hour in the regions. That's proper chefs with a decade of experience. And that can easily be with split shifts/really late finishes/etc.
That's not always the case, some employers do actually pay more for a CDP. I've always been on well above minimum wage as a chef at all levels, back in 2004 i was earning £300 a week for a 40 hour week as a CDP which went up to £20k when i was promoted to sous chef. As a head chef, i've never earned less than £23k and that was for a crap paying chain group. I'm self employed now and I earn more than a lot of people now as an agency chef, i'm easily on £40k plus now, and if i wanted to work 6 or 7 days i could push that to £50k / £60k. However, i like to retain a nice work life balance so i'm happy doing 5 days / 10 hours.
but without a reuction in tac it remains the same roughly,
remeber price do not just increas ein aoccordance with value/cost to produce but what people are willing/able to pay
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Oh I agree.
It's not something we can fix easily. It goes hand in hand and I'd prefer a gradual "weening off" period so to speak.
The political will to change things is just not there though. The public are set in their ways, the politicians are just there to earn their wage and not rock the boat. Norway and Denmark have considerably higher minimum wages and it's not trashed their economies. Sure Britain is bigger and every country should be looked at on a case by case basis but I just don't believe that it can't be done.
Our country just doesn't want to.
This was supposedly what Universal Credit was supposed to address, so that benefits tapered off slowly with increases in income, not drop off a cliff as they do now making it not worthwhile to earn more as you initially get less overall.
But poor implementation, people having far more complex lives than the system can cope with and the underlaying issue that the benefit systems tenet is now to punish you rather than support you, means it's not quite working as intended....
But poor implementation, people having far more complex lives than the system can cope with and the underlaying issue that the benefit systems tenet is now to punish you rather than support you, means it's not quite working as intended....
I'd say that is more to do with the company underpaying people than the state. When you pay peanuts, you get peanuts. The employees don't WANT to work there, doing extra hours for basically nothing isn't an incentive.
But yea, any extra they pay staff gets dumped on the customer. God forbid profits and exec bonuses will only be 5 figures at the end of the year!
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Completely agree with you, but it was ridiculous that the retailer was willing to pay the 'tab' so to speak, instead of the state.
I dont know how you get around this though. Do you put an onus on the employer to tell the relevant authority that Joe Bloggs was offered an additional 10 hour contract but chose not to take it because he could get the same amount of money by not working?
Granted this is only a problem I would think in minimum wage jobs.
yep the problem is a weaning off period lasts about 4 parliaments +
it would never survive to completion because the people being weaned off would vote whatever party offered the drip back.
What?
It really irritates me that people look at McDonald's in such a fashion, I mean if you are motivated enough, as in any job, then you can progress through the company.