Apple losing its edge?

[sesevans]

From today's Wall Street Journal:

"Under Tim Cook's leadership as CEO Apple (AAPL) has faced product delays with its Apple Watch in 2015, AirPods earbuds in 2016 and its HomePod speaker in 2017 missing their planned shipping dates, the Wall Street Journal reports. The delays, which also included the Apple Pencil and Smart Keyboard for its iPad Pro, have drawn concerns from analysts and industry watchers that the tech giant may be losing its competitive edge to rivals like Amazon and Google."

Anyone have an opinion?

 

[spoffle]

What is the point they're trying to make? The products came out eventually, right? I'd say it would be a valid point if they didn't actually end up coming out.

 

[ic1male]

It’d be far more interesting if Steve was still alive. I wonder what he’d be making of Apple these days.

 

[Martini1991]

What is the point they're trying to make? The products came out eventually, right? I'd say it would be a valid point if they didn't actually end up coming out.

The home pod hasn't come out?

I'm not an Apple fan, however Apple are absolutely killing it. They're pretty much sewn up the tablet market for example.
Google/Amazon have their own set of problems. Google Home for example is so inconsistent. Doesn't work with AndroidTV correctly (Can't even turn on AndroidTV bizarrely)

 

[spoffle]

The home pod hasn't come out?

I'm not an Apple fan, however Apple are absolutely killing it. They're pretty much sewn up the tablet market for example.
Google/Amazon have their own set of problems. Google Home for example is so inconsistent. Doesn't work with AndroidTV correctly (Can't even turn on AndroidTV bizarrely)

I read HomePod as AirPod for some reason.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

The problem with Amazon is they are stuck with cheap, low margin tech products.

Their phone failed and smart speakers are a gimmick that will pass. My wife won a dot, it got unplugged on the 2nd day and put in a draw, I don't know anyone that seriously uses theirs on a regular basis.

Kindle is pretty much dead these days and fire tablets make limited margin.

Google on the other hand are trying to get into the market place. Its phones are really good but are just completely overshadowed by Samsung when it comes to selling them. their other premium products like the pixel book are just meh.... Google makes it's money from its software and ads, it isn't going to be a true Apple competitor without significant change of direction. Android is also far from perfect when it comes to bugs, security issues and dodgy apps in the store. Its not better, just different.

Apple on the other hand is currently milking the industry of all the profit. All the other manufactures combined don't make as much profit as Apple.

Lets also look at the products mentioned in this thread:
Airpods: They sold out at Christmas, £160 earphones... completely sold out. They have sold millions of them this year and are doubling the manufacturing capacity from when they launched. You can only say they are a massive success.

Homepod speaker: I've already said how I feel about smart speakers. Who really cares about this? This will be such a low volume product.

Apple Pencil: Does anyone actually use one of these? I imagine the only people are hipster Artists in Starbucks drinking expensive coffee.

Smart Keyboard: Can be a useful bit of kit, but again I don't really know anyone that uses an iPad over a laptop for serious work. They just are not that good, I imagine they sold a fair few of these though but compared to iPad sales the attach rate will be a tiny %.

Apple Watch: Best selling smart watch and considered to be the best smartwatch by some margin. Done.

Now lets look at:
Laptops: Completely killing it, people can not get though of them. No one makes as much profit as Apple and they have to maintain their own OS and apps they give away included in the price. Only Apple can sell an out date, low spec shiny laptop with a rubbish screen for £1000 (Air) and yet people can not get enough of them.

Tablets: Pretty much got the mid-range to high end wrapped up. No one else can compete here apart from **** cheap tablets.

Phones: They get all the profit from the industry and sell tens of millions of units a year. I think they are just fine.

People moan that the iPhone 8 is the same as the 7, 6S and 6 but The S7 edge and S8 are extremely similar and the leaked S9 is basically the same thing again. All phones pretty much look the same now.

The apple ecosystem is so integrated, consumers that just want to use their device with an easy seamless experience just love it. Nothing else compares. If you want to customise, tweak and experiment then apple isn't for you but you are very much the minority.

 

[Feek]

The apple ecosystem is so integrated, consumers that just want to use their device with an easy seamless experience just love it. Nothing else compares. If you want to customise, tweak and experiment then apple isn't for you but you are very much the minority.

This last sentence sums things up really rather nicely. I was always a fiddler, I tweaked, I played, I overclocked, etc. I had monitoring stats on my desktop, I watched everything my computer did. I needed to know.
When I first tried OS X, I tried to use it like Windows. I very quickly realised that wasn't going to work. I don't need to know what percentage load the CPU is at, I don't need to know how much memory is being used. I just wanted a system that allowed me to use the computer without having to tinker. I think I grew up and I really don't care what's going on under the cover. I know my iMac has an i7 but I couldn't tell you what speed it runs at, I couldn't tell you what fancy name or number it has. I just posted in another thread and I had to go and look to see what graphics my iMac has! It's stuff that I don't need to know about in order to do things.
Love my MacBook btw and this year I was more interested in the new watch than the new iPhone. Incidentally, I don't have a problem with the phones looking the same externally when new ones come out, if it has the same form factor, it means it'll fit in the bracket in my car without having to buy a new one.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

I used to tinker with my phones, I wasted hours messing about with custom roms on windows mobile before iOS was even a thing when I could have had a life . I have been iOS since the 3G and not really looked back. I have had a few Android phones over the years (HTC One and One X), they were decent but the lure of customising and tweaking left me completely after I got out of my early 20's and the software back then was just better. That being said there is not much in it these days.

I also used to spend hours overclocking and tweaking my PC's but as I grew up I did it less and less. I now just don't bother at all. For the record I am still an extensive Windows user but I can seamlessly switch between the two and have no real preference. I used to use a MBP and an iPad but I ditched them both for a Surface Pro 3. I just love the form factor (but the pen is useless for normal people).

I hate Apples stance on the whole touch screen in a laptop thing. It now really annoys me now when I am using a laptop that does not have one. I wish Apple would do a full OSX 'Surface Pro' type device, I would switch to it in a heart beat for the full integration with my phone.

I really see myself as a consumer these days rather than an enthusiast which is a strange statement considering I am typing this on a high end X99 PC. I can totally see the lure of the Apple ecosystem. I completely understand why it is so attractive to normal consumers. If I didn't enjoy playing PC games I would ditch the PC and just put a docking station for my Surface on the desk instead.

 

[Combat squirrel]

The problem with Amazon is they are stuck with cheap, low margin tech products.

Their phone failed and smart speakers are a gimmick that will pass. My wife won a dot, it got unplugged on the 2nd day and put in a draw, I don't know anyone that seriously uses theirs on a regular basis.

Kindle is pretty much dead these days and fire tablets make limited margin.

I use mine on a regular basis....it seems u have completely missed the point with echo dots. My friends use them all the time, I got my parents one last Xmas, it's used constantly now...they love it.

We all use them mostly for timers, reminders, making calendar appointments (just telling it instead of having to type it on ur phone is so much easier)...my anti tech dad even signed up for Amazon music unlimited and thinks it's the best thing since sliced bread....he cooks a lot so walks into the kitchen asks it to play whatever he wants.....puts timers on it for whatever he's cooking.

Kindle is amazing, especially with audiable, I read a book on my iPad....obviously reach a certain point......then I'll get up in the morning and take my dog for a walk, pop my airpods in, load audible on my iPhone and it begins reading the book from where I left off reading it myself.....it's amazing I love it, being able to read and then it turn to an audio book when needed? Wonderful.

Also sometimes when I want to read but I don't want a light on when am chilling in bed....no problem I just tell my echo dot 'alexa continue my audible book'....now I'm chillin having the book read to me (currently Scott Kellys book on his year in space)....just tell it to stop when I'm ready to sleep, no hassle no finding buttons in the dark, no bright phone screens to make it stop.....amazing.

I'd suggest you dig it out the draw and start using it again, place it in the kitchen as a timer if anything....your missing out.

 

[mrochester]

I use mine on a regular basis....it seems u have completely missed the point with echo dots. My friends use them all the time, I got my parents one last Xmas, it's used constantly now...they love it.

We all use them mostly for timers, reminders, making calendar appointments (just telling it instead of having to type it on ur phone is so much easier)...my anti tech dad even signed up for Amazon music unlimited and thinks it's the best thing since sliced bread....he cooks a lot so walks into the kitchen asks it to play whatever he wants.....puts timers on it for whatever he's cooking.

Kindle is amazing, especially with audiable, I read a book on my iPad....obviously reach a certain point......then I'll get up in the morning and take my dog for a walk, pop my airpods in, load audible on my iPhone and it begins reading the book from where I left off reading it myself.....it's amazing I love it, being able to read and then it turn to an audio book when needed? Wonderful.

Also sometimes when I want to read but I don't want a light on when am chilling in bed....no problem I just tell my echo dot 'alexa continue my audible book'....now I'm chillin having the book read to me (currently Scott Kellys book on his year in space)....just tell it to stop when I'm ready to sleep, no hassle no finding buttons in the dark, no bright phone screens to make it stop.....amazing.

I'd suggest you dig it out the draw and start using it again, place it in the kitchen as a timer if anything....your missing out.

I must be missing the point to because what you've described can mostly be done on other devices you are likely to have on your person (watch or phone). And I wouldn't be listening to music on a tinny little speaker like the Echo, so playing any sort of music is out of the equation. So it basically turns into a device that's sitting plugged in with no apparent use.

 

[Combat squirrel]

I must be missing the point to because what you've described can mostly be done on other devices you are likely to have on your person (watch or phone). And I wouldn't be listening to music on a tinny little speaker like the Echo, so playing any sort of music is out of the equation. So it basically turns into a device that's sitting plugged in with no apparent use.

Yep missing the point. Sure Siri can do some of it but not as well......the dot is just fine for audio books, my dad's got it hooked into the house speakers via Bluetooth so sounds great.

Doing all the usual stuff on an echo is way easier than my apple watch or iPhone.....it's just there, you dont need to fish it out ur pocket, also I don't carry my phone around the house.

My dad had exactly the same attitude as you until he started using it....you appreciate what it can do when you start using it all the time, it also plays radio stations etc easily.

Also it's become the defacto way me and my parents phone each other now....simply being in the room and sayin Alexa call mum and dad and I get room wide audio is great.....yes I can phone from my iPhone and I can tell Siri to do the same but it's different on a device like this.....more like star trek.....the genuine hands free approach makes it better.

Also for what I use it for it destroys Siri, it's simply superior, Apple need to do a lot of work for their home pod to compete with its AI

 

[MagicBoy]

Not sure how slipped shipping dates equates to Apple "losing it's competitive edge".

Anyway I'll throw this one out there ... not like Intel have hit a roadmap date for CPUs in years...

 

[something daft already!!]

Apple has just been copying Samsung now for years.

 

[MagicBoy]

Back that up with some proof please.

 

[mrochester]

Yep missing the point. Sure Siri can do some of it but not as well......the dot is just fine for audio books, my dad's got it hooked into the house speakers via Bluetooth so sounds great.

Doing all the usual stuff on an echo is way easier than my apple watch or iPhone.....it's just there, you dont need to fish it out ur pocket, also I don't carry my phone around the house.

My dad had exactly the same attitude as you until he started using it....you appreciate what it can do when you start using it all the time, it also plays radio stations etc easily.

Also it's become the defacto way me and my parents phone each other now....simply being in the room and sayin Alexa call mum and dad and I get room wide audio is great.....yes I can phone from my iPhone and I can tell Siri to do the same but it's different on a device like this.....more like star trek.....the genuine hands free approach makes it better.

Also for what I use it for it destroys Siri, it's simply superior, Apple need to do a lot of work for their home pod to compete with its AI

Can’t say I’ve ever had any problems with Siri. I’ve just 5 minutes ago spoken into my watch to set a timer for 10 minutes and it worked perfectly. I also use it to shuffle my favourites play list or play a particular song when driving. That’s something the Echo definitely can’t do!

I left my Echo plugged in for about a month and I actively used it for about the first 2 days I had it. It’s a solution looking for a problem in my mind.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

I must be missing the point to because what you've described can mostly be done on other devices you are likely to have on your person (watch or phone). And I wouldn't be listening to music on a tinny little speaker like the Echo, so playing any sort of music is out of the equation. So it basically turns into a device that's sitting plugged in with no apparent use.

I couldn't agree more. I am really not a technophobe at all, I embrace most new things as they come out. But when my wife turns round and says this is a waste of time/money and doesn't do anything that our phones don't. I have literally got nothing to respond with because its true. Yes you can get room wide audio but so has every decent Bluetooth speaker in the last 10 years.

Apple has just been copying Samsung now for years.

No, there are only so many ways to make a phone. They have all been pretty much the same since the beginning of time. You could argue that they have both just been copying the shrinking bezel trend that has been happening in TV's for years.

 

[MagicBoy]

No, there are only so many ways to make a phone. They have all been pretty much the same since the beginning of time. You could argue that they have both just been copying the shrinking bezel trend that has been happening in TV's for years.

.... and Samsung have tried them all. They scattergun approach all new ideas, implement them badly and most disappear by the next iteration. Samsung absolutely have to be the first to market with something, doesn't matter if it's useless!

 

[Combat squirrel]

Can’t say I’ve ever had any problems with Siri. I’ve just 5 minutes ago spoken into my watch to set a timer for 10 minutes and it worked perfectly. I also use it to shuffle my favourites play list or play a particular song when driving. That’s something the Echo definitely can’t do!

I left my Echo plugged in for about a month and I actively used it for about the first 2 days I had it. It’s a solution looking for a problem in my mind.

Yeah siri will do it - but did u lift your arm to your face and tell the watch ? the mics on the echo are better and you can just say it in the room and it does it

Don't get me wrong - I have all the apple gadgets - watch, phone, recently got them, love the eco system.

But also for the money (£35) an echo dot in a kitchen is a godsend - if you have audio books, also amazing - just had my echo dot playing that book as I made a slow cooker meal - easy, didnt have to talk to my watch, bring my phone to the kitchen etc

I couldn't agree more. I am really not a technophobe at all, I embrace most new things as they come out. But when my wife turns round and says this is a waste of time/money and doesn't do anything that our phones don't. I have literally got nothing to respond with because its true. Yes you can get room wide audio but so has every decent Bluetooth speaker in the last 10 years.

Can tell your married - if the wife says it, must be true haha !

Again I think you guys are missing the point - sure our phones can do it - hell a phone from 1970 can phone people - why did you get your iphone that can do the same thing??? See what what im saying?????

It's more hassle pulling a phone out a pocket - thats a fact, but yes it will set a timer.

Its because its there, its always on - you just say it anywhere in the room (I have one in the kitchen, bedroom, office) - my next purchase will be an echo plus as a home hub then ill use it to control heating, lighting etc as well - also you can set it to turn lights on and off just talking to it when your out - good security. - again a phone can do this sure - but not a home hub.

The convienience, better voice pick up - amazon services, multi platform cross compatability (I have kindle, audible, music, video on my phone, ipad etc also) and all can be used off the echo's, it really is good.

If you don't use any of amazons services u can still listen to radio stations and timers and reminders, and calander features.

I just tried to play the radio using siri on my iphone - it didnt work, at all, started playing some random music off itunes - a track that wasn't even close to 'play planet rock' - i then tried 'play planet rock on tune in' - non of it worked - i just simply said play planet rock to the echo and it worked instantly using the tune in skill (app) - this is why its better (also tried radio 1, 2 just incase, siri didn't work)

 

[b0rn2sk8]

my next purchase will be an echo plus as a home hub then ill use it to control heating, lighting etc as well - also you can set it to turn lights on and off just talking to it when your out - good security. - again a phone can do this sure - but not a home hub.

The convienience, better voice pick up - amazon services, multi platform cross compatability (I have kindle, audible, music, video on my phone, ipad etc also) and all can be used off the echo's, it really is good.

If you don't use any of amazons services u can still listen to radio stations and timers and reminders, and calander features.

Using it to turn lights on and off is pointless 21 century solution to a problem that doesn't exist. I don't see how that is good security? Thieves don't give a **** if your home or not these days. Even having things like CCTV can be easily evaded with some basic countermeasures. The chances of getting caught are pretty minimal unless you are literally caught red handed.

Same with heating, set and forget with any decent 7 day timer and thermostat combo, if its programmed properly (which takes seconds) for your routine then Hive/Nest doesn't actually save you any money. Alexa also doesn't do anything that the Hive/Nest app doesn't already do.

You have really pulled out the key thing there which is Amazon services. If you don't subscribe (which I don't) then their functionality is significantly reduced. I also don't listen to the radio often at all.

 

[Combat squirrel]

Using it to turn lights on and off is pointless 21 century solution to a problem that doesn't exist, light switches have been around for hundreds of years and work just fine. I don't see how that is good security? Same with heating, set and forget with any decent 7 day timer and thermostat combo, if its programmed properly (which takes seconds) for your routine then Hive/Nest doesn't actually save you any money. Alexa also doesn't do anything that the Hive/Nest app doesn't already do.

You have really pulled out the key thing there which is Amazon services. If you don't subscribe (which I don't) then their functionality is significantly reduced. I also don't listen to the radio often at all.

Obviously your already closed to the thought of it and finding reasons it's not useful to you so naturally you won't see its value.

Again your making the same point, again why buy an iPhone when a £10 house phone does the job?....because it's more convenient, does it better and in new useful ways?

Lights on and off is am extremely well known security action, you have been able to buy timers for years because everyone knows that lights going on and off while ur ok holiday is another part of the security puzzle that may put off thieves......iv done it for years, just now as tech improves it's got more sophisticated, you can set alexa to turn them on and off at random or timer, never had a break in.....maybe if someone was thinking of breaking in...and a light came on they thought better of it.

Anyways I don't have shares in amazon and I'm not trying to make u get one.....but they are extremely useful.....but don't say it's useless otherwise I'll ask why did u buy an iPhone when a £10 phone does the job! Lol