Driving pet hates...

vanpeebles said:
People who swing out to the right or middle of the road to take a standard left turn into a street. Usually seen on housing estates in very small cars.
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I do it but the entrance to my road isn't standard. It's very narrow and off a main road It's barely wide enough for 2 normal family hatchbacks. I have a 19ft long estate.
I have 3 options either swing and in, cross into the oncoming lane or mount the near-side kerb
 
squerble said:
To be fair, most cars have a sun-load sensor, so if the sun is blaring into the car, it'll push out colder air to compensate/add comfort.
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Interesting as thats not quite how they work to my understanding

I was told they are an added parameter to the logic of the climate. So the climate knows the internal, external and sun radiation levels, it uses these to look up what temp and speed to send the air out, but that the target temp remained the same.
It just felt cooler as say more airflow and colder air coming out?
Otherwise your notional 21 would be what? A 10 degree day with no sun?

The one significant advantage of climate though is with dual zone systems. Say driver is driving along, with strong sun coming in through his window. He feels hot as the heating effect on him is high, passenger however is colder as no direct sun, being able to control them are a massive advantage to both occupants. :)
 
PaulCa said:
I am keeping "Electronic Handbrake" in the "Over my dead body" category. I mean it. A saleman might have my dream car at a shockingly good price but unless he can fit a physically handbrake to it, I don't want it.
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Whereas by contrast I am the opposite - I don't want a car with a physical handbrake. They are completely outdated and unnecessary and its annoying to find them still in cars. They take up space in the cabin, look crap and are nothing like as convenient and useful as electronic handbrakes.

I just don't see why you'd still want a manual handbrake? They are not complex, its just a motor acting on the caliper so no more faffing around at MOT time with handbrake adjustment (The handbrake on my E39 was notoriously crap for example). Automatically applies when you stop, automatically goes off when you move off, wonderful.
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Well thats nicely irrelevant, as you clearly didnt have an already fogged up screen, or dew covered windscreen and passenger window (oh and rear screen). Happens to all the cars where we park, its damp (its by trees and grass) and the sun is perfectly aliigned to the windscreens around 7am.
Annoyingly it happens later in the spring when it would have been handy to melt the frost, doesn't hit then till around 8.30 and I leave an hour earlier.

I am slightly bemused why you are so insistent on trying to make out like CC is best in all circumstances, when its clearly not. Why not mention what Tall Pall also said about his dads insignia?

Edit, oh just realised, its cos I posted about your bad observation skills. Now it makes sense.
I can see why you need the help now, heater controls probably are too complicated ;)
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I kindly suggest you take a step back and take that tone out of your "voice". I don't take kindly to being insulted.

My point was if you use the CC properly the car does not get damp and thus does not fog up. if it does the AC dries the air quickly if you leave it under the automatic control. Parking in a damp location should not make the inside of the car damp unless it's got a major leak.

CC is best in all circumstances, because it provides exactly the same funcitonality as manual controls AND additionally provides intelligent, software controller, multi-sensor automatic adaptive control of the same controls plus others. So it knows things before you do and takes actions which you might not be able to, such as engaging the AC in drying cycle (dehumidifying) mode.

[TW]Fox said:
Whereas by contrast I am the opposite - I don't want a car with a physical handbrake. They are completely outdated and unnecessary and its annoying to find them still in cars. They take up space in the cabin, look crap and are nothing like as convenient and useful as electronic handbrakes.

I just don't see why you'd still want a manual handbrake? They are not complex, its just a motor acting on the caliper so no more faffing around at MOT time with handbrake adjustment (The handbrake on my E39 was notoriously crap for example). Automatically applies when you stop, automatically goes off when you move off, wonderful.
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When you take the battery out, the car rolls off.
Then the software crashes you can't engage or disengage the handbrake.
When you have an emergency problem such as brake failure the automatics might not let you use the handbrake.*
The automatic handbrake is "ON" "OFF" no variability.
The mechanism is poor and underpreforming. There are many, many more cases of electric handbrakes failing and cars rolling away than physical cables snapping.
Drum brakes are better suited to the task.
You can't do hand brake turns on a track day.


* try this as a test. Assume your battery is flat and a friend is pushing you down a hill. But the car still won't start. You apply the foot brake but as your brake servo is now completely empty the brakes don't work properly. So you engage the handbrake... but... oh... what's that? The automatics won't let you? Oh, what a shame. Even if they do let you as it's "ON/OFF" it will slam the hand brake on fully locking the rear wheels and causing you to loose control.

This is a real work example or where a manual emergency brake that is simple, direct and unregulated is important.

"I'm sorry Dave, I can't let you do that." should NEVER EVER be an option on a handbrake.

Also. My car has hill start assist (If I enable it), but no automatic handbrake. The two are different things.

EDIT Finally, the manufacturers are trying to tell you it's better for you, but really what they mean is "it's cheaper to produce" for them.
 
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I can't remember the last time I actually interacted with my climate control. It just works. I can't imagine having a car without it. I might turn on the heated front and rear screens as the mornings get colder, but that's it.
 
PaulCa said:
You don't need an electronic handbrake for hill start assist. That can be done with the brake distribution pump.
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Ahh ok, tbh I've not driven a modern manual with an electronic handbrake, our work vans have the hill hold thing on the brakes for a second or 2 but I never trust it, they've still got old school handbrakes.
 
PaulCa said:
CC is best in all circumstances, because it provides exactly the same funcitonality as manual controls AND additionally provides intelligent, software controller, multi-sensor automatic adaptive control of the same controls plus others. So it knows things before you do and takes actions which you might not be able to, such as engaging the AC in drying cycle (dehumidifying) mode.
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LOL, been downloading a sales brochure?

CC does nothing you cant do manually. Honestly its just a way of not needing to bother. I get some people struggle with a control, I get some people just want to be lazy.
I also get some people don't get other benefits to driving like elctronic brakes avoiding rolling backwards.
Its just using lookup tables. Does it know that I got in wearing shorts so want it warmer, does it know I am feeling a little unwell so want it warmer, or need a little more fresh air? So seems I know what I need better ;)

What you don't seem to be able to get is that I find I get better control of cars without climate, they are pretty basic and whilst they do attempt to counter say sun, they don't get it right all the time.
LIke my 5 series that about an hour into a long journey when its cold seemed to fail to maintain comfortable temps. I know others who have made the same observation in this regard.
The first car I had with climate was a ford, seemed to do it well, I followed with 2 BMW 5 series, then my mini, last year I switched to TT and ditched the climate. And it was a hard call as it looks superb in the TT.

I still say today I find it easier to get what i want with 3 knobs oh and the switch which is always on basically for the AC. Interestingly as well I can do mine without looking as they are easy to find and quite tactile, unlike all cars I have had before where the buttons are basically flat to look nice. Saying that though the TT would be the same wit climate as they just change the functions slightly. although you would need to look to change the temp as its displayed in dial.
 
Even some modern handbrakes are dodgy and often used as a reason to have electric ones. It all steams for how handbrakes are meant to work.

Drum brakes are what is known as "self energising" brakes. The force trying to turn the drum against the shoes and the angle of the shoes causes they to engage harder. So with a small amount of input force the brake 'self energises' to induce a much larger braking force. Disc brakes on the other hand have none of this effect. So disc brakes require hydraulic amplification and vacuum servo assist to be effective.

This makes drum brakes much better suited to handbrake duties. You can't use hydraulics long term as they may leak and the constant pressure in the system can lead to early failure. So they use a small motor to push the pad against the disc in electric handbrakes.

With disc brakes being preferred (for many reasons) they were most often used on the front, where most of the braking was required and drums on the rear which could be used by both foot brake and handbrake. Only sports cars, performance cars and heavy cars had discs on the rear in the form of "disc over drum" type.

Manufacturers started introducing rear disc brakes in all cars as it seemed to make the car higher value and allow rear anti-lock brakes (as one of the issues with drums is their increased tendency to lock and the difficulty unlocking them meant they were difficult to work with anti-lock brakes and stability control systems).

But... now they have to have two braking mechanisms on the rear. Drum for handbrake and disc for normal braking. Of course to lower costs there were desparate to get rid of the drum brakes. So they did. Even those using a disc for the purpose of a handbrake is sub-standard as the amount of application force required without hydrualics is huge.

The only benefit for the electric handbrake is if you car has no drum brake, the electric motor can at least provide more torque and applicatin force than you can with you hand.

But if you have drum over disc brakes you get the best of both worlds and a real handbake.... and hill assist is provided separately via the brake distribution used by the E-diff, stabiliity control EBD and antilock brakes.
 
There is actually more than one hold assist thingy, the names are confusingly similar and sort of do the same thing. I am quoting Audi here as but assume most manufacturers are similar?

The hill-start assist function helps you drive off on a hill. If you hold down the foot brake for a time when the vehicle is stationary, the brake pressure is retained for a brief moment after you release the brake pedal – helping a relaxed start on any hillor incline with no roll-back.

It's activated by pressing a button and allows the driver to set the car in motion smoothly without having to use the handbrake at all. If the vehicle remains stationary for a long period with Audi hold assistactive, the system automatically switches over to the electromechanical parking brake.

I believe with a electronic brake you get both, with a manual you get the first only.

The first one basically you still hold the brake on a hill and when you release you dont roll back, as long as you dont take too long.
The second when you come to a stop (its switched on by default but can be overridden) then it engages and you do not need to hold the brake. When you drive off the brake releases. This is quite scary to do at the start :)
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
LOL, been downloading a sales brochure?

CC does nothing you cant do manually. Honestly its just a way of not needing to bother. I get some people struggle with a control, I get some people just want to be lazy.
I also get some people don't get other benefits to driving like elctronic brakes avoiding rolling backwards.
Its just using lookup tables. Does it know that I got in wearing shorts so want it warmer, does it know I am feeling a little unwell so want it warmer, or need a little more fresh air? So seems I know what I need better ;)

What you don't seem to be able to get is that I find I get better control of cars without climate, they are pretty basic and whilst they do attempt to counter say sun, they don't get it right all the time.
LIke my 5 series that about an hour into a long journey when its cold seemed to fail to maintain comfortable temps. I know others who have made the same observation in this regard.
The first car I had with climate was a ford, seemed to do it well, I followed with 2 BMW 5 series, then my mini, last year I switched to TT and ditched the climate. And it was a hard call as it looks superb in the TT.

I still say today I find it easier to get what i want with 3 knobs oh and the switch which is always on basically for the AC. Interestingly as well I can do mine without looking as they are easy to find and quite tactile, unlike all cars I have had before where the buttons are basically flat to look nice. Saying that though the TT would be the same wit climate as they just change the functions slightly. although you would need to look to change the temp as its displayed in dial.
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Do you manually turn your boiler on and off several times an hour at home when you want to heat your house? No, you have a thermostat which does it automatically in order to maintain a rough room temperature.

So why would you not want this functionality in your car?

I've yet to drive a car equipped with climate control that has made me wish I had manual controls so that I could "do the job better". If you're a bit hot or a bit cold you can adjust the temperature to your current preference, and it'll do the rest. There's no need for the constant tweaking and faffing of the fan speed or temperature knob as things change temperature.
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
CC does nothing you cant do manually. Honestly its just a way of not needing to bother. I get some people struggle with a control, I get some people just want to be lazy.
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How do you put your AC into drying/dehumidifying mode without cooling the car down?

How do you vary the air temperature to maintain a constant internal temp without having to constantly adjust while the outside temp changes and the engine temp changes?
 
PaulCa said:
When you take the battery out, the car rolls off.
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No it doesn't. The motor on mine manually closes the rear caliper. It doesn't rely on continual actuation of the motor to keep it on - with no battery, if the handbrake is on, its staying on.

Then the software crashes you can't engage or disengage the handbrake.
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This has never happened to me.
 
So maybe they have a rachet system. That of course means if the battery dies you aren't going anywhere and can't even be towed.

And to your second point... "yet".
 
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