Where the hell is NAVI???????????

[Zeed]

IMO Navi will be around Verga VII / RTX 2080 but under £400, at which point nVidia will release Turing cards without RT to compete.

we all here know IT WONT not the First one at lest. Full one could be but thats 2021 or something

 

[LePhuronn]

we all here know IT WONT not the First one at lest. Full one could be but thats 2021 or something

Well no, because 2020 is Arcturus so Navi lasts for a year before it's replaced.

And how exactly do you KNOW it WON'T? There is nothing to say which way Navi will go. For however credible or not the leaked specs may be, there is sufficient room in there to suggest a Radeon VII replacement is possible.

 

[nashathedog]

Raja resigning had more to do with him wanting rtg to separate from AMD and get snapped up by intel. (allegedly)

Seriously? He was sacked because of how he almost ran RTG into the ground & alienated it's userbase with his deceit & lies, It's amazing how much rubbish swills around in the internet, As soon as Vega released his days were numbered, He went on an extended leave straight away to apparently spend time with his family and he never came back, he was never coming back. He was allowed to call it a resign to save face, Selling RTG to Intel would be akin to AMD commiting suicide so why people believe this sort of rubbish is beyond me, It's having a foothold in both cpu and gpu lines that's kept AMD afloat through the hard times. AMD will never sell RTG.

Raj. didn't resign, he got sacked, via the 'On Gardening Leave' method.

Exactly.

 

[nashathedog]

Nash, everything about Navi is speculation because AMD have said literally nothing. Truth be told, I can't even recall if AMD themselves said Navi is aimed at the midrange, or if that came from tech press.

But I don't see where the contradiction in my statements comes from; by whatever source, it's been long established that Navi is expected to be a midrange product, the AdoredTV leaks also show a midrange product, and the targeted performance tiers in that leak suggest that Navi is a replacement for both Polaris and Vega - how can RX Vega 64 continue to exist if the leaked RX 3080 has 15% more performance? Also Gibbo has said a few times that Vega 56 is EOL.

Now yes, I may have used some optimistic logic in believing there could be a RX 3090 (for lack of a better term) which would replace Radeon VII and that really is borne from my own conjecture, but I don't recall ever saying Navi is the Second Coming of Christ, R.I.P. Nvidia or similar such nonsense. In fact, I've been quite forthright in saying "don't expect anything substantial until Arcturus". My expectations have been kerbed since the start because Navi is still GCN, but I've also not seen rumour millers pushing Navi as anything more than GTX 1060 to GTX 1080 performance levels.

It's no surpise there's so much ignorance & confusion on the topic, The clickbait sites are to blame, In Nov 2018 one such site wrote a Big Exclusive article, A you heard it hear first article, here's a short snippet from it

• Vega 7nm will not be coming to gamers.
• Navi 12 will be the first Navi part to arrive and will be landing sometime in 1H 2019. Navi 10 has either been scrapped or will follow later sometime in late 2019 or early 2020, depending on a couple of factors. The performance level of this part will be equivalent to Vega and it will be a small GPU based on 7nm.
• Navi 20 is going to be the true high-end GPU built on the 7nm node and as things stand right now, you are tentatively looking at it landing sometime around late 2020 – 2021.
• Navi will also be the first architecture to transition away from GCN (and along with it, the 4096 SP / 64 CU limit that is inherent to the uArch implementation).
• ‘Next-Gen’ architecture is the uArch formerly codenamed KUMA internally before AMD decided it didn’t like that name too much (oops) and will be based on the same brand new major architecture that AMD rolls out with Navi.

This so called exclusive is an article on Navi.

 

[LePhuronn]

That article was as recently as November '18? Wow. Pretty sure "Next Gen" on AMD's roadmap for 2020 was confirmed as "Arcturus" waaaaay before November. And Navi being GCN 6 was talked about over a year ago.

Edit: that article was WCCFTech, wasn't it: https://wccftech.com/exclusive-first-amd-navi-gpu-will-have-40-cus-and-is-codenamed-navi-12/

 

[Gerard]

Seriously? He was sacked because of how he almost ran RTG into the ground & alienated it's userbase with his deceit & lies, It's amazing how much rubbish swills around in the internet, As soon as Vega released his days were numbered, He went on an extended leave straight away to apparently spend time with his family and he never came back, he was never coming back. He was allowed to call it a resign to save face, Selling RTG to Intel would be akin to AMD commiting suicide so why people believe this sort of rubbish is beyond me, It's having a foothold in both cpu and gpu lines that's kept AMD afloat through the hard times. AMD will never sell RTG.

Hardocp had an entire article about it detailing a lot of what was going on, a couple of years ago would we even have thought amd would be providing onboard graphics for some intel chips?

https://www.hardocp.com/article/2016/05/27/from_ati_to_amd_back_journey_in_futility

I'm more inclined to believe that than a lot of the other stuff that was doing the rounds. They've been around long enough to have plenty of in the know people they can talk to. As for Raja running rtg into the ground, it was alleged that a lot of their engineers were moved over to the ryzen project, if true he could only do what he had the resources to do.

 

[nashathedog]

That article was as recently as November '18? Wow. Pretty sure "Next Gen" on AMD's roadmap for 2020 was confirmed as "Arcturus" waaaaay before November. And Navi being GCN 6 was talked about over a year ago.

Edit: that article was WCCFTech, wasn't it: https://wccftech.com/exclusive-first-amd-navi-gpu-will-have-40-cus-and-is-codenamed-navi-12/

The one & only. I googled for "When was Navi first mentioned by AMD" & the majority of links where to fud like this or Reddit posts, It's actually hard to find the real info, The saddest bit is sites like WCCF thrive by doing it.

 

[nashathedog]

Hardocp had an entire article about it detailing a lot of what was going on, a couple of years ago would we even have thought amd would be providing onboard graphics for some intel chips?

It was an interesting turn of events as it seemed like AMD were signing away their apu advantage but have Intels on board graphics actually got a lot better than they were before? I haven't used Intels onboard.

https://www.hardocp.com/article/2016/05/27/from_ati_to_amd_back_journey_in_futility

I'm more inclined to believe that than a lot of the other stuff that was doing the rounds. They've been around long enough to have plenty of in the know people they can talk to. As for Raja running rtg into the ground, it was alleged that a lot of their engineers were moved over to the ryzen project, if true he could only do what he had the resources to do.

I'll have a good read, cheers, This bothers me though

Full disclosure - HardOCP was not invited to this weekend’s launch in Macau as AMD PR has made a decision to no longer brief this site with the rest of the industry.

I wonder why that was?

 

[Gerard]

It was an interesting turn of events as it seemed like AMD were signing away their apu advantage but have Intels on board graphics actually got a lot better than they were before? I haven't used Intels onboard.


I'll have a good read, cheers, This bothers me though I wonder why that was?

I think its mentioned in the linked thread at the end of the article, amd were shown it before publication and that was their reaction to it. Might be wrong but it resolved a few months later anyway. No idea about intel onboard, think its ok but amd seemingly is better.

 

[nashathedog]

I think its mentioned in the linked thread at the end of the article, amd were shown it before publication and that was their reaction to it. Might be wrong but it resolved a few months later anyway. No idea about intel onboard, think its ok but amd seemingly is better.

I miss not having onboard graphics with Ryzen, I've only used onboard once that I remember which was when I had a gpu that need replacing with my 4790k, I suppose for Intel it has more to do with low to mid level mobile graphics, notebooks & such than anything higher end. That said they may end up competing against AMD for consoles a few gen's down the line.

That article reads like a trash piece, with sentences like how AMD will have to spit shine the turds (speaking about Polaris) and things like "Let’s move onto the bigger issue آ– the desire of AMD’s current GPU leadership to spin off from the rest of AMD and become "ATI" again". which makes no sense as Koduri & co don't have any claim to the gpu side of AMD, I wouldn't put any stock in this kind of article, To me it reads like they're peeved & venting.

 

[4K8KW10]

But please, for crying out loud where is Navi?????????????

Engineering samples anywhere seen? They usually demo the upcoming products but it's true there aren't any official claims about Navi, whatsoever. Except the feature about adaptive shading...

 

[Gerard]

That article reads like a trash piece, with sentences like how AMD will have to spit shine the turds (speaking about Polaris) and things like "Let’s move onto the bigger issue آ– the desire of AMD’s current GPU leadership to spin off from the rest of AMD and become "ATI" again". which makes no sense as Koduri & co don't have any claim to the gpu side of AMD, I wouldn't put any stock in this kind of article, To me it reads like they're peeved & venting.

Peeved is understandable because polaris didn't turn out how it was meant to, amd sort of salvaged it by putting out the "disruptive product" spiel but behind the scenes it was disappointing, was meant to be a higher performer but turned out "meh". The rest of the stuff they just classed as raja being delusional, though they did say there was a deal in the works with intel long before anyone else in the media knew anything about it, so if they could get that bit of info correct months before anyone else knew anything about it i don't see the rest being very far fetched.

 

[bru]

Poor Raja, at one point he was the saviour of AMD's GPU division and now it would seem he has been cast aside to be vilified by one and all.

 

[Zernath]

Poor Raja, at one point he was the saviour of AMD's GPU division and now it would seem he has been cast aside to be vilified by one and all.

Scapegoat, every corporation has one these days. It saves the big boys at the top from taking any flak themselves.

 

[Gerard]

Poor Raja, at one point he was the saviour of AMD's GPU division and now it would seem he has been cast aside to be vilified by one and all.

I even see people giving him crap on twitter =/ He done the best he could do with what he had to work with as far as i can see.

Love to have been a fly on the wall in some of those meetings.

 

[nashathedog]

Peeved is understandable because polaris didn't turn out how it was meant to, amd sort of salvaged it by putting out the "disruptive product" spiel but behind the scenes it was disappointing, was meant to be a higher performer but turned out "meh". The rest of the stuff they just classed as raja being delusional, though they did say there was a deal in the works with intel long before anyone else in the media knew anything about it, so if they could get that bit of info correct months before anyone else knew anything about it i don't see the rest being very far fetched.

Hi, When I said peeved I was talking about those writing the article.

Poor Raja, at one point he was the saviour of AMD's GPU division and now it would seem he has been cast aside to be vilified by one and all.

True but his downfall was his own fault, he was more than happy to let the rumour mill run wild & even had the gall to mention the worst offender at that time (WCCFTech) in a positive light at an event giving them apparent respectability in the eyes of a lot of less clued up people, Then you have to look at how he orchestrated some events & finally went as far as to lie to the online reviewers about Vega pricing so that the reviews were better than they should have been, If AMD hadn't thrown him to the lions I'd be running a different brand of gpu right now & I imagine many others would too, he proved we couldn't trust a word that came out of his mouth, He was a devious so & so.

 

[humbug]

I like Raja as a person but i don't think he did a very good job with his GPU's, the last "great" GPU AMD made was the R9 290X, that was Pre Raja, Fiji and Vega are his.

He was also divisive wanting to separate the GPU division from AMD, its why we ended up with RTG, who no longer exist BTW, its all just AMD again, GPU's under AMD: HD 4000 series, HD 5000 series, HD 6000 series, HD 7000 series and R5/7/9 200 series, all great GPU's, it wasn't until Raja took over that we got very large and expensive under performing GPU's.

AMD's next test will be Navi.

 

[LePhuronn]

AMD's next test will be Navi.

Navi is still GCN, largely designed amongst the turmoil of Koduri's exit and certainly in a period with zero cash. It's a product that straddles a transition period. It'll be better than Vega in terms of size, power and cost, but it won't be magnitudes greater in performance. It will be disruptive like Zen though.

So I'd say AMD's next test is Arcturus: GCN is gone, Koduri is gone, money is available and AMD is a stable, profitable, unified company under Lisa Su. If Navi proves to be their GPU Zen, I really hope Arcturus will be their Zen 2.

 

[BigBANGtheory]

I just want to upgrade from a 980Ti with decent performance at a sensible price, there is simply nothing on the market that offers that right now and Navi is looking like it will fall short too

 

[Zernath]

I just want to upgrade from a 980Ti with decent performance at a sensible price, there is simply nothing on the market that offers that right now and Navi is looking like it will fall short too

Sensible prices are largely a thing of the past, and it's only going to get worse.