EV general discussion

b0rn2sk8 said:
The old Zoe also has an odd rapid charging solution which isn’t available everywhere, if it even has it (it was an option).
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Yeah, there are some quite confusing permutations.

Standard is 22kw AC, "quick" is 43kw AC. The model name gives it away (e.g. Q90/R90 with the Q version being the 43kw).

To make it more confusing, there's also the R110 which is slightly more powerful than the R90, but no "quick" charging option available. The R versions actually use a different motor, and are very slightly more efficient, both in terms of range and charging, but emphasis on the very slightly, you're talking maybe 2-3 miles extra out of a charge and ~1% more efficient charging.
 
jpaul said:
Is 330d/i the typical car Model3 users coming from ? -M3/evs are taking some market not just from premium, but other segments too, and, with the BIK present,
(could be saving ~2K..£4kp/a on £40k car depending on tax bracket) that catchment area is larger too, so someone, previously in a company mondeo could be buying in too.
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Yes I think for private buyers, if you can afford to buy/lease a 330d / 330i type car then the Model 3 (and probably the Polestar) will be the same or cheaper to own and run.

However for company car drivers, a Model 3 / Polestar would cost the driver less (or nothing in cases where they don’t have to pay to “trade up”) and also cost the company less than a Mondeo/Vectra/Passat so that should help increase uptake.
 
[TW]Fox said:
Thewanted seems to, though.

And let's face it the F30 was hardly a BMW high point.
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I think Thewanted seems to have had an issue with his specific car which is a shame, and Tesla’s after-sales is overall not great (haven’t had any issues with mine so not experienced it personally, but a friend has had some minor issues with his which have taken too long to fix).

I have been a petrol-head for >20 years, owned lots of really nice petrol (and diesel) cars ranging from MX5’s to various BMWs. I thought EV’s would be milk-floats that would ruin driving. It turns out that they are utterly brilliant and are only going to get better and better. I like my Tesla way more than I have liked any of my previous cars (for both the driving experience and the tech).

Tesla is definitely not for everyone but EV does not mean Tesla, it means the next step for all the manufacturers we like competing to see who can be the best and most innovative.
 
Why does the Polestar 2 @2.1K weigh 300Kg more than a model 3 ? (eat out to help out)

- it's not much bigger, both companies are using alumnium in the structure, we don't know the percentages, but some of the model 3 exploded diagrams don't show much more than the rear floor/casting section in aluminium, so that wouldn't seem to be where the P2 looses out; there's mention of a P2 titanium sheet protecting battery compartment-
- there have been no revelations about significant crash protection prowess in P2
- Batteries in P2 each in alu container https://insideevs.com/news/343110/lets-take-a-closer-look-at-polestar-2-battery-details/ , pictures show M3's similarly contained.
- model Y is, itself 200Kg more than model 3, so still less than p2.
 
jpaul said:
Why does the Polestar 2 @2.1K weigh 300Kg more than a model 3 ? (eat out to help out)

- it's not much bigger, both companies are using alumnium in the structure, we don't know the percentages, but some of the model 3 exploded diagrams don't show much more than the rear floor/casting section in aluminium, so that wouldn't seem to be where the P2 looses out; there's mention of a P2 titanium sheet protecting battery compartment-
- there have been no revelations about significant crash protection prowess in P2
- Batteries in P2 each in alu container https://insideevs.com/news/343110/lets-take-a-closer-look-at-polestar-2-battery-details/ , pictures show M3's similarly contained.
- model Y is, itself 200Kg more than model 3, so still less than p2.
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Are you comparing the LR tesla since the battery pack is bigger on the PS-M2 than the T-M3 from what I see
Also with polestars links to Volvo its hardly surprising its a bit weighty since historically if you were in a serious accident you wanted to be in a Volvo or a Saab

I like the look of the polestar 2 myself (more than the T-M3)
 
ShiWarrior said:
i read a post on the EV website and they were saying the R is actually better (and more efficient) than the Q ?
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Yes, that's correct, the only downside is the lack of 43kw charging - although to be fair from what I've read on Speak EV, you only get close to the 43kw under very specific circumstances. I have the R110, and I can think of maybe 2 instances where I could have done with the faster charging
 
like with like ...
https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/tesla/model-3/100317/new-tesla-model-3-long-range-2019-uk-review
The 3’s weight of 1,847kg – over 300kg more than a BMW 320d, due mostly to the 75kWh battery – means it will feel different on the road, too. It won’t quite change direction as keenly as a 3 Series, but it stays flat (a benefit of the weight) and there’s plenty of grip.

https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/polestar/2-electric-car/
The American will go further on every charge, according to the official figures, and part of that must be attributable to the Polestar’s weight, which comes in at a chunky 2123kg.
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weight of the car is a passive safety ... first rule of fight club avoid the accident ...

I guess todays customer doesn't care, otherwise Volvo would justify it.
people would be lost with the agility of a ~1T car today - could carbon fibre eventually return that feeling.


 
Long range is single motor for a start. P2 starts with bigger wheels? P2 is a taller vehicle with full tailgate and appropriate roof and hinge structure.

EDIT: error long range is dual motor then? Has that always been the case?
 
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Haggisman said:
Yes, that's correct, the only downside is the lack of 43kw charging - although to be fair from what I've read on Speak EV, you only get close to the 43kw under very specific circumstances. I have the R110, and I can think of maybe 2 instances where I could have done with the faster charging
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Yeah, Zoe is picky with 43kW chargers. And TBH, most early "50kW" charge units (e.g. Ecotricity) can't supply anything close to that.

Given 22kW chargers are often far cheaper (or free), they're often the better choice in that car (unless you're in a rush/on a long journey).
 
Jonnycoupe said:
Long range is single motor for a start. P2 starts with bigger wheels? P2 is a taller vehicle with full tailgate and appropriate roof and hong structure.

EDIT: error long range is dual motor then? Has that always been the case?
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I assume you are talking about the T-M3?

EU - yes
US - no, all early models were 'long range' RWD only, this lasted for quite a few months. They eventually discontinued it when AWD and base models came out.
 
Jonnycoupe said:
Long range is single motor for a start. P2 starts with bigger wheels? P2 is a taller vehicle with full tailgate and appropriate roof and hong structure.
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I'd looked - there is something like 1.5" in height, overall boot capacity similar too, i agree more weight in the tailgate ... but 300kg ?
I wondered if the P2 should really be compared with the Y.

edit: with the meagre 150bhp I have, you know about if you have a full compliment of passengers, and that is les than 300Kg.
edit2: dealer needs a testdrive option with dummys in the rear seats.
 
blun said:
I thought EV’s would be milk-floats that would ruin driving.
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Ive never thought this. A decent EV will be absolutely brilliant and in theory the best suited power train for a decent executive saloon.

But just like it took diesel absolutely ages to be really good, so too is the same with BEV.

It's getting there, just with an irritatingly SUV biased slant.
 
P2 is similar weight the I-PACE as a bit or context.

not sure how much option you get in the seats on a Model 3 easy to add weight.

SUV slant is obvious once you sit in the back of the saloon style ones...
 
jpaul said:
Why does the Polestar 2 @2.1K weigh 300Kg more than a model 3 ? (eat out to help out)

- it's not much bigger, both companies are using alumnium in the structure, we don't know the percentages, but some of the model 3 exploded diagrams don't show much more than the rear floor/casting section in aluminium, so that wouldn't seem to be where the P2 looses out; there's mention of a P2 titanium sheet protecting battery compartment-
- there have been no revelations about significant crash protection prowess in P2
- Batteries in P2 each in alu container https://insideevs.com/news/343110/lets-take-a-closer-look-at-polestar-2-battery-details/ , pictures show M3's similarly contained.
- model Y is, itself 200Kg more than model 3, so still less than p2.
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Similar to why the T.50 is lighter than the F1 through constant iteration, integration, analysis of materials and production methods. The single rear mega casting will be a world away from the initial Model 3 rear chassis construction that was widely criticised for over complexity. If you watch the Munro series of Model Y videos on YT you can see where they have got down to reducing the number of fixings or the amount of potting they use in the battery packs. Tesla are pretty obsessive about it.
 
Got back from my Wales trip which put my M3 SR+ to the test, and it was great. Going we charged at Bridgend (Sarn) Supercharger for 18 mins - no longer than it took us to get coffee, snacks, toilet etc - which gave me some safe juice at the destination. Arrived on 39% but then had to fanny about getting food, a replacement invertor for the camp bed etc, none of which was close and another hour of driving in total took us down to 18%.

Charged overnight on a 3-pin plug at the campsite owner's farm as planned, 15h to get back to 80%, was done by the very early hours. Full day out to Tenby, Barafundle Bay etc. Charged in Tenby for a £1.07, and unfortunately the charger at the beach car park - National Trust - was ICE'd, but hardly surprising given people were straddling verges and blocking access left right and centre etc. Didn't matter in any case.

Didn't charge that night and got back to Bridgend on 8%, got up to 63% in 18 minutes - again, just a toilet, coffee and pastry stop. Impromptu stopped at Cardiff for lunch and charged for free at St David's Centre (Tesla Destination) back up to 90% (may as well if it's free!). Got back to Bristol on 65%.

Total of 360 miles for £1.07 which was the brief 8% charge in Tenby.
 
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