What I really don't understand is why gaming is now associated with hysteria and panic buying. Or should I say the gamers are associated with hysteria and panic buying. I mean it seems that if anyone says OMG THIS IS AMAZING then a very large number of gamers go insane and "must have immediately" without even asking if it makes sense for them to buy it.... or whether it is even "amazing". Flaming wars break out, people use bots to try to grab a card...at almost any price ( some certainly will pay any price! ). I don't understand it.
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When will GPUs return to normal pricing....
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Soldato
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So you wanted a 3080 and are now prepared to pay for a 3080ti?
I don't understand it
Gaming is now bigger than the film and music industries combined.
Suddenly, nearly every living human is/has been subject to some degree of being trapped indoors somewhere.
And the most eye wateringly gorgeous graphics are launching in a handful of consoles and an even bigger number of new graphics cards.
And there isnt the stock to satisfy demand.
Lots of folk havent "gone insane"
I know Im very excited about getting a 3080 one day!
I enjoy the excitement. I enjoy the positive energy within SOME of the drama. Exciting times actually. Unprecidented in many respects too.
Scalping sucks.
But not letting scalping and the stock shortage drama bother you too much can be a choice. See that as another positive mate.
Nope, that ship has long sailed. Yes moden gpus have list prices more than previous ones but we dont have $2.5 to the pound anymore and the way things are going we may even have parity within the next 5 years.
So years ago when you bought your flagship for £500, that would now be well over a £1000 now anyways never mind any inflation etc.
And shortages have added another £50-£200 oper card over list price as well.
The thing is the 3080FE was meant to be £649. There were 8 AIB cards all with a list price less than £649 with £579 been the cheapest and even the most expensive Asus strix OC or FTW Ultra was meant to be less than £750.
Compare that with a 8800 Ultra from 2007 which with todays exchange rate would be £750. Even the 8800 GTX would be £585 at todays exchange rates.
So £585 to £649 in 13 years doesnt seem that bad tbh. They have certainly gone uop less than inflation.
WHats killing it is that VAT is more, the exchange rate isnt 2.3:1 and more like 1.3:1, and the fact that half the 3080 cards for sale arent below the FE price and have a £200 "shortage" surcharge on them.
Compare that with a 8800 Ultra from 2007 which with todays exchange rate would be £750. Even the 8800 GTX would be £585 at todays exchange rates.
So £585 to £649 in 13 years doesnt seem that bad tbh. They have certainly gone uop less than inflation.
WHats killing it is that VAT is more, the exchange rate isnt 2.3:1 and more like 1.3:1, and the fact that half the 3080 cards for sale arent below the FE price and have a £200 "shortage" surcharge on them.
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I bought an NV 6800 Ultra in July 2004 for £336, which is about £535 in todays money. Not a million miles away from the 3080 RRP.
But I think what a lot of people forget when going back 10-15 years is just how strong the Pound was against the Dollar back then. In 2004 when I bought that card £1 got you about 1.8$. No it gets you about 1.3$.
What is new is the money no object Halo product at the top in the last few years.
Edit - And an extra 2.5% VAT as Greebo just said.
But I think what a lot of people forget when going back 10-15 years is just how strong the Pound was against the Dollar back then. In 2004 when I bought that card £1 got you about 1.8$. No it gets you about 1.3$.
What is new is the money no object Halo product at the top in the last few years.
Edit - And an extra 2.5% VAT as Greebo just said.
I think people also forget how quickly tech was updated back then.... seemed need need to upgrade every 6-12 months wheras the pace of change is much slower now
Only because they could shrink nodes much faster back then as the dies were pretty large in comparison, it's been a lot slower process over the last 10 or so years. 28nm was a sticking point for a long time.
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Yeah cards came every 12 months or so and absolutely wiped the floor with the previous gen, plus games were released that were literally unplayable at the highest settings on even high end current hardware. That doesn't really happen anymore and hasn't since Crysis.
The Nvidia 6800 GeForce Ultra was about $500 in 2004 which is about $688 today.
Nvidia Launches GeForce 6800 Graphics Family - ExtremeTech
$500 in 2004 → 2020 | Inflation Calculator (in2013dollars.com)
Nvidia Launches GeForce 6800 Graphics Family - ExtremeTech
$500 in 2004 → 2020 | Inflation Calculator (in2013dollars.com)
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Yeah just shows that's the bigger issue here. My purchase at £336 was a good chunk below the dollar equivalent. Now we're almost always 1 for 1, it would have been £500 in todays market.
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Ouch. I've always thought I've been on a 3 year cycle with that being about 2 generations, although when I work it out I've clearly broken that rule a few times, mostly in the early noughties I think. Single generation jumps for my value judgement rarely make sense in GPU or CPU.
One thing that has helped GPUs tho' is how so much of the market focused and stagnated on 1080P, I have refused to ever settle for 1080p, I had 1200 vertical pixels on my last CRT and I refuse to go backwards on pixel count. I had crossfire Radeon 3870s at one point, pretty sure those cards cost me £300 total (new).
However, the £ has been a bit worse:
https://www.in2013dollars.com/uk/inflation/2005?amount=1
50% more £ needed to match the £ value in 2005.
Also, in 2005 it was roughly $1.8 to £1
So a $499 https://uk.pcmag.com/graphics-cards/80113/nvidia-geforce-6800-ultra should have cost around £277, which in raw £ inflation would be £416 today.
However exchange rate has also changed to $1.35 to £1, so the pound has lost 25% exchange rate power compared to 2005, taking the £416 up to £520. And that is without adding the general pound tax that we see over here.
Pretty sure salaries haven't risen in line to match that 50% inflation and 25% exchange rate hit.
Still, I think £600 should be the current top end price, things are silly now, a crappy 1650 is £140+, how the hell?
Simple - people pay it.
I feel that those who say that consoles are such a great value and way more cheaper than PC gaming are the same ones who buy their high end smartphones on contract and go around saying they got them for free or thereabouts.
Let's not forget that this generation console games went up in price which is surely due to increasing hardware prices so to keep consoles at relatively affordable price the companies had to recover the costs in games and subscriptions.
If we look at PS5 for example the console is what £450.? add to that let's say £15 extra compared to PC for each game and maybe £35 a year for PlayStation plus subscription.
So if an average user buys 10 games a year for those prices and the lifespan of a consoles generation is 7 years that adds up to £1050 add to that 7 years of PS Plus (which without a doubt will go up in price in the future) that's another £245 which adds up to almost £1800 including the console purchase.
That price will give you 3 high end gpu upgrades over the console lifespan and each one will improve the gaming experience by miles.
Yes I know thats just for the gpu and the rest of the system needs to be upgraded at some point as well but who buys a pc just to game and literally not do nothing else with it.?
Consoles might be a better value but not by as much as some are making them out to be.
Leats not forget about game modding, mouse and keyboard gaming and the choice of how game should run or look which consoles can’t do.
I’m both a console and pc gamer and will only play PS5 exclusives when I finally manage to get one because I think gaming on a pc is far better experience due to the fact that I choose how the game runs and looks.
Let's not forget that this generation console games went up in price which is surely due to increasing hardware prices so to keep consoles at relatively affordable price the companies had to recover the costs in games and subscriptions.
If we look at PS5 for example the console is what £450.? add to that let's say £15 extra compared to PC for each game and maybe £35 a year for PlayStation plus subscription.
So if an average user buys 10 games a year for those prices and the lifespan of a consoles generation is 7 years that adds up to £1050 add to that 7 years of PS Plus (which without a doubt will go up in price in the future) that's another £245 which adds up to almost £1800 including the console purchase.
That price will give you 3 high end gpu upgrades over the console lifespan and each one will improve the gaming experience by miles.
Yes I know thats just for the gpu and the rest of the system needs to be upgraded at some point as well but who buys a pc just to game and literally not do nothing else with it.?
Consoles might be a better value but not by as much as some are making them out to be.
Leats not forget about game modding, mouse and keyboard gaming and the choice of how game should run or look which consoles can’t do.
I’m both a console and pc gamer and will only play PS5 exclusives when I finally manage to get one because I think gaming on a pc is far better experience due to the fact that I choose how the game runs and looks.
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On second thought I think I have to correct my previous statement. 10 games a year is probably above average but I said that as I buy more games than that.
On top a lot of gamers will sell or trade their old and or finished games. that’s not me as I only buy digital versions.
Anyway I still think pc gaming has its values as you we are not restricted by what developers and publishers think is best for us by choosing setting which they think are best.
I like to tweak my games to my taste and in my book that’s called freedom which is worth eBay price.
On top a lot of gamers will sell or trade their old and or finished games. that’s not me as I only buy digital versions.
Anyway I still think pc gaming has its values as you we are not restricted by what developers and publishers think is best for us by choosing setting which they think are best.
I like to tweak my games to my taste and in my book that’s called freedom which is worth eBay price.