Realised FOMO / missing the boat

[HangTime]

I'm not sure what the right wording for this, but does anyone ever sit feeling sorry for themselves about not moving up the property ladder when they had the opportunity to, with the market pulling away from them? So like Fear Of Missing Out, but it's not so much a fear of something happening, more a realisation that it's already happened. And I'm talking specifically people that could afford to move up the ladder, not people for whom this was out of reach to begin with and is now even further out of reach - for them it's a fact of life outside their control rather than something they could have influenced.

Basically, a couple of years ago there was a stamp duty holiday and very low interest rates. I surmised (https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/threads/impact-of-wfh-trends-on-housing-market.18889738/ ) that big properties away from traditional commuter locations were likely to rise in value significantly. We were in a reasonably strong financial position (secure long term reasonably well paid jobs, no mortgage on current home, reasonable additional savings etc) and could have easily afforded to move to a bigger house. Since we bought our house we've had two kids, income a lot higher so wouldn't mind more space, a bigger garden etc, especially now I work remotely and my wife occasionally works at home too, kids are getting bigger / more stuff etc.

We didn't do anything and since then, house prices have risen I guess around 25%, interest rates have risen (which I also anticipated) and generally we have 'missed the boat' compared to buying something two years ago. I know quite a few friends, colleagues etc who have bought houses in recent years, it's hard not to be envious at times.

I feel like a housing market collapse would help, but realistically we're never going to get back to that position, even if prices fall 20% (giving parity to 2020) any borrowing will be more expensive.

I guess it comes back to the traditional argument about, house prices rise in long term, don't worry about what happened in the past as that is water under the bridge, it's better to buy today than just cry about not buying two years ago, yada yada...

 

[gc123]

know that feeling, retired house no mortgage, inheritance in bank, wanted to move to a smaller bungalow. ummed and arghed and now with price rises bungalows are a lot dearer. next worry is if we move do we end up spending too much and 12 months down the line it be worth less?.

for the moment staying where we are . have a feeling kids may require help with there mortgages hmmmmm.

still learning german

 

[MissChief]

Fear of Missed out more like. For many, short of a parental death, getting on the housing ladder is more or less impossible.

 

[HungryHippos]

I'm not sure what the right wording for this, but does anyone ever sit feeling sorry for themselves about not moving up the property ladder when they had the opportunity to, with the market pulling away from them? So like Fear Of Missing Out, but it's not so much a fear of something happening, more a realisation that it's already happened. And I'm talking specifically people that could afford to move up the ladder, not people for whom this was out of reach to begin with and is now even further out of reach - for them it's a fact of life outside their control rather than something they could have influenced.

Basically, a couple of years ago there was a stamp duty holiday and very low interest rates. I surmised (https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/threads/impact-of-wfh-trends-on-housing-market.18889738/ ) that big properties away from traditional commuter locations were likely to rise in value significantly. We were in a reasonably strong financial position (secure long term reasonably well paid jobs, no mortgage on current home, reasonable additional savings etc) and could have easily afforded to move to a bigger house. Since we bought our house we've had two kids, income a lot higher so wouldn't mind more space, a bigger garden etc, especially now I work remotely and my wife occasionally works at home too, kids are getting bigger / more stuff etc.

We didn't do anything and since then, house prices have risen I guess around 25%, interest rates have risen (which I also anticipated) and generally we have 'missed the boat' compared to buying something two years ago. I know quite a few friends, colleagues etc who have bought houses in recent years, it's hard not to be envious at times.

I feel like a housing market collapse would help, but realistically we're never going to get back to that position, even if prices fall 20% (giving parity to 2020) any borrowing will be more expensive.

I guess it comes back to the traditional argument about, house prices rise in long term, don't worry about what happened in the past as that is water under the bridge, it's better to buy today than just cry about not buying two years ago, yada yada...

On the other hand, you're on the housing ladder so you've done well vs people that ummed and ahhed about buying two years, are stuck renting, and don't own anything with house prices creeping up. Your house has been hedging your choice, even if it's not what you wanted, it's gained in value along with the rest of the market.

Sometimes you just have to live with a good or a bad choice, we've all been there.

 

[The_Arbiter]

Not me, i only just managed the FTB!

But to be on point/realistic, house moves are rarely smooth, and houses are not always as good as they seem (maintenance, location, neighbours, etc). You could also take the view as you're having more cash to help your kids in the long run too. It's easy to think more about the things you've not got, than things you've got

 

[Harnser]

I'm not sure what the right wording for this, but does anyone ever sit feeling sorry for themselves about not moving up the property ladder when they had the opportunity to, with the market pulling away from them? So like Fear Of Missing Out, but it's not so much a fear of something happening, more a realisation that it's already happened. And I'm talking specifically people that could afford to move up the ladder, not people for whom this was out of reach to begin with and is now even further out of reach - for them it's a fact of life outside their control rather than something they could have influenced.

Yes. I could have bought in 2007. I thought property was overvalued so I waited for a crash. I convinced myself it was better to be free so I could move around the country.
Every year from 2010 onwards I repeated that. I could buy but wait for it to crash, then I can get more.

Fast forward to early 2020 and I finally buy. Property prices grew faster than my savings so I got less. I have a house but what a muppet I was.

 

[gc123]

Yes. I could have bought in 2007. I thought property was overvalued so I waited for a crash. I convinced myself it was better to be free so I could move around the country.
Every year from 2010 onwards I repeated that. I could buy but wait for it to crash, then I can get more.

Fast forward to early 2020 and I finally buy. Property prices grew faster than my savings so I got less. I have a house but what a muppet I was.

dont beat yourself up we all wish we had a crystal ball sometimes

 

[BongoHunter]

Hind sights always 20:20

If I'd have bought a cheap house in Camden just after I'd graduated Uni as planned (I could have just about managed it with the mortgage deals as the were back in 2006)

I would have made half a million on it by 2016, maybe more.

Didn't go for it as we viewed a few but wanted to live somewhere in West London which was to pricy for us to buy in so we rented out west instead.

 

[413x]

I've done one stupid and one good decision on housing.

The stupid.
Not getting a house when I lived in Peterborough. Always thought I'd be here "1 or 2 years" ended up being 4.
And that was renting. So yeah. Big fail there.

The good.
On flip side bought house (FTB) in feb 2020. I was so 50:50. Covid was on way. I was sure houses would crash with people losing their jobs.
I think if I had been early stages I'd have stopped looking. Bought it. Over asking. Thinking.. Have I been an idiot.
What I didn't count on was the tories propping everything up.
I also maxed out mortgage for it. I had 1k or so left to my name. You know.. If boiler breaks.. Credit! Never felt so vulnerable financially.

Fast forward 2 years and house is worth 30pc more. Had I missed out I'd never be able to afford a 3 bed detached with a garden as my first home.
Zoopla says its gone up 70k. Disgusting really.



So both times not going for it was and would have been a mistake.

Really quite lucky at the moment. In a house as nice as a lot of people will ever have. Great for 2 people. "could" live in it forever. But too many neighbours, too close, with noise kids!
Also, if didn't get this might still be renting that 1bed upper floor house conversion that was vile. Things falling apart, rotten cupboards. Electric Heaters that smelt. Or didn't work when on.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

I've got 'lucky' twice. But, not as lucky as others.

Bought our first house in 2008 when the market was at it's peak and interest rates were 6.5%. At the time I felt like I'd missed out - paid over the odds. Colleagues and friends had all managed to afford much better properties, and had paid less for them at the time. Over the next 2 years, our property actually went down in value - however interest rates also went down, till we were only paying around half of what we'd originally expected to be paying. So, we used that extra money to extend the house.

Then came Covid, everything extension wise was just about paid off and we had a choice to either live comfortably, or make a move. And by chance one of our 'dream' houses just up the road was up for sale, and had been sitting on the market for 6 months (during the first lockdown). We booked a viewing, did a few sums and made an offer that day, arranged viewings and our house was sold two days later. And that was it - done. Whilst the process was going through the stamp duty announcement happened and the housing market went insane. Luckily our sale was all arranged and went through with us saving £15k we hadn't budgeted for. So yes, that one was pretty lucky. The first house, not so much.

I guess what I'm saying is - waiting is never a better option. I expect the same cycle will likely happen again. It just takes a long while.

 

[Participant]

Jumping up the housing ladder as quickly as possible isn't always better than just smashing out the mortgage repayments and getting more equity, even in an environment where house prices and interest rates are increasing.

Higher interest rates could mean the spare cash from not having a larger mortgage is saved / invested / put into your pension and generates more of a liquid return than property value increases, which are not liquid until you downsize, rent, or die. This could mean you have more disposable income in retirement and / or are able to move to an even better home down the line.

A lot of people (primarily foreign countries) shy away from owning as it reduces one's flexibility and potentially earning ability, as you're anchored to one place for ~10 years.

I'm sure you're aware of these views and scenarios and have counter arguments in terms of, for example, yes but I want to enjoy a larger house whilst the kids are living with us, etc. but just wanted to write them in this thread (if someone else hasn't already).

 

[Uhtred]

The stupid.
Not getting a house when I lived in Peterborough. Always thought I'd be here "1 or 2 years" ended up being 4.
And that was renting. So yeah. Big fail there.

Obviously I don't know the figures involved but are you sure it was a big mistake? 4 years isn't a huge amount of time and buying/selling/moving is expensive and time consuming. Add to that, it sounds like you were in a situation where flexibility was important, and that's definitely easier if you're renting. Just my 2p

 

[413x]

Obviously I don't know the figures involved but are you sure it was a big mistake? 4 years isn't a huge amount of time and buying/selling/moving is expensive and time consuming. Add to that, it sounds like you were in a situation where flexibility was important, and that's definitely easier if you're renting. Just my 2p

Not too sure. It might not be massive.
But I feel it was a mistake. I'd have been paying off a mortgage and not have to have paid stamp duty for that house.

But I guess sell fees would have been added. Maybe I shouldn't look at house price rises. But I don't think they were as high as covid years.
It also may have made it harder to move away I guess.

 

[Scam]

I think given the incessant rise in property prices in this country everyone is going to have an element of FOMO, which really won't go away unless there's a crash etc.

I distinctly remembering the first of my friend's group that bought a flat in London on his own when he was in his early 30s. His parent's gave him a chunk, nothing wrong with that and I said to him "this is really going to set you up well financially, make sure you appreciate it in the long term". Lo and behold, he then upgraded to a 3 bed house round the corner, clearly had more monthly money to spend than the rest of us who were renting poky flats, and is now looking at moving out to what I would call a 'proper adult's house' (detached, big garden, driveway etc.) somewhere out west of London in commuterville. Absolutely good for him, but without that first chunk of help, and doing it so early for a FTB, I'd imagine life for him would be quite different.

Where I live in west London, it's best not to look at house prices over the years. There's some houses that have been lived in (i.e. not sold) for 15-30yrs, and if you look at the for-sale price now compared to the last one (and do the maths), they'd gone up on average of like 60-90k per year. If that's not like winning the lottery then I don't know what is.

 

[413x]

I think given the incessant rise in property prices in this country everyone is going to have an element of FOMO, which really won't go away unless there's a crash etc.

I distinctly remembering the first of my friend's group that bought a flat in London on his own when he was in his early 30s. His parent's gave him a chunk, nothing wrong with that and I said to him "this is really going to set you up well financially, make sure you appreciate it in the long term". Lo and behold, he then upgraded to a 3 bed house round the corner, clearly had more monthly money to spend than the rest of us who were renting poky flats, and is now looking at moving out to what I would call a 'proper adult's house' (detached, big garden, driveway etc.) somewhere out west of London in commuterville. Absolutely good for him, but without that first chunk of help, and doing it so early for a FTB, I'd imagine life for him would be quite different.

Where I live in west London, it's best not to look at house prices over the years. There's some houses that have been lived in (i.e. not sold) for 15-30yrs, and if you look at the for-sale price now compared to the last one (and do the maths), they'd gone up on average of like 60-90k per year. If that's not like winning the lottery then I don't know what is.

Its life changing.
I know someone similar. Not London. But a chunk of inheritance young. So almost no time renting.

Bought a 500k house during the stamp duty break. He's a teacher.
Apparently his mortgage is smaller on this new house than mine!


Big chunk of cash to your kids when young is so so much more valuable than the normal inheritance.

 

[mid_gen]

If you have a home and mortgage you can afford, or even better, no mortgage, then you're winning at life already.

I had several opportunities in the past to buy property that would have made me almost a paper millionaire by now, but I chose to move abroad for a decade. Don't regret it for a second mind. Of course the smart move is to buy your FTB, *then* emigrate and let some poor sucker pay your mortgage off, but I have a principled objection to the rentier economy and would rather be worse off than a hypocrite!

Fortunately I earn enough to have just bought a place a bit later in life (with a very privileged mortgage arrangement I am extremely grateful for).

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Its life changing.
I know someone similar. Not London. But a chunk of inheritance young. So almost no time renting.

Bought a 500k house during the stamp duty break. He's a teacher.
Apparently his mortgage is smaller on this new house than mine!


Big chunk of cash to your kids when young is so so much more valuable than the normal inheritance.

I absolutely plan on helping both my kinds into proper houses as soon as they're working. Not made of money, but anything I can give them early on would be much more beneficial than having to wait until I'm dead.

 

[HungryHippos]

If you have a home and mortgage you can afford, or even better, no mortgage, then you're winning at life already.

I had several opportunities in the past to buy property that would have made me almost a paper millionaire by now, but I chose to move abroad for a decade. Don't regret it for a second mind. Of course the smart move is to buy your FTB, *then* emigrate and let some poor sucker pay your mortgage off, but I have a principled objection to the rentier economy and would rather be worse off than a hypocrite!

Fortunately I earn enough to have just bought a place a bit later in life (with a very privileged mortgage arrangement I am extremely grateful for).

There's nothing wrong with buying a house, and then renting it out whilst you try living abroad.

Keeps your options open, and hedges against price increases in case you want to return.

Renting may be looked down upon by people but ultimately it does serve a purpose, sometimes people move about for their job and prefer to rent because they aren't tied to an area.

Going full evil property empire landlord, yeah, that isn't good, but owning one house isn't fundamentally going to break the mould.

 

[mid_gen]

There's nothing wrong with buying a house, and then renting it out whilst you try living abroad.

Keeps your options open, and hedges against price increases in case you want to return.

Renting may be looked down upon by people but ultimately it does serve a purpose, sometimes people move about for their job and prefer to rent because they aren't tied to an area.

Going full evil property empire landlord, yeah, that isn't good, but owning one house isn't fundamentally going to break the mould.

I don't judge people who do it, and I know it is eminently sensible from a financial perspective. But personally, I don't want to be part of the problem, so to speak.

 

[413x]

I absolutely plan on helping both my kinds into proper houses as soon as they're working. Not made of money, but anything I can give them early on would be much more beneficial than having to wait until I'm dead.

5k in your 20s is worth more than 50k in your 50s in my opinion.

Its not only the leg up. It allows you to actually live a bit more during best years of your life.