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*** The AMD RDNA 4 Rumour Mill ***

ben90 said:
I'm sticking with they balls'd up their pricing :cry:
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I think it's more significant than that.

The branding slide points to them aiming the 9070 a half tier up from the 7900 GRE and the 9070 XT slightly higher than the 7900 XT. It seems reasonable to assume this has at least some correlation to intended pricing, i.e. $599-$649 and $799-$849.

Leaked benchmarks don't point to the performance you would expect at these prices. But there was the story about pre-release drivers being nerfed. If that's the case, and final performance is 20% better, then the MLID benchmarks would put the 9070 at 30% faster than the 7900 GRE and 9070 XT at 30% faster than the 7900 XT. That's performance that would justify the above prices, especially with the RT improvements and FSR4. It would also explain the cooler designs on the announced cards.

All should have been looking good for launch. But then they got word of Blackwell performance & pricing. Nvidia did something unexpected - they released cards with low gen-on-gen performance improvements (especially compared to Super cards) and cut prices. AMD's product stack was suddenly too performant and too expensive. With no possible quick fix, they abandoned the launch.

Classic AMD own-goal - if they had stuck with the old branding, they could have marketed their cards against the next tier up from Nvidia. But they switched to 9070/9070 XT to infer equivalence with the 5070/Ti. That equivalence works both ways. Not only that, but cards had started shopping, meaning branding & specs are locked in.

The necessary price drops to match the price points of the 5070/Ti are huge, so AMD are now waiting until after those cards launch to ensure they get the revised pricing right (i.e. work out how high they can keep prices without looking expensive).

If I'm right, this could be a weird generation :p AMD leading Nvidia in benchmarks by a huge margin, but their cards being priced slightly higher than the Nvidia (naming) equivalent.
 
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aminegriffy said:
Waiting until March with Trump tariffs coming is not a risk I'm willing to take. I have a PC build without a GPU and I'm tired of waiting. The 7900Gre is already not being produced anymore and it's a challenge to find the US so I'm not gonna be surprised if it will be the same here in the UK.
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Again with the Trump tarrifs you are not going to be buying or importing a product from the usa they are made elsewhere
 
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Game said:
Again with the Trump tarrifs you are not going to be buying or importing a product from the usa they are made elsewhere
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If they rise the MSRP in the US then we gonna be affected. Remember to them the £=$. Unless we convince AMD/Nvidia to change headquarters and move to Europe then we are sadly going to be affected by any price bump in the US.
 
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Bidley said:
"5070 = 4090 performance"
GDDR6 4070 stealth refresh
4080 unlaunch
GTX970 3.5gb VRAM

I would argue those are far more egregious cheap/dirty practices than competing against your competitor (for which there are far better examples of AMD anyway).
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You do make good points, however I'd say that none of these relied on knowing anything about AMD's products which is what I feel makes it a dirty/cheap tactic.
"5070 = 4090 performance" - Probably true under the specific circumstances and highlights MFG, but definitely misleading.
GDDR6 4070 stealth refresh - Yeah, this was disappointing. Apparently it didn't affect performance, so if true then maybe not so bad?
4080 unlaunch - so they didn't launch something (which I think was later launched as the 4070Ti?), not sure how that's an issue.
GTX970 3.5gb VRAM - It's not like they changed it, it gave the performance it was reviewed as having, it had 4GB VRAM. I don't remember quite the issue around this but did it ever state that all 4GB were the same or was that an assumption people made?

However in fairness, I also didn't buy a GTX970, a 4070 or an unreleased 4080. Nor do I intend to buy a 5070, so from that point of view I've not bought any of those products either.

uscool said:
Better RT and upscaling, I would wait and just take that chance why risk buyers remorse
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Remember that a lot of people have said they turn off RT because it's not worth the performance hit (will probably still be true on the 9070s) and doesn't make things look any better (in most cases). Also better RT still won't be much good if the framerates are still too low to be nicely playable (as is often brought up with the lower end cards, yeah a 4060 has better RT than a 7600, but are either of them useable?). Maybe aminegriffy isn't too bothered about RT?
As for upscaling I do remember that while there's not much disagreement that DLSS is better, there's also a lot of people saying that FSR3 is perfectly usable. Plus didn't they say FSR4 would be coming to the 7000 (in some form)?
Personally I agree, I'd probably wait for the new cards unless I saw a good deal on a 4090.
 
GoogalyMoogaly said:
Remember that a lot of people have said they turn off RT because it's not worth the performance hit (will probably still be true on the 9070s) and doesn't make things look any better (in most cases). Also better RT still won't be much good if the framerates are still too low to be nicely playable (as is often brought up with the lower end cards, yeah a 4060 has better RT than a 7600, but are either of them useable?). Maybe aminegriffy isn't too bothered about RT?
As for upscaling I do remember that while there's not much disagreement that DLSS is better, there's also a lot of people saying that FSR3 is perfectly usable. Plus didn't they say FSR4 would be coming to the 7000 (in some form)?
Personally I agree, I'd probably wait for the new cards unless I saw a good deal on a 4090.
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I play at 1440p so 9070xt should have enough headroom, and can use better upscaling, game with RT is usually single player which I don't need super high FPS and above 60 shouldn't be an issue

This is looking to be 4070ti super type of RT?which I think is fine at 1440p and very usable

You can't really compare 4060 has better RT than a 7600, when neither RT is usable we actually have RT performance that's usable now
 
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The question is the 9070xt gonna surpass the 7900xt? The 7900XT can be had for £629 depending on the model, and even in the US it's like $630 ish before taxes.. so the 9070xt should be more than $600
 
GoogalyMoogaly said:
You do make good points, however I'd say that none of these relied on knowing anything about AMD's products which is what I feel makes it a dirty/cheap tactic.
"5070 = 4090 performance" - Probably true under the specific circumstances and highlights MFG, but definitely misleading.
GDDR6 4070 stealth refresh - Yeah, this was disappointing. Apparently it didn't affect performance, so if true then maybe not so bad?
4080 unlaunch - so they didn't launch something (which I think was later launched as the 4070Ti?), not sure how that's an issue.
GTX970 3.5gb VRAM - It's not like they changed it, it gave the performance it was reviewed as having, it had 4GB VRAM. I don't remember quite the issue around this but did it ever state that all 4GB were the same or was that an assumption people made?

However in fairness, I also didn't buy a GTX970, a 4070 or an unreleased 4080. Nor do I intend to buy a 5070, so from that point of view I've not bought any of those products either.
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The 4070 didn't lose much performance at all, but they used cheaper RAM and released it at the same price with the same name. Misleading and dirty.

The 4080 12gb was announced, people saw that it was a severely cut-down card and not an 80-class, so Nvidia renamed it the 70ti and cut the price $100. Misleading and dirty. They've done it again with this generation, except it's with the entire product stack with the exception of the 5090, which has increased in price against the previous flagship.

Write-up of the class-action lawsuit that Nvidia settled on the GTX 970 here.

I was commenting on your position that somehow AMD are being cheap/dirty by pricing against their competitor (which is a thing companies do in all industries), and going with Nvidia as a result of this. When Nvidia are absolutely no better. At least with AMD's strategy here there's a chance it will benefit the consumer.
 
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Whoops

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Somebody didn't get the memo: AMD ad claims you can enjoy gaming on Radeon RX 9070 XT already - VideoCardz.com

AMD says you can ‘play now’ with Radeon RX 9070 series So RDNA4 was supposed to launch today after all? RX 9070 XT ad (translated), Source: AMD/Reddit If we needed any proof that the Radeon RX 9070 series was supposed to be announced today, this is probably our best leak yet. An advertisement on...
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RADEON-RX-9070XT-AD-HERO-1.jpg
 
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Bidley said:
The 4070 didn't lose much performance at all, but they used cheaper RAM and released it at the same price with the same name. Misleading and dirty.

The 4080 12gb was announced, people saw that it was a severely cut-down card and not an 80-class, so Nvidia renamed it the 70ti and cut the price $100. Misleading and dirty. They've done it again with this generation, except it's with the entire product stack with the exception of the 5090, which has increased in price against the previous flagship.

Write-up of the class-action lawsuit that Nvidia settled on the GTX 970 here.

I was commenting on your position that somehow AMD are being cheap/dirty by pricing against their competitor (which is a thing companies do in all industries), and going with Nvidia as a result of this. When Nvidia are absolutely no better. At least with AMD's strategy here there's a chance it will benefit the consumer.
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I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
Also we don't know if AMD's strategy is of benefit to the customer, it may well be a move to maximise profits by pricing it at the most expensive price point they think they can get away with after seeing Nvidia's results. This doesn't help the customer, this helps the shareholders.
 
If they can release, they should to grab the sales from people that cannot wait. We have a good idea of the NV price/performance so waiting 2 months seems pointless and they will miss a lot of sales as people will just buy NV cards on day one.
 
aminegriffy said:
The question is the 9070xt gonna surpass the 7900xt? The 7900XT can be had for £629 depending on the model, and even in the US it's like $630 ish before taxes.. so the 9070xt should be more than $600
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The leaked benchmarks point to the 9070 XT out-performing the 7900 XT. But I don't think that tells us very much because:

1. The leaks might not be correct and/or might not be representative of final performance. We also don't know what card was used - was it at stock speeds or factory overclocked?

2. The 7900 XT is currently at clearance pricing.

3. There is typically an improvement in price/performance between generations.

Based on the above, I'd predict the 9070 XT will be somewhere between $550 and $850, with performance falling somewhere between the 7900 XT and 4080 Super :p
 
McPhee said:
I think it's more significant than that.

<Snipped lots of very good and relevant points of evidence>

If I'm right, this could be a weird generation :p AMD leading Nvidia in benchmarks by a huge margin, but their cards being priced slightly higher than the Nvidia (naming) equivalent.
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I think you have nailed what's happened since CES in this post, the performance information and pictures of the AIB designs all point to a targeting of a higher price tier, it would also explain the delay waiting for Nvidias full release. Pricing will be really interesting.

Although Nvidia seem to have their own issues... ;)
 
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