He’s been the best player to pull on the shirt for the last what, 5 years or so? Criminal that he can’t find the right place for him in the team imo.
Poll: AmorIn or AmorOut?
- Thread starter Robbo
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I don't see how he's proving the system works, proving the system works is him getting results with the squad he has at his disposal. I think we need to remind ourselves that we were convincingly beat by Man City, it wasn't like the opening game vs Arsenal. Add to that looking poor against Fulham for half of that game, being convincingly beaten by a tier 4 club in the cup and scraping a win vs Burnley due to the stupidity of Anthony.
I also think people also need to stop seeing the system/formation as this isolated element. A formation can only work if the players are capable of executing it and he had some leeway last season considering he came in mid-season. This year the squad has undoubtedly strengthened, albeit not in every area we needed, and he had a pre-season. He simply cannot have us lingering above the relegation zone again.
There's clearly more to a formation just working or not, Glasner has been getting results with Palace so either he's better at coaching it into the Palace players, or their players have the capability to play it and ours do not.
With his preferred formation, we're having to shoe horn players into positions they're just not capable of playing. At least with a 4-2-3-1, he can play Bruno behind Sesko with Chuna and Mbeumo either side of him. The two in front of the back four can be whoever really, it's better than having one of them being Bruno. The downside is Amad and Mount won't get much game time but Mount loves the medical bed anyway and Amad just isn't working as a RWB and can be rotated/substituted for Mbeumo.
I'll join in.christ, wouldn't that be a sight to behold. i reckon i'd have to break my teatotal vow and have a celebratory whisky or 10 if we manage that this season
Because I can't see it happening
Without going all Football Manager, I simply refuse to believe this is a side that should be 15th~ if it's being well coached and organised.
I'd avoid any high pressing, and you could play Casemiro instead of Mainoo just for extra defensive solidity.
Pick whatever defenders you want, we have quite a few options there. Maguire is limited but he always gives 100% and seems pretty effective at corners.
I'd avoid any high pressing, and you could play Casemiro instead of Mainoo just for extra defensive solidity.
Pick whatever defenders you want, we have quite a few options there. Maguire is limited but he always gives 100% and seems pretty effective at corners.
Caporegime
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The problem is Cunha isn't a left winger and we have no second option. We have one sub to cover Mainoo and Ugarte. A single injury means no subs. Our only backup to Bruno is an injury prone Mount. We just don't have the squad depth to suddenly start playing 5 midfielders unless we somehow convert a defender.
I wonder would martinez have been a temporary option as a cdm type were it not for him still being on the recovery trail? He’s got the energy and combative nature that is sorely missing in the middle of the park.
Mazza?
I think Cunha would be able to function there but I take your point. We are a bit light in midfield (as usual) which is a shame. Perhaps Glasner is the answer then, he knows this system and can play others too.
It’s mostly Amorim, it’s not just the system but how he’s using players within the system. A good manager would be pragmatic and try something else.
He’s had the best part of a year here and a full pre-season and short of a few statistics, nothing has changed. However you look at it, he looks massively out of his depth.
We can’t carry on like this so either things change pretty rapidly or he’s gone.
He’s had the best part of a year here and a full pre-season and short of a few statistics, nothing has changed. However you look at it, he looks massively out of his depth.
We can’t carry on like this so either things change pretty rapidly or he’s gone.
That’s the million dollar question - for me it’s still 50/50. I get amorims desire to stick to his preferred formation but he has to accept/realise that unless he can somehow magic someone out of the current squad to plug the huge hole in the middle of the park he’s not going to see another transfer window. Surely that means he has to compromise, even just temporarily, to get points on the board to keep him in the job long enough to fully implement his plan with the correct players.
Then again, maybe he’s tried different formations etc in training and they’re all a crap sight worse at those
I still fully support him and despite the results have seen some improvements in the overall squad play that should have seen us with at least a couple more points but having 2 minging keepers and a gaping hole in midfield has cost the team hugely. And almost certainly armorim his job unless fortunes take an upturn.
Unfortunately you know nothing is going to change and thats the issue. Hes been found out and every team now knows to overwhelm the midfield and they are good.
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The fact, he hasn't simply compromised slightly and played 3-5-2 even last year is pretty funny, he could still have worked with the players on "his system" defensively and playing 3 at the back and wingbacks. But Bruno could play the 10 with two up top.
I'm still at a complete loss as to how the fielded Man U side lost to Grimsby. I'm willing to entertain that the current squad is far from top quality, but when you have a 4 division difference, it should matter little about formation or whatever, even basic bloody self-respect means that, that team should be winning. So there is a serious issue there that goes beyond formation.
I think UTD had an 8/10 transfer window, and probably the best one they've had for years. I know nothing about this new keeper, and I would have MUCH preferred getting a known quantity. I hear the suggestion that we didn't entertain donnurama (sp?) because his wage request was 300K or so. I get that because utd don't want to go down that road again with every new player setting a benchmark wage. I hope the new keeper turns out to be good.
I hear chat that utd only playing 1 game a week is going to be bad for getting the system in place, but I heard all last season that playing twice a week meant that there was no time for training for the new system, so it can't be both.
I have no idea what the fundamental issue is with utd, and clearly Amorim's unbending formation is some part of it, but it goes waaay deeper than that, and I fear we've been so poor for so long, that whatever the issue is, it is has seeped into the very core of the club. I had hoped that a separate entity (ratcliffe) taking over all footballing operations would be the start of a something. And for all his detractors, be clear that he put £200M of his own personal money into the club, and it's gone. So this guy's commitment shouldn't be questioned, maybe other attributes, but not that.
And back to the amorim question, as someone upthread has said, I'd hate to have to start over again with ANOTHER manager. Awful results not withstanding, I feel invested in him in a way I didn't with Ten Hag. He's a believable guy and I get the sense that he is metaphorically pulling his hair out. If the rigidity of the system is part of the problem that's fine, what I don't want to hear is that "he's lost the dressing room", because frankly all that means is that the same playerpower still exists and we had thought we'd gotten rid of many of the negative influences in the dressing room.
Sadly I think Amorim will go, but I'll not be celebrating it if it happens because I think it'll likely signal yet another period of uncertainty. It would also reflect badly on the entire Ratcliffe project and the judgement of recruitment/ back office team he's put together.
Mind you should he go and his replacement make a significant and immediate positive impact on performances and results, I (and I suspect most others) would quickly forget the amorim goodwill and point to "that's what he shoulda done".
Such is football
I think UTD had an 8/10 transfer window, and probably the best one they've had for years. I know nothing about this new keeper, and I would have MUCH preferred getting a known quantity. I hear the suggestion that we didn't entertain donnurama (sp?) because his wage request was 300K or so. I get that because utd don't want to go down that road again with every new player setting a benchmark wage. I hope the new keeper turns out to be good.
I hear chat that utd only playing 1 game a week is going to be bad for getting the system in place, but I heard all last season that playing twice a week meant that there was no time for training for the new system, so it can't be both.
I have no idea what the fundamental issue is with utd, and clearly Amorim's unbending formation is some part of it, but it goes waaay deeper than that, and I fear we've been so poor for so long, that whatever the issue is, it is has seeped into the very core of the club. I had hoped that a separate entity (ratcliffe) taking over all footballing operations would be the start of a something. And for all his detractors, be clear that he put £200M of his own personal money into the club, and it's gone. So this guy's commitment shouldn't be questioned, maybe other attributes, but not that.
And back to the amorim question, as someone upthread has said, I'd hate to have to start over again with ANOTHER manager. Awful results not withstanding, I feel invested in him in a way I didn't with Ten Hag. He's a believable guy and I get the sense that he is metaphorically pulling his hair out. If the rigidity of the system is part of the problem that's fine, what I don't want to hear is that "he's lost the dressing room", because frankly all that means is that the same playerpower still exists and we had thought we'd gotten rid of many of the negative influences in the dressing room.
Sadly I think Amorim will go, but I'll not be celebrating it if it happens because I think it'll likely signal yet another period of uncertainty. It would also reflect badly on the entire Ratcliffe project and the judgement of recruitment/ back office team he's put together.
Mind you should he go and his replacement make a significant and immediate positive impact on performances and results, I (and I suspect most others) would quickly forget the amorim goodwill and point to "that's what he shoulda done".
Such is football
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Another great Adam Clery video. Looking at Bruno’s role and our formation. Ignore the click bait title.
Backs up what most people are thinking. Shame Amorim can’t see it
I think this should be in the club thread although it is linked to Amorim's likelihood of getting sacked.
I've only watched it once and I've slept since then but isn't this video showing that Bruno isn't the problem, he's just less effective in his new role (which they probably accepted because the new players should pick up some of the slack)?
What I see is defensive errors, and also at times the defence not pushing up to allow him to go forward.
Also, despite him being a decent YouTuber, I have to question wheher it is clickbait/for the views? Where's the video on his midfield partner not being up to scratch? Or Shaw (and others) being poor? He does refer to this in passing but not properly imo.
I came away from that video with the view that Bruno isn't the problem, he's just not as effective.
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I haven't watched the vid but isn't that the point? The boss's tactics are nullifying your best player. How many games you won when he's had a stinker? Probably none I'd guess.