Presumed consent organ donation

[stoofa]

So I see that Wales voted last night - and in a couple of years time it could well be presumed consent with regards organ donation.
From a personal point of view this cannot come quick enough and I can only hope that England is watching and now considering something similar.

I know there was opposition, although I cannot understand all of it. I appreciate there may well be religious reasons why someone wouldn't donate organs and as someone tolerant of religion I can accept this.
I also understand (for whatever reason) people just don't want to donate. And again I can just about understand this.
However the new bill doesn't change anything for these people. They can still opt-out and the government have said that opting out will be made as easy as possible.
Thankfully those against weren't able to derail the whole bill.

The soft opt-out clause that some wanted would have been a waste of time. Allowing relatives to get involved. Either pass the bill or don't. Don't introduce it and still allow peoples wishes to be overruled.

I also appreciate that research is mixed as to how much benefit there will be from this new bill. However as far as I'm concerned any system that brings more potential organ donation has got to be a good thing. People really don't need them once they are gone and why not give someone else the chance of life or life with better quality?

Maybe I'm pleased in a selfish way. Some here may know that I am an organ recipient - I received a kidney from my wife just over 18 months ago.
So far all has been well and those that have never been on dialysis will never know how much of a difference to my life this transplant made. I was luck in one respect, I had someone willing to donate to me. Many are waiting for one to become available and those people have an average 3-4 year wait. Maybe, just maybe this bill will reduce that wait for some people.
I was also "lucky" in that my failed organ doesn't mean death. I could receive dialysis for the rest of my natural. Some people, waiting for hearts or lungs are not in that position and will simply die without a new organ.

So anyway, a long post about nothing more really than well done the Welsh government and Whitehall - please look, listen and act!

 

[dirtychinchilla]

Opt-out is brilliant. I hope we have the system here soon.

 

[elmarko]

Opt-out is brilliant. I hope we have the system here soon.

+1.

Part of me thinks if you opt out (when if you are able medically to donate, also an adult) then you should be at the bottom of the transplant list if you should ever need one.

Might discourage people from opting out.

 

[LOAM]

Its appalling really that its taken this long. Adoption by the rest of GB cant happen soon enough.

 

[Ilikeitblackplease]

Its appalling really that its taken this long. Adoption by the rest of GB cant happen soon enough.

Not really, how many people will opt out and still have their organs taken, this is going to turn into a mess, and cost the NHS a lot in legal fees. How many people are going to die for their organs as the doctors give up on them? why attempt to resuscitate when you can use their organs. The state now owns your body when you die, this is another moral issue.

 

[sports_brah]

+1.

Part of me thinks if you opt out (when if you are able medically to donate, also an adult) then you should be at the bottom of the transplant list if you should ever need one.

Might discourage people from opting out.

I thought you were against authoritarian things?

Basically enforcing organ harvesting isn't a particularly nice thing as it tramples over peoples rights and opinions.

My body is my own. If I wish to donate my bits and bobs I will, I don't want to be essentially forced into it...

 

[Freakbro]

My body is my own. If I wish to donate my bits and bobs I will, I don't want to be essentially forced into it...

You're not being forced into anything, you still have every right to opt out.

This is a great move and I hope it finally gets implemented across the whole of the UK

 

[Raumarik]

My dad is a heart transplant patient (going on 22 years next month) and I'm against the presumed consent, mostly as people should be allowed to make the choice to do it, not have it assumed it's OK.

I've had a donor card for as long as I can remember, I made that choice and I'd like to think others did, whilst alive and well enough to do so rather than us assuming it's OK to take the knife to them.

I'm happy that it'll most likely lead to more transplants, but it's saddening that uptake is so low that the people in power feel the need to impose this, rather than encourage the positive decision to carry a card. Obviously people can opt out, but I personally feel that it's the wrong way - it should be opt in.

 

[elmarko]

I thought you were against authoritarian things?

Basically enforcing organ harvesting isn't a particularly nice thing as it tramples over peoples rights and opinions.

My body is my own. If I wish to donate my bits and bobs I will, I don't want to be essentially forced into it...

How would you be forced into it?.

Encouraged by saying "Ok, if you don't want to sign up-to donation you are also on the bottom of the receivers list" isn't forcing.

You are fully free to refuse to sign up-to donation & then die if you need one (in my system), that's freedom at it's best!.

 

[Bobcat]

I think its a good idea, have done since it started being discussed, living in Wales myself i see no issue with this what so ever, if i had any kind of hang-up about it, i could just choose to opt-out.

Not really, how many people will opt out and still have their organs taken, this is going to turn into a mess, and cost the NHS a lot in legal fees. How many people are going to die for their organs as the doctors give up on them? why attempt to resuscitate when you can use their organs. The state now owns your body when you die, this is another moral issue.

That's a bit of a wild statement, i would like to think that the system in place is just the reverse of the old system, so in stead of checking to see if someone is on the register to give their organs, instead its now a reverse system that is checked to see if the person has logged their opt-out stand, so there should be very little error.

The plus point to this, is that there will be a lot more people on organ transfer lists that their lives will either be saved, or the quality of life will be greatly improved.

Also agree that if you choose not donate your organs (specifically opting out) then you should not have a transfer yourself if needed

 

[Freakbro]

My dad is a heart transplant patient (going on 22 years next month) and I'm against the presumed consent, mostly as people should be allowed to make the choice to do it, not have it assumed it's OK.

I've had a donor card for as long as I can remember, I made that choice and I'd like to think others did, whilst alive and well enough to do so rather than us assuming it's OK to take the knife to them.

I'm happy that it'll most likely lead to more transplants, but it's saddening that uptake is so low that the people in power feel the need to impose this, rather than encourage the positive decision to carry a card. Obviously people can opt out, but I personally feel that it's the wrong way - it should be opt in.

The problem is apathy, and this is one way of overcoming it.

I would guess 'most' people are probably ok about being an organ donor (far more than are registered anyway) but because they don't think their own mortality might just be around the corner, it's low down on their priority to go through the minimal effort of signing up.

Whereas people who is against being a donor in this situation are far more likely to put the effort in to opt out.

Everyone's a winner.

 

[Ilikeitblackplease]

My dad is a heart transplant patient (going on 22 years next month) and I'm against the presumed consent, mostly as people should be allowed to make the choice to do it, not have it assumed it's OK.

I've had a donor card for as long as I can remember, I made that choice and I'd like to think others did, whilst alive and well enough to do so rather than us assuming it's OK to take the knife to them.

I'm happy that it'll most likely lead to more transplants, but it's saddening that uptake is so low that the people in power feel the need to impose this, rather than encourage the positive decision to carry a card. Obviously people can opt out, but I personally feel that it's the wrong way - it should be opt in.

I agree, if they want more people to give them they need to do more than just take. were we not taught that it is wrong to take, and that you should ask before you take.

 

[crisbduck]

+1.

Part of me thinks if you opt out (when if you are able medically to donate, also an adult) then you should be at the bottom of the transplant list if you should ever need one.

Might discourage people from opting out.

I really like this idea!

Anyone else seen the TED talk with the statistics about organ donation across different countries and having massive differences between whether it was opt-in or opt-out?

 

[bartledvd]

i live in wales and happy to see this happen just can't see any bad side to it its very simple thing if you have a belief for any reason you need to keep you organs when dead then opt out.

 

[Diesel]

Totally agree with this. You can have whatever body parts of me you like when I die.

 

[:(Rhodri:)]

Not really, how many people will opt out and still have their organs taken, this is going to turn into a mess, and cost the NHS a lot in legal fees. How many people are going to die for their organs as the doctors give up on them? why attempt to resuscitate when you can use their organs. The state now owns your body when you die, this is another moral issue.

That has to be one of the daftest things I've read on these forums. Including Kwerk threads.

If that was the case then people with donor cards now would be much more at risk from doctors bumping them off for their juicy bits, as there's much more demand for organs currently than there would be with an opt-out system.

To be honest I fail to see any negatives to an opt-out system but lots of positives.

 

[Hades]

I have mixed feelings on this. On the one hand I do support the opt-out as life is precious and I would want my family or myself to receive an organ if needed. But on the other hand I can see the moral objection to the state owning your body. However more importantly I can see legal issues and NHS compensation when a mstake is made.

I do/did carry a donor card but am no longer able to donate blood or organs due to medical issues.

 

[elmarko]

I don't think a presumption to donation to save another's life (which you can incredibly easily opt out of if you feel strongly against it) really constitutes state ownership of your body.

 

[Raumarik]

Anyone know how they'll handle it if someone has opted out? Will they still request permission from the family anyway, will the family legally be able to over-rule the wishes of the deceased?

 

[JAzz]

As long as you can opt out at any time I see nothing wrong with having a presumed opt in system. However I do think everyone should be sent a letter confirming they are in and then given the choice to opt out.

Part of me thinks if you opt out (when if you are able medically to donate, also an adult) then you should be at the bottom of the transplant list if you should ever need one.

I do like that idea actually but I can't see it ever happening.