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I may have found how to set max turbo vid on Ryzen 3000...

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I discovered this completely by accident while digging around in bios and I'm hoping others can confirm what I have found. This is a sample size of 2 motherboards and is not conclusive so I need some willing volunteers to validate (or invalidate) my findings.

This could be really useful for both overclocking and undervolting. I'm posting it under the CPU section for this reason, but if this should be elsewhere then apologies and please move the thread :)

Performance was monitored with Cinebench R20, stability tested by a Realbench 4 hour run.
Temperatures quoted are momentary maximums as recorded in the max column in HWMonitor.

TLDR: Achieved way higher performance than stock and matched my all core overclock while retaining core parking and VID scaling under load. Sadly you need to read the wall of text below to achieve this.


The REALLY important bit you should read and understand properly:

Make sure any software you have running in windows is not applying a vcore offset and your cpu voltage in bios is set to normal/auto and not offset or manual. I would also set LLC to normal. You could accidentally overvolt your cpu if these settings combine with the manual settings entered as below.

Ensure Cool'n'Quiet is set to enabled if you have the option to do so, I believe this controls core parking (cc6 mode).

I have set cTDP to 144w and PPT to 165w in bios on both boards (AMD recommended maximums, source AMDRoberts infamous 4.75ghz 3900x video). I have no idea if this has any effect, it didn't before when using PBO so I've just left it set since day 1.

This would appear to bypass all CPU and Board power limits. Your cpu can go way above stock power, but none the less I find this actually runs cooler under load. This gives you total control over your CPUs turbo behaviour on all cores exactly as the Intel crew have with their CPUs.

I have not tested this yet with the CCX overclocking tool, but that could be expected to gain you a little extra. Given the warnings not to use this with offset voltage in bios, I dont know how this will behave with this voltage override in place. It shouldn't matter if this is actually working as I think it is, but I have not tested that and don't wish to be the first. I'm happy with my all core results right now.

Finally - you choose to do this yourself. I am not making you. if you screw this up it is not my fault. Mine works fine on two motherboards exactly as set out below. I discovered this without blowing anything up, and have been running load tests now for 3 days with no problems, but again my sample size is low.



Ok so, with no bios screenshots this is thankfully pretty easy to explain for both my boards. I'll start with the Gigabyte X570i as it offers the most control.


Gigabyte X570i instructions:

In bios first disable Precision boost under both the CBS and AMD Overclocking sections in bios. I think you have to disable in both places, I have not tested this.
Now go back into the AMD overclocking section and enter the Manual Overclock page (this is where the magic happens). Here you can set your maximum all core frequency and your upper CPU voltage in millivolts (type in exactly 1350 to get 1.35v).

My result: 3800x - 4316mhz (4325 set) @ 1.294v AVX load (1375mv set) @ 73c max / 4416mhz (4425 set) @ 1.35v AVX load (1425mv set) @ 82c max (water cooled).
Stock PBO enabled: 4116mhz @ 1.33v AVX load rough average. 88c max with cores and voltages boosting all over the place.
Cinebench R20 + 250pts multicore


MSI B450i Gaming AC instructions:

In bios disable precision boost.
Go to your cpu voltage and select "AMD Overclocking", then set your max voltage in volts below (ie type exactly 1.35v).

My result: 3600x - 4192mhz @ 1.3v AVX load (1.3v set) @ 77c max (Wraith RGB cooled)
Stock PBO enabled: 4142mhz @ 1.35v AVX load rough average. 96c max with cores and voltages boosting all over the place.
Cinebench R20 +120pts multicore



Here's what I think is happening:

This voltage setting is the maximum turbo low load voltage and shifts the AMD predefined VID scheme to your specified clock speed and voltage. You can essentially define where the max turbo VID limit is based on your cpu overclock ability. You also still retain core parking for low power idle and avoid any clock stretching issues as widely reported online when defining too low a voltage for a manual core clock. Instead it just crashes old school style and lets you know its unstable. Note that you will get no downclocking, but your cores will park when not in use (I see voltage down to 0.200v in cpuid hwmonitor).

So to set this up safely (I think), referencing from reddit, AMDRobert has said that 1.425v low load and 1.35v AVX load are the maximum safe voltages for Ryzen 3000. I have no idea at all why AMD allow up to 1.5v stock, but I regularly see that on both my 3600 and 3800x.

On the Gigabyte board the voltage you set seems to correlate to the low load voltage or high idle voltage we see right before cores park (*** see bottom of post), so I set this to 1425(mv) and it idles at 1.425v, requests 1.375v under light load and requests 1.35v in AVX load. This is not vdroop, this is the cpu changing its VID request automatically to prevent damage based on AMD's VID rules. Do not attempt to correct this with LLC!

On the MSI board its the voltage under high load (idle rises above set value). I set this to 1.35v in bios and it gives me 1.35v under AVX load and 1.43v under light loads as reported in software.

This is likely going to be different between board manufacturers, maybe even between board models, go carefully. On the MSI board when I set 1.425v expecting it to be the same as the Gigabyte I got 1.52v low load voltage. I would recommend setting 1.4v as your first test to discover how this voltage behaves on your board. This should give enough leeway either way to remain in safe and stable zones.


MSI B450i limitations: (may no longer be limited in newer bios versions)

The MSI older gen board does not have a setting to change core multiplier. I have not tested whether using the normal fixed cpu multi allows core parking, or whether all power saving is out the window if you want to go above stock max turbo. I have also not tested this with PBO enabled, if you can set PBO on and enable a scalar then in theory you should overboost. Be VERY careful if you decide to mess with enabling PBO, I chickened out with concerns over what voltages may get applied.

Click here for MSI Bios setup screenshots provided by gerardfraser on latest MSI bios


*** As an aside, this makes sense...load drops so voltage and speed increases but when it reaches zero load the core turns off. Its not what we are used to seeing in older generations, but given how Ryzen 3000 works this does make sense
 
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I do not want to make it more complicated for anyone.You did not mention some of things which may effect outcome.If post of the wall crazy or out of context for I can delete it no problem.

AMD Chipset driver version-newer versions missing /fazed out AMD Ryzen™ Power Saver Plan-Power plans can change behavior of voltages, I have seen as high as CPU 1.57 in idle/light loads without fixed voltage.
Which AGESA BIOS AMD ComboPI1.0.0.3,AMD ComboPI1.0.0.3AB,AMD ComboPI1.0.0.3ABB-Depending on BIOS there will be missing/added features So may not apply to most people.
CPU-Z along with Ryzen master to verify voltages not really needed or missing I guess.

Link to AMD Ryzen™ Power Saver Plan if any wants
Google drive AMD Ryzen™ Power Saver Plan and How to import power plan from desktop.
Open Command Prompt as(Admin)- powercfg -import “Full path of .pow file”
So from desktop command will look like - powercfg -import "C:\Users\YourName\AMD Ryzen™ Power Saver.pow"
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nXzg4CgLUoA-141QiQ0TdKL3WZ01putS/view?usp=sharing
 
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Its a big wall of text to try and understand if you're not native english speaking :)

In as simple terms as possible, this describes how to manually define your max turbo VID and your max turbo clock. It sets your cores to run at maximum speed all the time unless idle, in which case they park, so it allows an all core overclock while still retaining core parking power saving features.

It also lets you undervolt without risking losing performance to clock stretching as you get when manually applying an offset. If you try and set 4300mhz 1volt it will crash, not slow down but still pretend to be at 4300mhz.

I don't know if all boards have this option, both of mine do but each one implements it in different ways.
 
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Can do, itll be late tonight though once the kids are dealt with and ive had my hour of gaming :)
Im not priming into the wee small hours, but ill throw up cinebench and hwmonitor screenshots. Just remembered screenshots from bios are a thing, though im not sure either board does that. Will check and if possible add those too...

What would you like compared? Stock no PBO, PBO, Manual volts all core and then this new method? I don't see any likely difference in performance between manual all core and this method, just you will have the core parking power saving feature.

Going to test how Core Performance Boost and Cool n' Quiet affect this method. I'd love to get downclocking (Cool n Quiet) working, its basically as stock then but with a reduced voltage limit and core clocks linked. CPB I expect not to work.
 
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Thanks, appreciate that! Which board is that? Looks like a different version of click lite to mine on the B450i Gaming AC as it has the manual vid and core clock options. I see A8 is available now for my board too though live update says there's nothing... I'll update later and check it out. If they've exposed the clock setting I can go above 4200 without stupid high low load vcore now :)

Have you played with it at all? Can you confirm instability instead of clock stretching and core parking is enabled? I think these are the main two gains beyond stopping the high vcore spikes.
 
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MSI X470 Gaming Plus Motherboard
I played with it around July 12 2019 and tested for stability all was fine.Tested Intel Burn Test/Cinebench today and Video encode for an hour and seems fine.

Just installed Ryzen Master and all seems fine.Low temperatures and clocks all sleepy CCX and response on desktop is fine(snappy as usual)


No change from July 12 Ryzen Master ALL Core to Aug 1 2019 BIOS AMD Overclock-July 12 2019 Cinebench score was recorded with screen recording on ,which gives a slight disadvantage. Interpret as you want.

July 12 2019 Ryzen Master All Core Overclock 4300Mhz@CPU 1.35


JAug 1 2019 BIOS AMD Overclock 4300Mhz@CPU 1.35
 
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@MaXxBoulton @an0nym0us you are very welcome, the whole point of early adoption is discovery.

@Mercutio Both boards are on 1.0.0.3AB at the moment, though anything 1.0.0.2 and above should work fine. The problem with the earlier bioses though is that manufacturers havent necessarily exposed all settings. It took MSI until the recent A8 release to expose the settings for 300 and 400 series boards even though the option is supported. It may even be that this option has existed before Ryzen 3000, I dont own an earlier gen Ryzen to be able to check. Its a part of AMDs AGESA code rather than something the board vendors have come up with, but its still up to them whether they expose the setting to the user or not.

4475 is pretty mighty, thats a very nice piece of silicon you have there, look after it well dude :)
 
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So, in summary, manually setting the maximum frequency and voltage in the "AMD Overclocking" section of the BIOS (not the normal manufacturer page) while leaving PBO off and CnQ on, results in you being able to set an all-core overclock while retaining core parking?

Sounds useful if so, although I'd still much prefer something like P-state overclocking where the cores can literally do what they like (a la stock) but you just increase the maximum clocks.
 
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So, in summary, manually setting the maximum frequency and voltage in the "AMD Overclocking" section of the BIOS (not the normal manufacturer page) while leaving PBO off and CnQ on, results in you being able to set an all-core overclock while retaining core parking?

Sounds useful if so, although I'd still much prefer something like P-state overclocking where the cores can literally do what they like (a la stock) but you just increase the maximum clocks.

Exactly. Also no clock stretching (see the infamous 3900x @ 1v video), if the volts arent enough for the clocks to be stable it crashes/errors rather than modulating clock speed. You get perfect performance scaling if you are stable (unlike using offset) and avoid the somewhat unnerving 1.5v vcore at desktop situation.

Shame CoolnQuiet doesnt function fully and scale down mhz at idle, the core parking is really nice though. Maybe mhz scaling back is no longer needed with core parking in 1ms? I guess if you can turn your cores off that fast then why bother downclocking? Its really a shame AMD havent spoken in more detail about this side of things.
 
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