Getting to 20min for 5k?

Soldato
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That's my goal for the end of the year. I did 5x400m tonight @ 4mins/km which is 20min 5k pace. They felt ok but I must be lacking speed as I was fairly pushing it. I assume I should do some 100 and 200m reps also to get the speed up?

What's your tips, 20mins for 5k is almost like sprinting.
 
Soldato
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That's my goal for the end of the year. I did 5x400m tonight @ 4mins/km which is 20min 5k pace. They felt ok but I must be lacking speed as I was fairly pushing it. I assume I should do some 100 and 200m reps also to get the speed up?

What's your tips, 20mins for 5k is almost like sprinting.
No idea if it was a good idea or not, but I got to it a few years ago by training on a treadmill, as you then can't slow down without making a conscious decision to do so. My road speed picked up a fair amount having done that.

Also, do Parkrun or similar - always faster with people to chase!
 
Soldato
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No idea if it was a good idea or not, but I got to it a few years ago by training on a treadmill, as you then can't slow down without making a conscious decision to do so. My road speed picked up a fair amount having done that.

Also, do Parkrun or similar - always faster with people to chase!

Do you not find running at 20mins for 5K feels like sprinting?
 

SPG

SPG

Soldato
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Everyone is different, some people can run at that pace and its just touching the sides.

1 work out your threshold running pace and HR zones.
2 Work out a plan, consistency is the only way crack your goal unless your a gifted runner
3 Your plan need a one long run a week max 6k, one Hill repeat session this builds strength and good interval session.

I would also throw in one very easy 3-5k run a week think of this more as a recovery run.

Check your zones and thresholds every 6 weeks so you know what zone to train in.
 
Soldato
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Everyone is different, some people can run at that pace and its just touching the sides.

1 work out your threshold running pace and HR zones.
2 Work out a plan, consistency is the only way crack your goal unless your a gifted runner
3 Your plan need a one long run a week max 6k, one Hill repeat session this builds strength and good interval session.

I would also throw in one very easy 3-5k run a week think of this more as a recovery run.

Check your zones and thresholds every 6 weeks so you know what zone to train in.

At school 27 years ago I could run 49sec for 400m and low 2mins for 800m, about 4.30 for 1500m however I really have done nothing for 27 years apart from a few months of cycling.

It's hard to gauge the state of your capabilities now. In my head this should easy but I think I'm lacking strength in my legs.
 

SPG

SPG

Soldato
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Lots of internet resource for 5k training these days its very popular due to park run.

If that's the case i would limit your sessions to 3 a week, Hill, interval and very easy 6k, the hill and intervals session are where the work really is the long run is just time on feet and getting you used to running a bit further.

Sub 20 is great time for anyone and will require structured training, maybe join a running club. State your goal to them.
 
Soldato
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Keep practicing and experimant with fueling up more or with different foods, different hydration levels etc to find what keeps you feeling fresh and stronger for longer during the run.
Pro runners have got that part worked out and have it all planned out before a race starts.
 
Soldato
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Do you not find running at 20mins for 5K feels like sprinting?
When I was fitter sub 20 was just about within my capabilities, but that was with a lot of work. I'm more of a natural 10k or longer runner - when I'm fit I can happily run at 4.30 kilometres up to a half marathon, whereas going quicker than that even over a short distance isn't really in my wheelhouse. Two torn calf muscles and covid this year has slowed that down a fair bit though!

I've other friends who take up running and are immediately sub 20. One (very lanky and pretty sporty) guy ran a timed 5k for the first time ever recently and was at about 18.30, which was aggravating.
 
Soldato
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Just keep running.

I remember when I first started (being pretty fit anyway being a cyclist) thinking how on earth am I going to do a sub 20, when I was coming in around 22 mins or so.

17:34 is my PB now, and that's not even on a track, so I'd hope to get near a 17 flat on a good day.

I found volume is better than outright sprint work. Read up on 80:20 training if you haven't already.
 
Caporegime
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I'm no expert but when I was looking to bring my times down id just continuously run the target distance (10K, or whatever), as I got fitter the times came down naturally. Doing shorter distances multiple times may help, but it's the endurance at a steady pace that you're looking for.
 
Soldato
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I'm no expert but when I was looking to bring my times down id just continuously run the target distance (10K, or whatever), as I got fitter the times came down naturally. Doing shorter distances multiple times may help, but it's the endurance at a steady pace that you're looking for.
The other thing I've found is that when I'm comfortable running an ok time over a longer distance (eg 10k) I can push my 5k time harder, as it no longer feels like running a long way so I can handle the pain for 20 minutes
 

SPG

SPG

Soldato
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Just keep running.

I remember when I first started (being pretty fit anyway being a cyclist) thinking how on earth am I going to do a sub 20, when I was coming in around 22 mins or so.

17:34 is my PB now, and that's not even on a track, so I'd hope to get near a 17 flat on a good day.

I found volume is better than outright sprint work. Read up on 80:20 training if you haven't already.

No, do not just keep running.

Keep running with structure :) , the 80/20 book however is much more sound advice a great book.

As for fuelling you need nothing specific for a 5K, think about food as what you need to do the day before and not panic eat 2hrs before your run. (Of course this is much harder than actually running :) )
 
Soldato
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I think I meant by that is that it won't happen overnight. You need to keep it up for effects to be noticed.

And running more than just the odd 5k every now and then, expecting to be faster each time.
 
Associate
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a mix of Tempo's, km or mile reps, Hill Reps, and easy runs of course. I run about 25 miles a week, and can run sub20 pretty constantly. It's still very hard work. Did 19:19 at ParkRun this week, PB is 18:53. It will take time, but doable if you put the work in. What sort of times are you running now?

12x400meters aiming for around 90 seconds with a 2-3min recovery could be a good work out for you.
 

SPG

SPG

Soldato
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Sub 20 is a cracking time for anyone.

Getting below 25 was my goal and managed a 25:27 last year before switched focus to long course stuff.

I need to lose 8kg to give me a fighting chance though.
 
Associate
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Lots of good advice from SPG and others here. I'll add some pointers too around what training to do.

5k under 20mins for most people is not easy and will usually take a decent amount of time and effort to achieve. Coming off the back of a marathon this was my next goal and it took me about 4 months to get my 21:08 5k pb down to below 20 minutes (although I managed 19:10 in the end so might have been able to achieve it earlier). You will need to follow some structure and be consistent/disciplined.

5k pace hurts and is not comfortable at all. Usually you will feel like you are dying at 3k and will need to cling on for the last 2k, you will get through it, this is normal :D. Getting used to this feeling is very important in your training. First you really need a baseline to build off so get down to a parkrun or something and see where your fitness is currently at for 5k. No point aiming for 20 minutes by the end of the year if you're struggling to finish in under 25 mins. Find out where your at and adjust your expectations in line with that, otherwise you will probably just be disheartened with your training and give up. Ideally you would be below 22:30 at the moment to get below 20 mins in 4 months.

In terms of workouts, I would say the key one for a 5k training plan is kilometre repeats. I'd do these every other week (usually at the start of the week) and start with 3x 1km at goal pace with a 2min walking recovery between. Build this up to 2min jog recovery between reps next time, then increase the intervals to 4x 1km with 2 min walk, then 2min jog next time. Then up to 5x 1km with 2min walk and finally jog the recovery for the last session. Take a longer recovery for the first few sessions if you need to. If you can complete that last workout at goal pace then I would think you are ready for a sub 20min attempt. This pattern works out to be over 12 weeks so plenty of time to slowly build to prevent injury.

You should probably do 2 workout sessions each week so every other week when you're not doing the km repeats do a speed session at faster than 5k pace such as 10x 1min or 8x 400m or 6x 2mins or hill repeats. Basically lots of faster but shorter intervals. The other session can be a fartlek, 20mins tempo, 2x 10 mins tempo, 4x 5 mins tempo, something like that to get you used to longer efforts. Tempo is something like half marathon effort so maybe 4:25 per km?

You need to warm up/down for sessions. I just usually do 5min easy jog before/after.

You will need to do a longer easy run at the end of each week to build up your aerobic base. Start at maybe 40 mins and work up to 90 mins (5min increase each week). Try to fit in 1 or 2 easy runs during the week, maybe around 5k distance. Getting some strides into one of these runs is important too, usually best to do these at the end of the run (these are short sprints at almost full effort and will improve running form). This is 4-5 runs a week.

Fuelling/hydration doesn't matter so much for a 5k. You certainly don't need to drink any water/food during a 5k race, just make sure you've has some food a few hours before. No real need to massively taper your training or anything, just take it a bit easier in the week leading up to the final attempt.

There's a dedicated running thread already with plenty of people with similar goals so have a look in that for tips and help.
 
Soldato
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Lots of good advice from SPG and others here. I'll add some pointers too around what training to do.

5k under 20mins for most people is not easy and will usually take a decent amount of time and effort to achieve. Coming off the back of a marathon this was my next goal and it took me about 4 months to get my 21:08 5k pb down to below 20 minutes (although I managed 19:10 in the end so might have been able to achieve it earlier). You will need to follow some structure and be consistent/disciplined.

5k pace hurts and is not comfortable at all. Usually you will feel like you are dying at 3k and will need to cling on for the last 2k, you will get through it, this is normal :D. Getting used to this feeling is very important in your training. First you really need a baseline to build off so get down to a parkrun or something and see where your fitness is currently at for 5k. No point aiming for 20 minutes by the end of the year if you're struggling to finish in under 25 mins. Find out where your at and adjust your expectations in line with that, otherwise you will probably just be disheartened with your training and give up. Ideally you would be below 22:30 at the moment to get below 20 mins in 4 months.

In terms of workouts, I would say the key one for a 5k training plan is kilometre repeats. I'd do these every other week (usually at the start of the week) and start with 3x 1km at goal pace with a 2min walking recovery between. Build this up to 2min jog recovery between reps next time, then increase the intervals to 4x 1km with 2 min walk, then 2min jog next time. Then up to 5x 1km with 2min walk and finally jog the recovery for the last session. Take a longer recovery for the first few sessions if you need to. If you can complete that last workout at goal pace then I would think you are ready for a sub 20min attempt. This pattern works out to be over 12 weeks so plenty of time to slowly build to prevent injury.

You should probably do 2 workout sessions each week so every other week when you're not doing the km repeats do a speed session at faster than 5k pace such as 10x 1min or 8x 400m or 6x 2mins or hill repeats. Basically lots of faster but shorter intervals. The other session can be a fartlek, 20mins tempo, 2x 10 mins tempo, 4x 5 mins tempo, something like that to get you used to longer efforts. Tempo is something like half marathon effort so maybe 4:25 per km?

You need to warm up/down for sessions. I just usually do 5min easy jog before/after.

You will need to do a longer easy run at the end of each week to build up your aerobic base. Start at maybe 40 mins and work up to 90 mins (5min increase each week). Try to fit in 1 or 2 easy runs during the week, maybe around 5k distance. Getting some strides into one of these runs is important too, usually best to do these at the end of the run (these are short sprints at almost full effort and will improve running form). This is 4-5 runs a week.

Fuelling/hydration doesn't matter so much for a 5k. You certainly don't need to drink any water/food during a 5k race, just make sure you've has some food a few hours before. No real need to massively taper your training or anything, just take it a bit easier in the week leading up to the final attempt.

There's a dedicated running thread already with plenty of people with similar goals so have a look in that for tips and help.

Good post. I think the 3x1km tonight. I trained twice yesterday and feel great today. I think I could manage 6 days a week.

I'm also doing some squats and core exercises so I'm sure it all helps.
 
Soldato
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5k pace hurts and is not comfortable at all. Usually you will feel like you are dying at 3k and will need to cling on for the last 2k, you will get through it, this is normal :D. Getting used to this feeling is very important in your training.

I'm more of a rower than a runner, but I find mental toughness is one of the most important things. During a hard session, my brain is usually screaming at me to stop and I'm constantly thinking of excuses as to why I should quit. At the end of the day, it's only 20mins of your life so you have to tell yourself to suck it up and get on with it!
 
Associate
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I did this exact goal last year coming from a reasonable cycling fitness but no running for many many years. I was doing around 25 minutes to start but got to 19 mins after about 5-6 months.
I found consistency was the key for me which was made easier with having a running buddy as well which sometimes forces you out when you dont fancy it!
My approach was
Monday - Interval session based around 20 minutes of hard effort so (10x2min with 60 second rest, 7x3min with 90 second rest, pyramids etc)
Tues or Weds - Just running! between 30-60 mins very easy (happy to chat about the day to someone level)
Thurs - Hill repeats in the local park
Friday - OFF
Weekend longer run - again very easy normally between 60-90 minutes out in the countryside

I would generally do cycling on the Tues or Weds and the weekend as well so it would be 6 days a week (It was lockdown so was actually something to look forward to!)

I then decided to smash my hip taking on a car at 25mph so at the moment im happy to walk :)
 
Soldato
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Following with interest, I'm on a similar journey. When I was 18 to make our football team a sub 20 minute 3 mile was required. I have memories from uni when I was in competitive sport of smashing out 20 minutes on a treadmill at 16kph. Now I run at 11kph :( and 4k is a slog.

I've been steadily building back up to 5k and have been using intervals to help my progress. I currently run 4 times per week and one night of 11 a side football where I have already noticed a big improvement in my fitness. I expect I'll be around 26 minute 5k in about 6 weeks and then will see how I go from there. Depressingly I have a friend who started running about 4 years back and can now run 5k in sub 17 minutes.

The advice I have been give is:

1. Run frequently but be sure to have 1-2 rests per week.
2. If building for speed you will need to exceed the target distance by about 30%.
3. Work on your form and breathing patterns.
4. Lose weight :D
 
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