Gig photography

Simonnn · 11 Nov 2006 at 13:08

My housemate's new band are playing a gig at the end of the month, I'm thinking about offering to photo it but have never really done gigs before so don't know whats the best way. I've recently got a Canon 400D with the kit lens and a tamron 70-300. I'm a bit of a beginner with a DSLR but I did have a Minolta 7hi for 3 years previous to this so not a complete photography noob.

The camera and two lenses are really the only kit I have at the moment, will it still be possible to do anything good with that? I've not been to the venue before but its a back room in a pub so i'm guessing its going to be quite dark and smoky.

Could anybody provide me with some advice, settings to try, anything that might help?

Thanks

Simon

Jotun · 11 Nov 2006 at 14:09

The general consensus here seems to be that for gigs or general photography in low lighting, the canon 50mm 1.8 is great for the price (around £60-70 I believe)

I can't offer you any advice personally as I've never tried it before myself, but there are quite a few people here who have, although I have seen a few people post saying don't use a flash, as it will ruin the lighting.

Simonnn · 11 Nov 2006 at 15:23

I don't really have the funds to buy more equipment, was just wondering what id be able to achieve with what I already have

aztechnology · 11 Nov 2006 at 22:04

Simonnn said:
I don't really have the funds to buy more equipment, was just wondering what id be able to achieve with what I already have

the 50 f1.8 is £90 new, £60ish second hand.

There is some more info Here though it's film based discusion, loads of it should be relevant.

Simonnn · 12 Nov 2006 at 14:48

Even £60 I don't have, student living and all that.Thanks for the link though looks pretty good.

Ghost in the Shell · 12 Nov 2006 at 15:14

anything around F4 or below will be fine just bump up the iso to 400/800 and shot at around 20/1 10/1 for best results. it all depends on how much movement your trying/not trying to capture tbh

id suggest something wider than a prime 50 - i had that lense and never used it when doing gigs, always opted for my 17-40L F4 which had more width and flexibility. i have had some amazing results with my 200L F2.8 though - superb bokeh

Simonnn · 12 Nov 2006 at 15:56

Great thanks, do you think i'll be able to achieve anything decent with the standard canon kit lens? My telephoto isn't going to be much use I don't think

Ghost in the Shell · 12 Nov 2006 at 17:51

Simonnn said:
Great thanks, do you think i'll be able to achieve anything decent with the standard canon kit lens? My telephoto isn't going to be much use I don't think

the kit lens isnt very sharp so dont expect clear results, nothing to say you cant use it to create some interesting images though as when an image is mainly dark who can tell how sharp it is!

shot in Tv mode and experiment with the times from 20-1 10-1 (and let the camera do the rest) etc but once you get to 1/3-1 it gets very tricky in an indoor gig environment.. oh dont forget to bump the iso to min 400 or 800 if you feel the camera can take it

good luck and hope to see some results soon, no way youll get perfect results 1st time but being prepared to learn from the ones you've taken is all you require really!

Simonnn · 12 Nov 2006 at 18:33

Thanks, what about flash, I only have the built in, I know normally using it will ruin shots, removing any colour and atmosphere. Is it flash sync or something which allows you to take a longer exposed shot with a flash as well, is that possible with the built in?

titchard · 13 Nov 2006 at 00:27

I use the 50MM 1.8 for all of my gig photography, although I am looking at purchasing a Sigma 24MM 1.8 for the wider shots, as smaller gigs mean you do get pushed to the front! no angle! and you then only seem to get head shots!

Rich

Ghost in the Shell · 13 Nov 2006 at 00:57

Simonnn said:
Thanks, what about flash, I only have the built in, I know normally using it will ruin shots, removing any colour and atmosphere. Is it flash sync or something which allows you to take a longer exposed shot with a flash as well, is that possible with the built in?

dont know ive got the 550ex flashgun but as yet ive not learnt enough to use it properly

if you use the settings i quoted u wont need flash - i doubt the in built will give you enough reach anyway

aztechnology · 13 Nov 2006 at 13:19

Simonnn said:
Thanks, what about flash, I only have the built in, I know normally using it will ruin shots, removing any colour and atmosphere. Is it flash sync or something which allows you to take a longer exposed shot with a flash as well, is that possible with the built in?

I'd leave flash alone. It tends to destoy the atmosphere (i.e. you loose the sense of it being a gig) unless you are confident in what you are doing.

cyKey · 13 Nov 2006 at 16:44

aztechnology said:
I'd leave flash alone. It tends to destoy the atmosphere (i.e. you loose the sense of it being a gig) unless you are confident in what you are doing.

Agreed. Its taken me a year to get comfy with the flash and there are plenty of times when it just doesn't work right and I can't get my head around it. For the most part I can use it to achieve what I want. If the lighting setup is good, which is highly unlikely for any small time bands, then just shoot with a high ISO and wide aperture. The best light I had this week on one stage was a desk lamp, which kinda worked from one side

benneh · 13 Nov 2006 at 23:45

Hmm, is it actually worth trying to shoot bands with my 18-55 canon kit lens?. Seems I'll need to be very close to get a decent pic, which I don't mind. But at a crowded gig it does make things a little awkward. None the less though, am I likely to get a sharp image with the kit lens in low lights? (not too worried about noise etc as I quite like a bit of noise in gig photos).

aztechnology · 13 Nov 2006 at 23:50

benneh said:
Hmm, is it actually worth trying to shoot bands with my 18-55 canon kit lens?. Seems I'll need to be very close to get a decent pic, which I don't mind. But at a crowded gig it does make things a little awkward. None the less though, am I likely to get a sharp image with the kit lens in low lights? (not too worried about noise etc as I quite like a bit of noise in gig photos).

just try it and see

Bang the ISO up high, and set a hand holdable(ish) shutter speed, then hope.

At a heaving gig, I'd be a bit cautious about where i took a DSLR, at a local gig I wouldn't be so bothered.

Raymond Lin · 14 Nov 2006 at 00:02

A few things

1 - Fast lens - F/2.8 and below if you can

2 - 1/focal length to avoid handshake

3 - ISO800, 1600 if its really dark

4 - Partial metering, Spot metering if you have it. Meter of the face of the subject so ou get the exposure right. This is really one of the instances where you don't need to use Evaluative Metering.

5 - Shoot in RAW !

6 - shoot one to see, if its over or under exposed, adjust to suit, just change the Aperture or shutter speed a little. Which brings me to my next point.

7 - Shoot in manual ! Because there could be weird laser and constant fluctuate lighting conditions, using Av or Tv will means the second you half press to compose and meter and to actually shooting the light can change. Best to shoot in manual and avoid all that.

cyKey · 14 Nov 2006 at 00:17

benneh said:
Hmm, is it actually worth trying to shoot bands with my 18-55 canon kit lens?. Seems I'll need to be very close to get a decent pic, which I don't mind. But at a crowded gig it does make things a little awkward. None the less though, am I likely to get a sharp image with the kit lens in low lights? (not too worried about noise etc as I quite like a bit of noise in gig photos).

3.5-5.6 is it? You'll be pushing it at 5.6 @ 55mm @ ISO1600 in bad lighting. I started using a 28-105 3.5-4.5 and managed quite well with that. Crowded or un-crowded you should always be at the front imho. 18-55 will be a nice enough range for that. I saw some nutter using a 70-200 f/2.8 at a gig were I was standing right in front of the singer at 24mm with great framing. 70mm was too close for me so god only knows why he was using 200mm. He had to wander into the crowd to "zoom" out

aztechnology said:
just try it and see

Bang the ISO up high, and set a hand holdable(ish) shutter speed, then hope.

At a heaving gig, I'd be a bit cautious about where i took a DSLR, at a local gig I wouldn't be so bothered.

Heaving gig = better atmosphere = better pics.

Raymond Lin said:
A few things

3 - ISO800, 1600 if its really dark

3200 on the 30D if you nail the exposure its perfect.

4 - Partial metering, Spot metering if you have it. Meter of the face of the subject so you get the exposure right. This is really one of the instances where you don't need to use Evaluative Metering.

Interesting. I've not yet found a use for Spot metering. I don't really understand its use and I always shoot in manual at gigs anyway.

7 - Shoot in manual ! Because there could be weird laser and constant fluctuate lighting conditions, using Av or Tv will means the second you half press to compose and meter and to actually shooting the light can change. Best to shoot in manual and avoid all that.

When I started I found the camera would meter for the entire scene and say its too dark so it would go for a long exposure in Av. I'm guessing that if I used Av + spot metering on the face as you suggest then it would be fine? But again, we both agree to shoot in manual so I guess its not needed

I suppose it might be nice to have the exposure meter giving me good info.

Raymond Lin · 14 Nov 2006 at 00:22

cyKey said:
When I started I found the camera would meter for the entire scene and say its too dark so it would go for a long exposure in Av. I'm guessing that if I used Av + spot metering on the face as you suggest then it would be fine? But again, we both agree to shoot in manual so I guess its not needed I suppose it might be nice to have the exposure meter giving me good info.

Using Av or Tv, the camera will try to meter for the entire scene. Hence you should stick to manual. The most important is get the subject's face exposed correctly, hence partial or spot metering. Evaluative will mean exposing the entire scene which you don't need, if there are lasers or spot light in the background it should create some ineteresting bokeh anyway.

as for 3200, sure, but i would rather keep it lower if possible. I would rather use aperture or shutter speed before adjusting ISO to get a shot. But if thats what it takes, then ISO it is, better to have a ISO3200 shot than a blur ISO800 shot.

oh one more thing, white people are 1+ stop lighter than 18% grey so either set the exposure by -1 just use bracketing when shooting.

cyKey · 14 Nov 2006 at 00:33

Raymond Lin said:
as for 3200, sure, but i would rather keep it lower if possible. I would rather use aperture or shutter speed before adjusting ISO to get a shot. But if thats what it takes, then ISO it is, better to have a ISO3200 shot than a blur ISO800 shot.

Yeah me too. I generally shoot at ISO1600 and knock it up to 3200 if needed. Most of this week was 3200

Raymond Lin · 15 Nov 2006 at 03:19

Ok, saw some pictures today which made me think a bit more.

Guess if you are close enough to the subject you could use the flash as a fill flash, the subject will be lit well albeit lose some stage light effect. The end result is less arty, more Hello Magazine.

These are taken with a Canon 1D MKII, 1/125 (flash sync), 60mm (full frame), Manual mode. F/5.0, Spot Metering

Yes, i know its a Girls Aloud concert