Mercedes and Pirelli are to face F1 Tribunal

Sounds like the FIA are trying to drop Pirelli and Mercedes in it. Slightly suspicious that they seem to be trying to play the "we didn't know anything about it" card when they had a delegate at the test.
 
I do think this shouldn't have been allowed but fia are as much to blame

If I was pirelli I would quit this shambles. Surely it isn't doing them any good in sponsorship?
Maybe it is.
 
Surely unless they can prove there is some sort of ambiguity in the regulation, Merc. will be ****** as it's a clear violation?

I imagine Pirelli will probably go unpunished, however if they are I can see them packing up and leaving the sport.
 
Nismo said:
Surely unless they can prove there is some sort of ambiguity in the regulation, Merc. will be ****** as it's a clear violation?

I imagine Pirelli will probably go unpunished, however if they are I can see them packing up and leaving the sport.
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The point this revolves around seems to be the fact it was allowed to go ahead. Pirelli and Mercedes claim the FIA knew about the test and new about the use of a 2013 car, and OK'ed it. But the FIA are now saying they didn't know about it or about the use of a 2013 car.

Quite how the FIA can claim this when they had a delegate at the test baffles me.

If there is a piece of paper somewhere that says 'W04' or '2013 car' with an FIA approval on it, case closed. If there isn't and Pirelli and Mercedes were operating under an assumption, then it means the FIA allowed it to happen but then prosecuted them for it in retrospect, and I'm not sure that's legal?
 
In a way this is reminding me of the RB flexi-wing situation.

A team has done something which everyone can see should be against the rules, but because the FIA have messed up (insufficient test before and FIA delegate present now), there is a good chance the team won't be penalised for.
 
kaiowas said:
Despite a general drop in reporting standards (They've become little more than a mouthpiece for the business interests of "Pitpass business editor Christian Sylt") over the last few years, Pitpass have a decent article up today which covers the actual issues that will be under consideration:

http://www.pitpass.com/49198-That-Barcelona-test-from-a-legal-perspective
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Thats a very good article.

El_Watcher said:
In a way this is reminding me of the RB flexi-wing situation.

A team has done something which everyone can see should be against the rules, but because the FIA have messed up (insufficient test before and FIA delegate present now), there is a good chance the team won't be penalised for.
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The flexi wing was never that complicated. The media hype around it and the really poor 'version' of the rules that was bounded about caused the confusion. The RBR wing was legal, simple as.

But back to this, it seems to be down to wether the test was a Mercedes test, or a Pirelli one (reading that PitPass article). If it is deemed a Mercedes test, they broke the rules, they are in trouble. If however it is deemed to have been a Pirelli organised test, it falls into a grey area. Pirelli are not governed by the Sporting or Technical regulations, and what they can or can't do, or what they can or can't run at their own tests is undefined. If its deemed a Pirelli test this will run for a while.
 
Mercedes will be fined as some form of punishment to try and appease people, which it won't do, and the rules will be rewritten in an attempt to prevent something similar happening again in the future.

That is what I think will happen in the end, regardless of what the findings are :p
 
I think the FIA are like "oh ****, we need to make a song and dance about this" when in fact they have made a mess up themselves. RBR and the other teams are likely worried as the Merc looks like the fastest car, only pinned back by appalling tyre wear - if fixed they could be a real challenger, hence the protest.

Suspect fines will be dished out, but nothing to severe and things will move on. If Mercedes pull out some performance this weekend, then it may tarnish things but Bernie will be loving the drama/publicity etc
 
duc999 said:
Just another issue that enforces what a joke this 'sport' is becoming :rolleyes:
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I think the biggest 'joke' this is exposing is the ban on testing. It causes more issues than it fixes.

Bring back in season testing, done at tracks after GPs so no need for additional testing teams or travel, limit it to a number of days with non race drivers, and also nominate tyre manufacturer test days.
 
Tenzo said:
I think the FIA are like "oh ****, we need to make a song and dance about this" when in fact they have made a mess up themselves. RBR and the other teams are likely worried as the Merc looks like the fastest car, only pinned back by appalling tyre wear - if fixed they could be a real challenger, hence the protest.

Suspect fines will be dished out, but nothing to severe and things will move on. If Mercedes pull out some performance this weekend, then it may tarnish things but Bernie will be loving the drama/publicity etc
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If merc cracked their tyre problems without loosing pace they'd win both championships. I personally hope they don't crack it!
 
al4x said:
If merc cracked their tyre problems without loosing pace they'd win both championships. I personally hope they don't crack it!
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As big a Hamilton fan as I am, I would also prefer that this season didn't end up like 2011 with one team/driver being miles in the lead every race.

Personally I don't think Merc will crack the tyre-wear issue before the end of this season*– they haven't managed it in the previous two years.

I just hope it doesn't follow them into 2014.
 
al4x said:
If merc cracked their tyre problems without loosing pace they'd win both championships. I personally hope they don't crack it!
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Barring a complete oversight on their part (that would have existed for several years now), there's not a hope they'll crack it without sacrificing speed. Their speed will be down to how hard they can work the tyres.

They've either completely misjudged the fastest way to go motor-racing on these tyres for the past 3 years or it's an inherent feature of their car. Fiddling and managing the tyres before getting up to racing speed may go some way to helping them, but it will remain a feature of their car until they dump it and bring a new one.

They'd have been scarily quick on the rock-hard Bridgestone tyres though (but then other teams will have changed their design philosophies too of course).
 
From the information I can find on it, Mercedes seem to have had tyre issues for as long as they have been running the hydraulic rear suspension link thing.
 
Skeeter said:
I think the biggest 'joke' this is exposing is the ban on testing. It causes more issues than it fixes.

Bring back in season testing, done at tracks after GPs so no need for additional testing teams or travel, limit it to a number of days with non race drivers, and also nominate tyre manufacturer test days.
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Agreed!
 
Skeeter said:
From the information I can find on it, Mercedes seem to have had tyre issues for as long as they have been running the hydraulic rear suspension link thing.
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I love this quote from Autosport's article about FRIC suspension.

autosport said:
Alongside its aerodynamic benefits, more pliable suspension should make FRIC cars better at tyre conservation.
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Doesn't seem to be working at the moment!

e: Saying that, it is working well for Bad Lotus™
 
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