~£1800 Build Check: Animation & Video

[Cr0fty]

Hi all,

I'm building a new work machine in the next couple of weeks and looking for any thoughts

I am a designer who does a lot of work in projection mapping and animation, this involves After Effects and Cinema 4D as well as the rest of the Creative Cloud suite. I'll be using the GPU for Redshift/Octane, although the primary part of my workflow is After Effects.

CPU wise I'm leaning towards the 12700 - As well as being cheaper it beats the 5900X in single threaded uses ie C4D viewport and several After Effects use cases (albeit up until the most recent release which added multi core support but this is not yet fully fleshed out / stable...).

Working spec below:

CPU - Intel 12700 (I won't be overclocking so will likely go non-k)
MOB - MSI Z690 A
RAM - 64GB (2*32) Corsair LPX 3200 CL16 or 3600 CL18 (Will likely add two more sticks in later down the line)
GPU - 3070 or 3060ti (Best prices for me are €700 or €629 currently, with their very similar performance the 3060ti may be the better option)
SSD 1 (OS / Applications) - M.2 WD Blue 500GB Pci-E 3.0 x4 TLC
SSD 2 (After Effects + Other application Cache) - M.2 WD Blue 500GB Pci-E 3.0 x4 TLC
SSD 3 (Storage) - M.2 Samsung 980 1TB Pci-E 3.0 x4 TLC (Maybe just swap for another WD Blue 1tb?)
PSU - Not really sure, I may add a second GPU over time, would a 750W Gold be ok or should I be looking for more in that case?
CPU Cooler - Unsure here any advice welcome, I think I'd prefer air though!
Case - Anything that doesn't look too gamery and has good airflow

This looks like:

I've just moved to the Netherlands so displaying my found prices in Euros and converting to £ to make sense of it! [Mods I have read the rules and hope the above screenshot doesn't infringe]

The SSDs are a bit of a stab in the dark in terms of what to go for so any advice is appreciated there, the same with the PSU.

As above any advice or thoughts please do share

 

[Haz123]

OK first a discalimer , I have never used the programs you are using and I am not a designer. Also halfway through a nice bottle of red but hey its a weekday so cut me some slack.

Few points I can hopefully help you with.

Overclocking is pretty much dead these days and you can just let the cpu do all the work for you with it boosting intelligently to give the best performance. The Intel K ( and also non K ) cpus have the integrated graphics ( igpu) , the KF do not have igpu so avoid these. This igpu was used for quicksync in a lot of programs as I am sure you know. I do not know if any of the professional programs you listed benefit from an igpu but I would say it is best to have it just in case it gets added at a later date. It is always worthwhile having the varient with igpu because you still have working a PC if your gpu dies and can be very helpful with troubleshooting.

Mobo ram gpu all sensible.

Storage. Maybe look at the Seagate Firecuda 530 SSDs. They are still TLC but have much improved endurance over the ones you list. I guess you will be stressing the SSDs a lot more than an average consumer so would not want them dying prematurely. Of course if you have a sensible back up solution already in place then the drives you listed are very good if they are decent value when you buy them. SSDs yoyo in price everyday so hard to advise.

PSU. 750w 80+ Gold will be fine for the listed components. You mention adding a second gpu at a later date. Are you aware that only the 3090 has an sli bridge ? all lower end cards are not able to be used in an sli mode. I know some professional programs do not run in sli and can use 2 gpus but just giving you a heads up on that situation. Adding a second gpu is also a strange situation , if you need more gpu power you may be better off selling your current gpu and buying the higher end sku than adding a second of the same type. This is outside my area of expertise and I guess you know how your programs utilise the gpus. If you did want to add a second 3060ti you would be cutting it very close with a 750w psu and 850w or even 1k would be adviseable, 850w are often a very small uplift in price over a 750w so look for a good deal on a decent psu.

CPU cooler. We are normally giving advice to gamers on here and the 12700 uses reasonable amounts of power when running games and a good air cooler can work just fine. When Alderlake cpus run productivety tasks they use a lot of power and I would recommend an AIO. Arctic Liquid Freezer II has thicker rads than other AIOs and comes in 240/280/360/420 so will fit into almost any size case within reason. I have a 360 version in a pc upstairs and it did confuse me at first but is easy to fit once you get your head in gear, mine has rgb fans but they do come with non glowing fans if you prefer. Arctic also ship with the 1700 bracket you would need for your mobo, you would need to check that the cooler you buy comes with the correct mounting, I am sure most of them do by now.
I just went back and checked Intels claims that the 12700 is a 65w cpu whilst the 12700k is a 125w cpu, I would take those claims with a huge pinch of salt and a 12700k uses approx 300w when fully stressed. If the 12700 boosts to the same speeds as the 12700k then they will be using the same amount of power. Yes it may idle at lower clocks but once you start stressing the cpu with work it will use power and need cooling.
If you did go the air cooling route then the Noctua NH-D15 is the best but it is very large so you need to be careful with ram clearance and case choice. In a lot of ways an AIO is easier because you never have to worry about ram clearance and almost all cases are made with these in mind.

Case. Depends on the cpu cooler you go with.

Hope my semi drunken ramblings were of use to you.

 

[Craig_d1]

Hi all,

I'm building a new work machine in the next couple of weeks and looking for any thoughts

I am a designer who does a lot of work in projection mapping and animation, this involves After Effects and Cinema 4D as well as the rest of the Creative Cloud suite. I'll be using the GPU for Redshift/Octane, although the primary part of my workflow is After Effects.

CPU wise I'm leaning towards the 12700 - As well as being cheaper it beats the 5900X in single threaded uses ie C4D viewport and several After Effects use cases (albeit up until the most recent release which added multi core support but this is not yet fully fleshed out / stable...).

Working spec below:

CPU - Intel 12700 (I won't be overclocking so will likely go non-k)
MOB - MSI Z690 A
RAM - 64GB (2*32) Corsair LPX 3200 CL16 or 3600 CL18 (Will likely add two more sticks in later down the line)
GPU - 3070 or 3060ti (Best prices for me are €700 or €629 currently, with their very similar performance the 3060ti may be the better option)
SSD 1 (OS / Applications) - M.2 WD Blue 500GB Pci-E 3.0 x4 TLC
SSD 2 (After Effects + Other application Cache) - M.2 WD Blue 500GB Pci-E 3.0 x4 TLC
SSD 3 (Storage) - M.2 Samsung 980 1TB Pci-E 3.0 x4 TLC (Maybe just swap for another WD Blue 1tb?)
PSU - Not really sure, I may add a second GPU over time, would a 750W Gold be ok or should I be looking for more in that case?
CPU Cooler - Unsure here any advice welcome, I think I'd prefer air though!
Case - Anything that doesn't look too gamery and has good airflow

This looks like:

I've just moved to the Netherlands so displaying my found prices in Euros and converting to £ to make sense of it! [Mods I have read the rules and hope the above screenshot doesn't infringe]

The SSDs are a bit of a stab in the dark in terms of what to go for so any advice is appreciated there, the same with the PSU.

As above any advice or thoughts please do share

Are you subbed to fepartalert...euro drop just happenned

 

[Craig_d1]

Download telegram
https://t.me/joinchat/AAAAAEii3xT81U1A6tLjrQ

 

[Cr0fty]

Are you subbed to fepartalert...euro drop just happenned

I am but thank you for the heads up! I wasn't able to get one they went super fast gadamnit. That website doesn't like my information either as I'm still using a UK bank + mobile number until I get my citizen number in a couple of weeks...

OK first a discalimer , I have never used the programs you are using and I am not a designer. Also halfway through a nice bottle of red but hey its a weekday so cut me some slack.

Few points I can hopefully help you with.

Overclocking is pretty much dead these days and you can just let the cpu do all the work for you with it boosting intelligently to give the best performance. The Intel K ( and also non K ) cpus have the integrated graphics ( igpu) , the KF do not have igpu so avoid these. This igpu was used for quicksync in a lot of programs as I am sure you know. I do not know if any of the professional programs you listed benefit from an igpu but I would say it is best to have it just in case it gets added at a later date. It is always worthwhile having the varient with igpu because you still have working a PC if your gpu dies and can be very helpful with troubleshooting.

Firstly thank you, if that's your well oiled reply then your sober ones must be razor sharp

Really point on having one in case of dead GPU. I'm not sure if my programmes would benefit from it but that reaason alone seems worth it.

Storage. Maybe look at the Seagate Firecuda 530 SSDs. They are still TLC but have much improved endurance over the ones you list. I guess you will be stressing the SSDs a lot more than an average consumer so would not want them dying prematurely. Of course if you have a sensible back up solution already in place then the drives you listed are very good if they are decent value when you buy them. SSDs yoyo in price everyday so hard to advise.

What level of longevity difference are we talking? The cache drive will be constantly rewriting but won't have any actual data on it per say - Similarly the OS / Application drive won't be doing as much lifting so I'm not sure they'd be necessary? The storage drive however, I will be rendering large image sequences to and having my project files etc. This will be backed up to a HDD but does feel like the place where endurance would be welcome.

PSU. 750w 80+ Gold will be fine for the listed components. You mention adding a second gpu at a later date. Are you aware that only the 3090 has an sli bridge ? all lower end cards are not able to be used in an sli mode. I know some professional programs do not run in sli and can use 2 gpus but just giving you a heads up on that situation. Adding a second gpu is also a strange situation , if you need more gpu power you may be better off selling your current gpu and buying the higher end sku than adding a second of the same type. This is outside my area of expertise and I guess you know how your programs utilise the gpus. If you did want to add a second 3060ti you would be cutting it very close with a 750w psu and 850w or even 1k would be adviseable, 850w are often a very small uplift in price over a 750w so look for a good deal on a decent psu.

I think I'll take a look at some larger power supplies with that in mind then. Re SLI it doesn't matter for GPU rendering and applications such as Redshift and Octane have near linear performance scaling when adding additional GPUs. [Puget Link] The thing for me is that this isn't the fully part of my workflow yet but may become in the future, so for the moment it makes sense to buy something mid range with good Performance/£ and scale up in the future if I need more rendering power.

CPU cooler. We are normally giving advice to gamers on here and the 12700 uses reasonable amounts of power when running games and a good air cooler can work just fine. When Alderlake cpus run productivety tasks they use a lot of power and I would recommend an AIO. Arctic Liquid Freezer II has thicker rads than other AIOs and comes in 240/280/360/420 so will fit into almost any size case within reason. I have a 360 version in a pc upstairs and it did confuse me at first but is easy to fit once you get your head in gear, mine has rgb fans but they do come with non glowing fans if you prefer. Arctic also ship with the 1700 bracket you would need for your mobo, you would need to check that the cooler you buy comes with the correct mounting, I am sure most of them do by now.
I just went back and checked Intels claims that the 12700 is a 65w cpu whilst the 12700k is a 125w cpu, I would take those claims with a huge pinch of salt and a 12700k uses approx 300w when fully stressed. If the 12700 boosts to the same speeds as the 12700k then they will be using the same amount of power. Yes it may idle at lower clocks but once you start stressing the cpu with work it will use power and need cooling.
If you did go the air cooling route then the Noctua NH-D15 is the best but it is very large so you need to be careful with ram clearance and case choice. In a lot of ways an AIO is easier because you never have to worry about ram clearance and almost all cases are made with these in mind.

Thank you, I hadn't really considered AIO but looking at some temperature benchmarks I think I may go this way... Would you expect to flush something like the Arctic Cooler over its lifetime or should it remained self contained?

Hope my semi drunken ramblings were of use to you.

Just a little...! Big thanks for the input.

 

[Craig_d1]

I am but thank you for the heads up! I wasn't able to get one they went super fast gadamnit. That website doesn't like my information either as I'm still using a UK bank + mobile number until I get my citizen number in a couple of weeks...



Firstly thank you, if that's your well oiled reply then your sober ones must be razor sharp

Really point on having one in case of dead GPU. I'm not sure if my programmes would benefit from it but that reaason alone seems worth it.



What level of longevity difference are we talking? The cache drive will be constantly rewriting but won't have any actual data on it per say - Similarly the OS / Application drive won't be doing as much lifting so I'm not sure they'd be necessary? The storage drive however, I will be rendering large image sequences to and having my project files etc. This will be backed up to a HDD but does feel like the place where endurance would be welcome.



I think I'll take a look at some larger power supplies with that in mind then. Re SLI it doesn't matter for GPU rendering and applications such as Redshift and Octane have near linear performance scaling when adding additional GPUs. [Puget Link] The thing for me is that this isn't the fully part of my workflow yet but may become in the future, so for the moment it makes sense to buy something mid range with good Performance/£ and scale up in the future if I need more rendering power.



Thank you, I hadn't really considered AIO but looking at some temperature benchmarks I think I may go this way... Would you expect to flush something like the Arctic Cooler over its lifetime or should it remained self contained?



Just a little...! Big thanks for the input.

Going to send a private message, have a 3060ti in my basket...maybe if you ring me it'll work
Just tried but can't start a private conversation. If you're reading reply quickly, then I can put my home no. up quickly, you can ring, then I can delete my number. It's been there awhile so may of been removed but willing to give it a go...if the 3060ti is something you want...ahh, just read you still have uk bank, so doubt it'll work

 

[Cr0fty]

Going to send a private message, have a 3060ti in my basket...maybe if you ring me it'll work
Just tried but can't start a private conversation. If you're reading reply quickly, then I can put my home no. up quickly, you can ring, then I can delete my number. It's been there awhile so may of been removed but willing to give it a go...if the 3060ti is something you want...ahh, just read you still have uk bank, so doubt it'll work

If you can that would be amazing! No worries if not though but maybe worth a try.

Edit - Replied in a rush.. Have tried to start a Conversation via that forum feature

I did get a 3080 in my basket which disappeared straight way so I'm not sure if they hold them either?

 

[Craig_d1]

for Nvme ssd's, the larger the drive, the bigger the endurance. If you want the best for heavy lifting, then the Firecuda 2tb 530 has a 2550 TBW ...so in theory, you could write 1TB to it every day, and it should last just under 7 years before it gives out, or 100 GB files for 70years...know idea how much data you transfer every day. The 1tb version is 1275 TBW

Actually, thought the Firecuda 520 would be slightly less but endurance is 3600 TBW, so you could write 100GB to it every day for 98years before it gives in. Still a gen4 nvme and just seen it for £214 so that would be my go 2 storage. the 1tb version is 1800TBW...if you go below 1tb, you'll find the random writes of the drives drop significantly, so would stick with 1tb or 2tb for your system

if you want comparison, I have a WD 2tb SN850 in my system, endurance is 1200 TBW, and the 1tb is 600 TBW

 

[Haz123]

Thank you, I hadn't really considered AIO but looking at some temperature benchmarks I think I may go this way... Would you expect to flush something like the Arctic Cooler over its lifetime or should it remained self contained?

AIOs are maintenence free and you do not need to flush them at all, just screw them in place, plug them in and set the fan curve. There are some AIOs with fill ports so you can top them up but this is mostly unnecessary. I used an AIO for 5 years and didnt touch it in that time, I only got the Arctic because I felt like a change.

 

[Cr0fty]

Thank you again Haz and Craig for your input, I'm going to do a little more research and rejig the spec accordingly over the next day or two - Watch this space!

 

[Craig_d1]

I second aio. Put it in my new build. Although only 6 months, very happy with it. It was a 2nd hand(from someone stripping out a pc for the gpu so only been used a couple on month) corsair 360mm H150i Pro XT (if buying new prob get a diff one, but it was cheap). Standard thickness rad, so not thick rad like arctic. Got a 5800X running, and don't hear anything from it but a faint hum from the pump, but runs cool, no issues. With a 12700k, pretty much any 360mm aio will do, just pick one that has a good warranty(some come with 1 year, others 5/6) If you go arctic, make sure there's enough clearance for it if putting in roof of the case you choose
To be fair, think any good 240mm is more than enough for the 12700k also

 

[turbot1984]

Thank you again Haz and Craig for your input, I'm going to do a little more research and rejig the spec accordingly over the next day or two - Watch this space!

Hi, designer mate of mine who uses similar software and Lumion went for the AMD 6800 rather than 3070 because it had double the VRAM (16GB not 8GB), which he felt was important after researching specific requirements. He also went for 64MB RAM, but 5900X not Alder Lake for some reason, maybe after AMD price drop?

 

[Cr0fty]

Hi, designer mate of mine who uses similar software and Lumion went for the AMD 6800 rather than 3070 because it had double the VRAM (16GB not 8GB), which he felt was important after researching specific requirements. He also went for 64MB RAM, but 5900X not Alder Lake for some reason, maybe after AMD price drop?

Thanks, aye the Vram is a bit of a stinker but overall Nvidia is far better supported and implemented in most GPU rendering situations, especially with RTX optimisation and Nvidia Denoising. My work isn't so texture heavy which is where the Vram usage is - speed is more important in my animation use case. Does your friend do architectural visualisation or a lot of modelling by any chance?

That card is also £830 (€985) vs the €610 (£513) I can get a 3060ti for, which also puts it nearer to 3080 territory!

You can compare price / performance or overall render times here [Redshift Benchmarks] [Octane Benchmarks]

I second aio. Put it in my new build. Although only 6 months, very happy with it. It was a 2nd hand(from someone stripping out a pc for the gpu so only been used a couple on month) corsair 360mm H150i Pro XT (if buying new prob get a diff one, but it was cheap). Standard thickness rad, so not thick rad like arctic. Got a 5800X running, and don't hear anything from it but a faint hum from the pump, but runs cool, no issues. With a 12700k, pretty much any 360mm aio will do, just pick one that has a good warranty(some come with 1 year, others 5/6) If you go arctic, make sure there's enough clearance for it if putting in roof of the case you choose
To be fair, think any good 240mm is more than enough for the 12700k also

Nice I think I'll see if I can get away with a 240mm Arctic, that's available for €77 delivered vs 280mm-€92 and 360mm-€97.

 

[turbot1984]

Does your friend do architectural visualisation or a lot of modelling by any chance?

That's it, maybe its 3ds max that he said he used for fly through animations etc. Pretty sure he spent way more on the monitor than pc as well.

 

[lee32uk]

You would be fine with a good air cooler such as the Scythe Fuma 2.

 

[Cr0fty]

You would be fine with a good air cooler such as the Scythe Fuma 2.

I'm sure you are right butt.. I've kind of settled on an Arctic 240 now, no harm in keeping it plenty cool and quiet.

That's it, maybe its 3ds max that he said he used for fly through animations etc. Pretty sure he spent way more on the monitor than pc as well.

That sounds about right on the display.. I need to open a monitor sized can of worms myself soon but it won't be quite that spec

So here's where I'm at, I've pressed order on all of the green cells Going to wait another week on the GPU then hit go.

After much deliberation I changed the storage config - I nearly went for the FireCuda but in the end went on cost/performance. I did the math and I doubt I'll even get near the write limit of either of the chosen drives before they get replaced!

Case wise I really liked the look of the Fractal Meshify C in white, but it was too small and the '2' is €35 more..

Thank you all massively for your help, I'll post some pictures of the build in a week or so!

 

[Haz123]

Good luck with the build. I cannot see any issues and it should be relatively straightforwards.

Look forwards to the pretty pics when you are all done.

 

[Craig_d1]

Yup, enjoy the build. A pic would be nice

 

[turbot1984]

That sounds about right on the display.. I need to open a monitor sized can of worms myself soon but it won't be quite that spec

It was this one he went for
https://www.dell.com/en-uk/work/sho...21q/apd/210-axvh/monitors-monitor-accessories
... said it was 'awesome' lol ... I bet.
Good luck with the build

 

[Cr0fty]

Build went super smooth, I was incredibly happy when it turned on and worked first press.

One slight hiccup when I went to plug in keyboard and mouse and realised I had forgotten to put the mobo IO plate in the case...!! I think that'll be staying off as I'm not up for the faff of removing everything just for the shield

GPU is on order so will be going in shortly. Will post temps soon but they seem very good on cinebench, ambient room is 18 degrees and it's idling at around 25

Can't believe the size difference, the included cooler is tiny. The edge fins are also all plastic!

The case is very nice, thumb screws in all the right places and the fans super quiet.

The case top lights are quite nice too!

Once again thanks to everybody for your input and time. I'll post some benchmarks and temps etc over the next couple of days once the gpu is in!