A-MVA vs H-IPS, which is better?

FreeStream · 12 Sep 2009 at 23:42

Main use: Photography work.

Secondary use, Blu-ray + light gaming (mainly Live for Speed and FS-X).

Which is better, and which should I get?

Hazro HZ26Wi Vs. OcUK 24" (the decent panel from a while ago).

Im pretty sure that the Hazro is far better but i'd like someone with better panel knowledge than me to confirm it.

Badass? Please?

Cheers!

dustofnations · 12 Sep 2009 at 23:53

As far as I'm aware IPS is generally better as it has the same assets as PVA (gamut, wide viewing angles), but without high input latency and purple shift - although you have to compare the monitors on their merits.

Goofball · 13 Sep 2009 at 11:42

The big thing about the AU Optronics A-MVA panel is that it is native sRGB gamut. Other than that, it's pretty much the attributes of S-PVA. H-IPS are generally better tech-wise than the *VAs, but in terms of the Hazro Im not so sure.

Especially the panel-blocking brightness control thing they got going absolutely ruins the contrast of their screens at reasonable brightness settings makes me scared of getting close to them. The minimum black point of the 26Wi is around 0.6cd/m2, which is truely rubbish.

FreeStream · 13 Sep 2009 at 12:03

Goofball said:
The big thing about the AU Optronics A-MVA panel is that it is native sRGB gamut. Other than that, it's pretty much the attributes of S-PVA. H-IPS are generally better tech-wise than the *VAs, but in terms of the Hazro Im not so sure.

Especially the panel-blocking brightness control thing they got going absolutely ruins the contrast of their screens at reasonable brightness settings makes me scared of getting close to them. The minimum black point of the 26Wi is around 0.6cd/m2, which is truely rubbish.

Hmmmmm...

That new dell is looking better and better, it's just i'd like a bigger monitor as 24" is too small

27" Dell would be nice but the input lag is shocking.

MKay · 13 Sep 2009 at 14:55

Concorde Rules said:
Hmmmmm...
That new dell is looking better and better, it's just i'd like a bigger monitor as 24" is too small
27" Dell would be nice but the input lag is shocking.

Hmm. If those are the choices then, unless you plan to sit more than 2ft away then (since it's the same resolution, just with smaller pixels) I'd either consider a 24" or I'd wait

There's probably a new 27" Dell on the way if you can hang in a few months, although there's no guarantee it'll be IPS based and have a decent response time. If Overclockers ever manage to get the LG 26" IPS in stock that's basically the same panel as the Hazro 26" too afaik (minus the troubles of dealing with Hazro.) Expect to pay anywhere between about £300 and £500, depending on who you believe

I'd be very cautious about dealing with Hazro when people have to wait weeks for replies etc..

For all Dells flaws, unless you spend the £££ to go with NEC, they're probably one of the better options in terms of customer service, and I can vouch that the U2410 is a step up from their previous panels. If the main use is photography then wide gamut is an advantage, not a disadvantage, since any decent graphics program is already colour managed and can make use of that wider gamut for richer colours.

Once you combine gaming on to that I'd either look at the U2410 or I'd wait till something came around in the size you wanted. You might be waiting a while though since, unless there's new IPS panels on the way, the previous LG 26" panels seem in fairly short supply and there's not really much alternatives around for now..

BlueMhz · 13 Sep 2009 at 14:59

deleted

Mick-1965 · 13 Sep 2009 at 16:27

Goofball said:
The big thing about the AU Optronics A-MVA panel is that it is native sRGB gamut. Other than that, it's pretty much the attributes of S-PVA. H-IPS are generally better tech-wise than the *VAs, but in terms of the Hazro Im not so sure.

Especially the panel-blocking brightness control thing they got going absolutely ruins the contrast of their screens at reasonable brightness settings makes me scared of getting close to them. The minimum black point of the 26Wi is around 0.6cd/m2, which is truely rubbish.

"panel-blocking brightness control " as you describe it is utilised by all ips screens. The only thing the Hazro hasn't got compared with newer ips screens is the ability to dim the back light so it relies purely on "panel-blocking brightness control ".
As for the black level of 0.6 that was pre firmware update.

I have got the 26Wi. My calibrated black level is 0.3 which is very decent for an ips screen.

Goofball · 13 Sep 2009 at 16:56

Mick-1965 said:
"panel-blocking brightness control " as you describe it is utilised by all ips screens. [snip]

I have got the 26Wi. My calibrated black level is 0.3 which is very decent for an ips screen.

No, it's not. Pretty much all current major brand IPS's have a completely static contrast rate of 700-800:1 throughout the brightness scale, indicating full backlight-controlled brightness. The Hazros are pretty much the only ones left that cant do that.

0.3 is a lot better than 0.60, but it's still a measly 400;1 static contrast @120cd/m2. "Very decent" would be the 0.17-0.20 you'd get from the current LGs, Dells or HPs sporting the current LGD 24 and 26" H-IPS panels.

Mick-1965 · 13 Sep 2009 at 18:09

As said. All panels block the back light from coming through per pixel, else how would you have a darker pixel than another.

The only thing the hazro hasn't got is the circuitry to control the back light from the osd ( its pre-set )and yes it is rather a drawback.
Lower than 0.3 would be excellent but its decent enough

Goofball · 13 Sep 2009 at 18:33

"Panel blocking brightness control" is when the brightness control simply lowers the white-point of the screen through the panel instead of reducing the intensity of the backlight when adjusting brightness. Thus leaving the blackpoint constant, and completely destroying the contrast ratio at lower settings. A feature only found on the Hazro among current displays.

Setting individual pixels has nothing to do with this "feature".

FreeStream · 13 Sep 2009 at 18:44

0.3 black depth is MUCH better than the review (Baddass get another one in for testing!)

If I were to say it would cost me £150 to change, I would be able to pick from tens of practically brand new HZ26Wi and be able to test each one to find the best, would you guys say its worth it?

I would wait for the new Dell 26" HOWEVER if the 24" is bordering on what im willing to pay then the 26/27" is going to be ridiculous!

Mick-1965 · 13 Sep 2009 at 19:09

Concorde Rules said:
0.3 black depth is MUCH better than the review (Baddass get another one in for testing!)

If I were to say it would cost me £150 to change, I would be able to pick from tens of practically brand new HZ26Wi and be able to test each one to find the best, would you guys say its worth it?

I would wait for the new Dell 26" HOWEVER if the 24" is bordering on what im willing to pay then the 26/27" is going to be ridiculous!

That was part of the update. They reduced the luminance of the back light.
Personally I wish they had reduced it further, then we could have a better black level, but as said 0.3 is decent enough.

With what you've said about choosing, then you couldn't go wrong, just nick a PSU for spare just in case

But if you've got the extra cash and want better black levels then go for something newer, one with adjustable back light. This is the only place I see where the hazro fall behind, and its a major draw back either.

The only other problem you read about is the contact issue. You`ll only read about the bad, they used to be really good, as in they`d contact you within hours of emailing them. They took a week last time to get in touch, but apparently was in the middle of contracting out all the warranty work. But they did exchange my 24" for a 26" so I wasnt complaining too much

FreeStream · 13 Sep 2009 at 19:25

Thanks Mick.

Warranty only applies to the first buyer and unfortunately these are second hand with about a weeks use!

What else is there about thats > 24"? Not a lot really without spending mega ££££

Im going to buy a calibrator for my current monitor and see what black depth I can get. If its anywhere near 0.3 or above then im sold

Mick-1965 · 13 Sep 2009 at 19:41

The only time really you are going to notice higher black levels (above .5 -.6 ) are if you have very dark scenes and haven't got any ambient light other words sitting in a dark room then a totally black screen will seem to have a white glow.
My pre update 24" had a black level of 1 and in a totally darkened room was enough to almost read a book by, but during the day hardly noticeable.

I think for the cash you get allot of monitor.

How come you have so many to choose from ? and you say £150 is that on top of what you`d get for your old monitor or to buy out right ?

FreeStream · 13 Sep 2009 at 19:44

Dude on the bay of e has quite a few of them from what he's said. Going to go and test one and pay him on the spot

And yes, it is, £150-170 more for a silver HZ26Wi 2.1

I think I will get one!

Cheers

EsaT · 13 Sep 2009 at 19:45

Mick-1965 said:
That was part of the update. They reduced the luminance of the back light.
Personally I wish they had reduced it further, then we could have a better black level, but as said 0.3 is decent enough.

So they replaced some resistor in back light's PSU or adjusted some trimmer potentiometer...
Back light just dimms during use so better hope that it won't dimm too much fast.
(especially considering that at default it was running at full blast)

Mick-1965 · 13 Sep 2009 at 19:55

I`m happy with mine, I do quite a bit of photo editing, and I like my FPS`s as well. With its very low input lag (7.5ms) its ideal for that too.

With the money you`re saving on the monitor then get a decent calibration device to set it up. something in the lines of the eyeone display 2. well worth the money compared to the cheaper options.

Mick-1965 · 13 Sep 2009 at 19:59

EsaT said:
So they replaced some resistor in back light's PSU or adjusted some trimmer potentiometer...
Back light just dimms during use so better hope that it won't dimm too much fast.
(especially considering that at default it was running at full blast)

Is it as simple as that ? I thought to alter the luminance of the back light you altered the frequency the CCFL ran at.

FreeStream · 13 Sep 2009 at 20:03

Mick-1965 said:
I`m happy with mine, I do quite a bit of photo editing, and I like my FPS`s as well. With its very low input lag (7.5ms) its ideal for that too.

With the money you`re saving on the monitor then get a decent calibration device to set it up. something in the lines of the eyeone display 2. well worth the money compared to the cheaper options.

Your the second person to recommend the Eye-One Display 2.

I've found one for £75 so I think i'll snap that up then

Mick-1965 · 13 Sep 2009 at 20:11

Concorde Rules said:
Your the second person to recommend the Eye-One Display 2.

I've found one for £75 so I think i'll snap that up then

That's what I paid for mine off of feebay . Sooo much better than the spyder I had previous.