Accident This Morning

Danger Phoenix

Danger Phoenix

Danger Phoenix

Soldato
Joined
21 Jul 2004
Posts
6,368
Location
Harrow, UK
This happened this morning (quote from what I wrote on the Policy Report which I was asked to fill when I called the 101 service):

The traffic was moving slowly down the A3 and I wanted to turn right onto Sutherland Grove. I indicated and checked my mirrors and blind spot before making the manoeuvre. I was over half way across the oncoming lane when I heard and felt the impact of the motorcyclist on the right rear door of my car. I stopped in a safe place on Sutherland Road with my hazards on and went to check on the motorcyclist.

When I got to him he was already up and about to move the motorcycle, which was almost on the give way lines of Sutherland Road.
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Admiral told me that this sounds like a Non Fault claim, whereas the RBS Claims Handlers (I work at RBS Insurance) said that it sounds like a split claim. What do you guys think?
 
Sounds as though you're at fault to me, the above makes it sound as though you pulled out on him leaving no room for him to stop.
 
Sounds like a split claim to me. Motorcyclist was possibly filtering at too high a speed, but you may have pulled out without checking fully.
 
A motorcyclist shouldn't be overtaking the lane of traffic near a junction like that at a speed he can't stop, i.e. when you pulled out if he couldn't stop then he was going too fast, unless you're telling some porkies and you just didn't look hard enough. He will probably say he was in your blind spot and you didn't look so I wouldn't be surprised if it came down 50/50 but likewise I wouldn't be surprised if was decided to be motorcyclists fault.
 
I have taken pictures, but by the time I actually parked the car and got out he was already up and moving the motorbike.

The question I have is that should he have been overtaking in the oncoming traffic's lane? He also hit the rear right door of my car so I was significantly across the lane and almost into the road when the impact occurred.

At the scene he said I didn't indicate, but I know I did because I always do. I even indicate when going around carparks, and it has become just a natural instinct. Plus I had the MOT done yesterday so I know all the lights etc work.

His impact was also quite low speed and all cars were moving along that road at about 5-10mph due to the traffic.
 
Was the bike overtaking or was it turning right?

I guess if he was overtaking in heavy, slow moving traffic then I would say it was his fault. I always think its very dangerous when I see bikers doing it, regardless of whether you think they are right or not to do it, it is asking for it, imo.
 
Although it's not illegal to overtake opposite a junction, it is certainly bad practise that is advised against. It falls under a "DO NOT" rather than a "MUST NOT".

Take from the Highway Code:
Many of the rules in the Code are legal requirements, and if you disobey these rules you are committing a criminal offence. You may be fined, given penalty points on your licence or be disqualified from driving. In the most serious cases you may be sent to prison. Such rules are identified by the use of the words ‘MUST/MUST NOT’. In addition, the rule includes an abbreviated reference to the legislation which creates the offence. An explanation of the abbreviations can be found in 'The road user and the law'.


Failure to comply with the other rules of the Code will not, in itself, cause a person to be prosecuted. The Highway Code may be used in evidence in any court proceedings under the Traffic Acts (see 'The road user and the law') to establish liability. This includes rules which use advisory wording such as ‘should/should not’ or ‘do/do not’.
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Surely in that scenario though you must have been over in the middle of the road (positioning) before making the manoeuvre though?
 
I believe he was overtaking because afterwards he carried on straight.

Turning right isn't my usual way, but I had decided a good 15m before the junction that that is what I was going to do and since the traffic was fairly slow I had plenty of time to move my car closer to the dashed line in the middle of the road and check mirrors etc.

I remember the front wheels almost being on the give way lines of the side road when I felt/heard the impact on the side.
 
Danger Phoenix said:
I believe he was overtaking because afterwards he carried on straight.

Turning right isn't my usual way, but I had decided a good 15m before the junction that that is what I was going to do and since the traffic was fairly slow I had plenty of time to move my car closer to the dashed line in the middle of the road and check mirrors etc.

I remember the front wheels almost being on the give way lines of the side road when I felt/heard the impact on the side.
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Your accident sounds identical to mine, barring the fact I had come to a complete stop before turning.

Linky: http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18314787

Liability has still not been fully decided, but based on the positioning of the damage on my car (right at the back), and a few other factors, last time I spoke to my insurance co they said they felt it should go completely in my favour, but worst case scenario 20/80.

If you want more details, feel free to trust message me, and I'll be updating the thread once I get a result, in case you want to subscribe to find out how it went :)

Edit: Insurance co is Bell, so same company as you :)
 
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Hey mate, just an update in case your claim is still going. Mine has now been pretty much resolved - no liability in my case, haven't lost my no claims. Check my thread for more details.

Hopefully you get a similar outcome!
 
Haggisman said:
Hey mate, just an update in case your claim is still going. Mine has now been pretty much resolved - no liability in my case, haven't lost my no claims. Check my thread for more details.

Hopefully you get a similar outcome!
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Thanks for the update. The TP has not claimed yet or even informed his insurer, and I haven't had a chance to get a quote to fix the damage. If the damage is going to cost £200+ then I might claim but if it is below that then I probably won't bother :)

Anyone know how much a door skin costs on a Toyota Corolla 2005 model?
 
Had one like this about 6 years ago, even though the guy had no license/insurance it was, from a civil point of view, still deemed as my fault. From a Criminal point of view the biker was banged to rights.

This thing is still being dealt with today and ended up really messy, basically you bloked his lane, as did I, and you will be held responsible.

Sorry just re read and he hit you drivers side? If that is the case then it sounds to me like you will be ok.
 
Vince said:
Had one like this about 6 years ago, even though the guy had no license/insurance it was, from a civil point of view, still deemed as my fault. From a Criminal point of view the biker was banged to rights.

This thing is still being dealt with today and ended up really messy, basically you bloked his lane, as did I, and you will be held responsible.

Sorry just re read and he hit you drivers side? If that is the case then it sounds to me like you will be ok.
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Yeah, he hit the divers side rear passenger door. He was also overtaking traffic in the oncoming lane and would have been in the line specifically marked for those turning right.
 
Danger Phoenix said:
Yeah, he hit the divers side rear passenger door. He was also overtaking traffic in the oncoming lane and would have been in the line specifically marked for those turning right.
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In that case biker is a numpty :) don't know why but first off I read that he was oncoming in the oncoming lane... if that makes sense.
 
From a bikers perspective, I see a lot of other bikers doing this. Personally it is a massive bug bear of mine that other bikers overtake opposite junctions. I'd say you weren't at fault by the sound of it. If he was able to ride on he can't have been going fast.
 
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