advertising of laptop resolution vs scaling

throwaway4372 · 26 Dec 2023 at 13:49

I bought a laptop in the black friday sale, it had a broken screen so ended up going back, but the experience was interesting...

The laptop was advertised as 1920x1200, 13", and whilst that's technically true, it shipped with 150% scaling. 150% scaling was a reasonable choice, any smaller and stuff was tiny, but it means the resolution in reality wasn't 1920x1200, it was 1568x980. Consequently various websites and apps didn't work well. So the laptop wasn't fit for purpose and would have gone back anyway.

The point of this thread is to see what other people think about the advertising aspect of it. They advertise 1920x1200 but what you get is 1568x980. Do you think this situation is OK to continue or should it be changed and if so how?

paradigm · 26 Dec 2023 at 16:04

IMO it’s absolutely OK. I use a Dell XPS 13 4k at 125% scaling, so personal preference and eyesight play a massive part. 150% on 1200p must be massive!

A higher resolution panel also allows for better scaling without so much aliasing. I use a Surface Go 2 (1800x1200) for DOSBox gaming because it has enough pixels to allow for DOS resolutions between 320x200 and 800x600 (anywhere from 5:1 pixel ratio to 2:1 pixel ratio).

PaulM · 26 Dec 2023 at 16:52

As long as the resolution advertised is achievable if you choose to set it to 100% scaling (regardless of what the default is) imo it's absolutely fine to advertise this way and as I would expect. They're advertising a 1920x1200 screen, it is still a 1920x1200 screen, they've just set the default scaling to what they feel the average user would be comfortable using on a 13" screen. If two manufacturers sold the exact same 1920x1200 screen, one set the default scale to 125% and one set it to 150% should they advertise the resolution differently?

throwaway4372 · 26 Dec 2023 at 20:30

PaulM said:
If two manufacturers sold the exact same 1920x1200 screen, one set the default scale to 125% and one set it to 150% should they advertise the resolution differently?

Yeah I was thinking of something like this:

Resolution: 1920x1200 (1568x980 at recommended scaling of 150%)

The point being to help the customer understand what they're buying.

PaulM · 26 Dec 2023 at 21:15

throwaway4372 said:
Yeah I was thinking of something like this:

Resolution: 1920x1200 (1568x980 at recommended scaling of 150%)

The point being to help the customer understand what they're buying.

Are you meaning purely for when it's on display in a retail shop (in person / not online), so if somebody uses it in the shop they know it's not showing at 100% scale?

throwaway4372 · 26 Dec 2023 at 21:21

PaulM said:
Are you meaning purely for when it's on display in a retail shop (in person / not online), so if somebody uses it in the shop they know it's not showing at 100% scale?

I was thinking about online, but the same applies to a shop, so: wherever the resolution is advertised.

PaulM · 26 Dec 2023 at 21:24

throwaway4372 said:
I was thinking about online, but the same applies to a shop, so: wherever the resolution is advertised.

But why is it relevant what the scaling is set to if you buy online? You want a 1920x1200 13" laptop, you buy one and if it comes with the scaling set to 125% you set it to 100%... you got what you wanted/bought?

Zefan · 26 Dec 2023 at 21:40

Why are we confusing scaling and resolution here? It's just the display size of gui elements that is scaled, you don't lose any DPI really. Yeah sure a 100x100 image will be "half res"... But most GUI elements aren't fixed like this. Where are you getting this 1568*980 from?

andy_mk3 · 26 Dec 2023 at 21:56

Zefan said:
Why are we confusing scaling and resolution here? It's just the display size of gui elements that is scaled, you don't lose any DPI really. Yeah sure a 100x100 image will be "half res"... But most GUI elements aren't fixed like this. Where are you getting this 1568*980 from?

I was trying to figure out if it was just me thinking this lol.

Pants · 26 Dec 2023 at 21:59

Scaling doesn't matter as it takes a few seconds to change. The resolution is the resolution.

This thread makes no sense.

throwaway4372 · 26 Dec 2023 at 22:30

Using your laptop with scaling, or just apply scaling in windows, then go to a website like this: https://www.whatismyscreenresolution.org/

You obviously notice when you apply scaling that everything gets bigger, less stuff fits on the screen. Thus the resolution advertised is not the resolution you are using.

Zefan · 26 Dec 2023 at 22:36

No, the resolution isn't changing at all, it's just the OS telling apps to present things at a larger size by pretending it's at a lower res. It's telling me my phone is 393 x 873 for the love of Toblerone.

throwaway4372 · 26 Dec 2023 at 22:37

Seriously? You want to nit-pick about that and derail the thread? Go touch grass.

Zefan · 26 Dec 2023 at 22:39

I'm not derailing anything, I'm telling you why the idea of getting less res than you've paid for because windows decided you should use scaling (which you 150% should) is not sound.

:edit: edited the % because it's funnier.

:edit2: I think changing the browser zoom level (the exact same thing this scaling is doing, really) in the opposite direction to the scaling should solve the webpages not working issue.

Bluecube · 26 Dec 2023 at 22:57

throwaway4372 said:
The point of this thread is to see what other people think about the advertising aspect of it. They advertise 1920x1200 but what you get is 1568x980. Do you think this situation is OK to continue or should it be changed and if so how?

The screen resolution is 1920x1200 pixels. That‘s what you get and that’s what is advertised. Screen scaling is a software issue and is solely dependent on the user. You’re not being short changed in any way whatsoever as your screen will always be displaying 1920x1200.

throwaway4372 · 26 Dec 2023 at 23:08

Zefan said:
:edit2: I think changing the browser zoom level (the exact same thing this scaling is doing, really) in the opposite direction to the scaling should solve the webpages not working issue.

Yeah of course, browser zoom out would make stuff smaller and make it fit on the screen. Only applies to web browsers though, this thread is about all apps. The problem though is that the content in the web browser is too small, hence scaling it to begin with.

This isn't about eyesight, or preference, or whether scaling is good or bad, or about getting what you paid for.

For example I'm tech-savvy but generally don't use laptops so didn't know if the laptop would require 125% or 150%, easy to solve by just writing the recommended scaling on the spec sheet.

My laptop was even worse because they advertise 16:10 as being great so you can see more stuff on the screen! Of course it's better than the equivalently scaled 16:9, which is how they get away with the marketing, but the laptop is absolutely not good for people who want more stuff on the screen. If the advertising was clear the consumer would know to choose a laptop with more inches, and be able to compare models to choose a model with the combination of resolution and recommended scaling that works best for them.

Phones are different because people understand that if a website is designed for phones it'll work, otherwise it won't. I half expected the websites on the laptop to go into phone mode but they didn't because the resolution wasn't small enough to trigger that. So it was some awkward middle ground that just wasn't designed for.

Bluecube said:
The screen resolution is 1920x1200 pixels. That‘s what you get and that’s what is advertised. Screen scaling is a software issue and is solely dependent on the user. You’re not being short changed in any way whatsoever as your screen will always be displaying 1920x1200.

Thread isn't about the monitor hardware, everyone understands that isn't changing. Thread isn't about getting short-changed.
Screen scaling is not a software issue, it's a judgement based on average human ability vs the dpi. They recommend certain scaling level for a monitor based on knowing the range of average human ability. This thread isn't about the rights or wrongs of that, only the absence of communicating it.

Zefan · 26 Dec 2023 at 23:23

Yeah that's fair enough, sounds like 13" Windows laptops aren't for you, and I think the resolution of the screen and scaling/1568x980 count is sort of irrelevant. I don't have find my work (customer) 13" HP laptop much fun, but I use it almost always docked to 24" monitors (125% scaling...). My other 14" HP is much better, perhaps that additional inch pushes it over some milestone of acceptability? Proper laptop connoisseurs are sure to know.

Bluecube · 26 Dec 2023 at 23:30

throwaway4372 said:
Thread isn't about the monitor hardware, everyone understands that isn't changing. Thread isn't about getting short-changed.
Screen scaling is not a software issue, it's a judgement based on average human ability vs the dpi. They recommend certain scaling level for a monitor based on knowing the range of average human ability. This thread isn't about the rights or wrongs of that, only the absence of communicating it.

Nah. You’re overthinking it. Hi res screens have been around for yonks on Apple laptops and iPads (Retina screens) and nobody has been whining about native resolutions and scaling

throwaway4372 · 27 Dec 2023 at 00:00

Bluecube said:
Hi res screens have been around for yonks on Apple laptops and iPads (Retina screens) and nobody has been whining about native resolutions and scaling

Had a quick google out of curiosity, tons of people asking for help with apple scaling, and some complaining about it. Seems to me like the mac folks have their fair share of scaling issues, they just congregate on mac forums so the rest of the world doesn't hear about it.

Plenty of complaints and asking for help on Windows too ofc.

Bluecube · 27 Dec 2023 at 00:55

Windows has historically had issues with hidpi displays hence the complaints. Issues with Apple computers (as opposed to iDevices) may rear their heads when connecting external displays.

None of which is relevant to your complaint. No one is being misled as you say. The hardware resolution has been delivered as noted by the marketing. The software scaling is chosen by the user. Why should the manufacturers have to state the display is some strange software derived scaled resolution when that’s factually inaccurate?