Are there any people here who make music on their Macs?

[Cromulent]

When I was in school about 20 years ago I did a GCSE in Music and part of it revolved around composing your own music using Cubase. I basically forgot about it up until a couple of months ago but since then I've really got a desire to start making music again. The problem is I'm so out of touch with the whole music scene I don't know which DAW to use. I think I've settled on either Apple Logic Pro or FL Studio with me pointing more towards FL Studio rather than Logic Pro.

I need to get a MIDI keyboard and from looking around the M-Audio Oxygen Pro 49 key seems like the best option for me. Does anyone have any advice for someone getting back into this after a long break?

 

[Cromulent]

Id take a look at Ableton, its really intuitive and pretty easy to pick up IMO. But having said that all of the DAW's do the same thing, just their workflows are slightly different, so go with the one you think you know your way around most, and looks the easier to you to use.

I used to have an M-Audio Oxygen Pro and an M-Audio Axiom too but the slightly bigger version (with more keys). Have you considered what audio interface and speakers you are going to use with it? If you are producing mostly electronic musics you will be fine with a simple interface just for the speakers but if you are going to want to connect some keyboards and guitars and other instruments you will need something a bit more robust.

I used to produce electronic music mostly dancey, trancey stuff and got on fine with a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2.

Thank you for your reply.

I did watch a few videos about Ableton Live and it looked good but the top end package is like £500 and then you need to update every year or two whereas with Logic Pro and FL Studio you don't have to worry about paying for updates.

As for the audio interface, I was just going to use my AirPod Pros because I live in a shared house and I don't want to bother the other residents. I won't be recording live audio like instruments and vocals at the start though so I thought I'd be alright to start with?

 

[Cromulent]

Logic is great and well worth the money (I'm a few years out of touch, but always loved it for making music - Pro Tools for actual recording I found better though).

I'd look at a USB interface with some dedicated headphones, your Airpod Pros just won't cut it.

Do you have any suggestions for an audio interface and headphones? I can't afford to get something mega-expensive though.

 

[Cromulent]

Would a Focusrite Scarlett Solo be OK?

 

[Cromulent]

Yup that would be absolutely fine to start with, they usually come with a copy of Ableton Lite so you could get a feel for that if you wanted too.

Awesome. Thank you.

 

[Cromulent]

I'm a pro tools user but if I was starting my music journey today I would absolutely go with Logic. By far the best bang for your buck.

As for getting back into it? It's a long old process, it takes a very very long time to train your ears and there are no shortcuts unfortunately. Just enjoy the process and it'll come!

Thank you! I'm really quite excited .

 

[Cromulent]

Logic has a 90 day trial as well just in case you weren’t already aware.

Oh, really? How do you access that?

 

[Cromulent]

If by chance your looking at making electronic music I highly suggest looking at Bitwig Studio it just a much better version of Ableton, I've tried every DAW over the last 15 years and hands down Bitwig is the end game. On MacOS Bitwig is the most stable DAW I've tried, you have endless ways to create sounds using their built in plugins. Work flow is great, projects load faster than any DAW and it does not crash the whole program when 3rd party plugins crash due to the plugin sandbox. You can also run ARM64 Native and x64 plugins in the same project with out needing rosetta, If you try the trial wait till July as they have a summer sale coming up where it is normally $100 off the retail price, or you can rent to own from splice for $15.99 per month.

Logic is also a good choice in terms of Value, I feel the workflow is not the greatest these days comapred to a modern daw like bitwig unless your primary goal is recording but it is still capable of producing great music and the built in plugins are very good.

Thank you. I'm actually planning on making music like ambient black metal and blackwave so yeah it'll be electronics based. I'll have a look at Bitwig.

 

[Cromulent]

Logic Pro - Free Trial

Logic Pro is a complete professional recording studio on the Mac. Try it now with a free 90-day trial.

www.apple.com

You have to access it from a Mac.

Cool. I'll wait for a little bit because I'm waiting to have enough money for my keyboard but then I'll sign up. Thank you.

 

[Cromulent]

Yup that would be absolutely fine to start with, they usually come with a copy of Ableton Lite so you could get a feel for that if you wanted too.

I've been looking into decent headphones to use and found a pair that has excellent reviews, but the problem is they have an impedance of 250 Ohms which I don't think the Solo can power. Do you know of another audio interface that can handle 250 Ohm headphones?

 

[Cromulent]

I believe most Focusrite USB powered Scarlett's tend to have a 200ohm limit on headphones, whilst the mains powered variants (8i6>) have a 250ohm limit.
You're likely to be ok, certainly my DT770's and DT250 250ohm Beyer's are alright on most interfaces although a decent headphone amp does make a massive difference. But i typically stick to my 80ohm Beyer's as i find them a lot more useful day-to-day as most things will drive them.

Thank you. I did some research and found this DAC that looks good: Topping E30. Do you think that would be a good choice? Since I only need to power headphones and I'm not going to record vocals or instruments, I thought it might be a suitable configuration.

 

[Cromulent]

If that DAC has ASIO drivers then maybe it'll work as a decent enough audio interface with low-ish latency. But you'll be far better off sticking to a dedicated audio interface that's geared towards music production plus you have i/o options.

I see.

Personally if money is tight to begin with then worry about the interface and your headphones/monitors. A cheap DAW will suffice for time being and you can change when money allows. Likewise with a midi interface/"set of keys", most DAWs have a midi-roll and/or allow you to use your keyboard so i wouldn't worry about purchasing that at this point nor other outboard gear.

And remember, second-hand is always an option so get looking through eBay/Gumtree/FB Marketplace etc.

OK, I'll concentrate on the headphones and audio interface. That works out well as I'm always listening to music anyway, so an improvement there would be significant.

Out of interest what Mac are you using and what's your rough budget?

I'll be using a Mac Studio. The budget is fluid, but this is what I was thinking:

Headphones - same or lower than the AirPods Max
DAC / Audio interface - £150ish?
Midi Controller - £150ish
Starting with Garageband and then upgrading to Logic if required
Thunderbolt 4 Hub - £220

Thank you for your help.

 

[Cromulent]

For headphones take a look at the HD560s, very neutral and flat sound which is great for music production and super cheap atm around £139. Some say they are better then the HD600 in terms of neutrality, HD600 is highly regarded by many top mastering engineers so a great choice IMO. They released the newer HD400 Pro which is the exact same drivers just different cable, check the review on youtube for those and see how they compare to high end models like Audeze which are much more expensive. I have a pair and was able to drive them okay from a cheap Focusrite Saffire Pro 24 (relic from 2007), Recently I have been using them from my M1 MacBook Air's headphone output which really tranformed the sound of these headphones and drives them louder than I need so any recent budget interface should be able to drive them fine. There is also some corrective EQ settings available in the review video which I use, I find it improves things even more and ever since my mixdowns always translate on my studio monitors with not much effort in the mixing process. Goodherts CanOpener is a must have for using headphones, this re creates the crosstalk you get from listening to a stereo pair of monitors. I don't always mix with can opener but it does make things sound more natural. My only hate for the Hd560s is the awful long cable they include which always gets tangled, you will want to get a cheap replacement cable from the rainforest site for £10.

For interface I recommend the Motu M2, it is £174 so slightly more expensive than a focusrite but much better AD/DA converters/clocking and the heaphone output is meant to be very good. Motu is fairly stable on MacOS with their drivers, that will be my next purchase for my new M1 setup.

If your not recording any analog inputs you can honetly get away with using Apples Core Audio driver and the Mac Studio headphone output, I had the M1 MBP16 which has the same output and it was very good in terms of power and sound quality. Latency may be slightly higher but with the M1 you can keep the Buffer size very low compared to Intel CPU, before I would have to run 512-1024 but now I can run a whole project start to end at 256. Increasing the buffer on M1 does not make the biggest difference, sometimes the CPU performs better at lower buffers depending on your DAW. The input latency with MIDI up to 256 Buffer size in not noticable to me on my Air, so I'd say give it a try before you buy an interface.

So, just so I understand I can skip the interface to start with and just use the Mac Studio audio output? If that is the case I'd only need to buy some headphones and a cheap MIDI controller to get underway.

I'll keep the Motu M2 in mind if I get to a stage where I need it. I'm only going to be doing simple stuff to start with.

 

[Cromulent]

Yea mate you will be fine with the built in to start for sure, I've been using mine on the MacBook Air M1 for a few weeks now while waiting to get a new interface and I know the M1 Max/Studio has an even slightly better high impedance output as I had the M1 Pro 16 for a few weeks.

Thank you.

I just found out about Logic Pro Remote on the iPad. I don't know how I missed it, so instead of buying a MIDI keyboard, I will use my iPad Pro along with Logic Pro and Logic Pro Remote until I have saved up enough money to buy a good quality MIDO controller.

Edit: Wow, Logic Remote even supports Garageband, so I don't need to spend any money to try things out and see how much I enjoy everything.