AV receiver for 2.0? Or another solution?

Scam

Scam

Scam

Soldato
Joined
20 Oct 2002
Posts
18,628
Location
London
Hey guys. So I've owned my old Marantz hifi amp for a good while now, I'm using it with my Panasonic GT60 with optical out and a pair of old Gale floorstanders that have been there with the Marantz since the beginning (probably 10-15 years!). As far as my usage goes it's fine. I live in a little London flat with the sofa's back to the kitchen area, I'm never going to upgrade to surrounds.

That said, for the first time in my life I'm getting a bonus at work (woohoo!) and rather than squirrel it away I'd rather spend it on upgrading the amp. My issue is that AV receivers are notoriously bad for stereo/music, right? Most of my reasoning behind upgrading to be honest is making it easier to switch inputs. I'm quite sold on getting a Harmony remote too, to shut the other half up :p I've currently filled up all 4 hdmi inputs on the TV, and have a three-way splitter on one which is very tedious. I also have to get up to change the amp from TV optical audio, to listen to music (line-in via Chromecast). In all seriousness, the Marantz keeps flaking out, audio popping, losing one channel as well.

Any suggestions? Marantz again has been suggested as the best AV receivers for musicality so I've been looking at those, but does such a thing exist as a stereo AV receiver? :confused:

As far as tech goes I've obviously no need for Atmos, DTS:X etc. Also not bothered about 4k right now. I can see me keeping my GT60 for a good many years. 3D obviously not.

Any thoughts? Perhaps an alternative is a receiver with enough inputs then an additional stereo receiver (preamp? :confused: )

Thanks for any thoughts! :)
 
Going for a AVR will do the job, and be a better option if you have movie (DD/DTS) audio sources, and want to route HDMI (video/audio) through the AVR. Pound for pound a AVR will have less power and sound quality than a stereo amplifier.

You could get a AVR + stereo amp but it just makes it more complicated, and expensive. And you want the stereo amp to have direct power amplifier inputs, only the better ones have that.

Send all video/audio from your sources into the AVR, then HDMI out from your AVR into your plasma.

When you setup the AVR (it'll be automatic anyway) you only have L/R speakers. And it'll downmix all audio to stereo.
I use a AVR for the PC system, two computers (DVI-HDMI) + optical or coaxial into the AVR. Works pretty well.

If you're not fussed with a latest box, you could buy a second hand or older model on sale. I use a Yamaha 671.

If you want a stereo pre-amp plus AVR (or AV pre-amp) and power amplifiers that's going to be several boxes. I did that a few years ago (and biamping home theatre speakers) but it was a pain in the arse, so I just just went with AV pre-amp, with a 3 channel and 4 channel amps. Then DAC,stereo pre-power, two 2 channel poweramps, and a bass management device. Subs in both.

edit also only the mid/higher end models (roughly £600+) have pre-outs for the channels.
 
Last edited:
Sorry, I think I missed out the main question in my original post :p Going from my old Marantz stereo amp to an AVR would I notice any difference in sound quality on music? Bearing in mind I am using a Chromecast..

I think a combo wouldn't work for the reasons stated above. Plus I don't think I actually have space for two boxes in my TV unit :o
 
Probably will notice difference, if you get a Marantz AVR should be closer than just buying a cheaper AVR. If Chromecast is low bitrate then it won't make it sound better.

Marantz AVR's are quite expensive maybe get one that is 1 gen old on sale
 
is music quality still a priority eg. flac streaming sites / cd rips ?
if so are you better getting a new stereo amp (is it just the optical in on your current one that has issues) and a schiit or Cambridge Audio dac to feed from the optical of tv out, or from a computer/usb.

You can just feed the stereo (already mixed down) feed form the av source(blu ray say) through the tv
I am sceptical about capability of an avr to mix down a multi-channel source, preserving clarity of voice/center channel.

(I am in a similar situation and, until persuaded differently that is the path I am considering a good quality dac and continuing with current Cambridge amp. I also use a chromcast with some high 320kb/s, 192Kb/s aac)

There have been some threads in sound scetion on similar requirements.
 
Nah that's too much hassle, DAC, extra cables, then routing video & audio. HDMI does both. Need to set up macros, a learning remote does that but you may as well just go for AVR which'll do it when switching HDMI.

You'll need more cables as well (video + audio)

AVR's downmix perfectly, there's nothing to worry about.

Plus the AVR's have native DD/DTS and HD decoding, your DAC won't have that, so you'd need to send it PCM. Plus AVR's have room correction, bass management, and the aforementioned HDMI video switching.

If your system was only stereo, like tape, vinyl, CD, radio then sure get a DAC/Stereo amp, but once you go HDMI/AV/multichannel sources even when you have just stereo speakers, get a AVR.

I do have AVR for PC rig, pre-power stereo only system in the stereo, plus full on pre-power 7.1 system.
 
hornetstinger said:
AVR's downmix perfectly, there's nothing to worry about.
Click to expand...

about downmix - don't most sources include downmixed anyway (blu-ray/freeview/sat) but even if they do not apparently

Many of the different Dolby and DTS surround formats (if not all) can carry metadata that instructs the decoder how to downmix to stereo, if the audio engineer provides that data. If the audio engineer provides that data, I'd imagine that the downmix wouldn't vary much, if at all, across different receivers and processors. But, if that metadata isn't provided, I'd imagine that different receivers and processors may use different algorithms to create a downmix.
BUT
I just use an AVR with audyssey for my 2.0 system. I find dynamic volume is a good feature to have as it helps highlight the dialog frequencies and push special effects in the background. I think its a must have for running a phantom center channel.
Click to expand...

also quickly saw an article suggesting trend for more channels and features has lead to poorer quality
Trading Amplifier Quality for Features in AV Receivers - A New Trend?
maybe that has been redresssed.

the Linn Sneaky DSM and Majik DSM have integrated amps (referenced in first articlce) look good but expensive products addressing those of us who want 2.0
 
yeah I do agree AVR do make comprimises in component, sound quality. But unless you can find a stereo integrated amplifier, with HDMI inputs (video and audio support) DD/DTS/HD audio decoding, bass management- then really not much choice in having one amp in a AV system, for stereo speakers.

My PC audio system is just stereo speakers, no subwoofer, decent speakers. But with having consoles, PC's as sources it's so much simpler. Previously I had a stereo integrated amplifier, poweramps, and a old av pre-amp. And this is the third audio system. Was far too complex having to switch input on HDMI switch, stereo amp, av pre-amp, switch on poweramp etc.

Also many video sources don't have analogue inputs, and if you do use those analogue inputs then quality of that could be pretty low (say onboard audio from PC, cheap BD player etc)

Power output with all speakers connected and being driven on a AVR is pretty low, however with just stereo speakers you'll have far more power.

This is the difference with a Yamaha 2000 series

2 channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 169.7 watts

7 channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 42.3 watts
 
Seen the date on that article? It's pretty old... It was the case that features started to overtake sound quality but I'd argue this is less of an issue these days. The best 'cheap' solution (without going to dedicated processors) if HDMI is your bag is still to go with an AVR with pre outs and then use separate power amps to reduce the load asked of the AVR. In my own system I have power amps for the L/R/Ls/Rs channels and my AVR only runs the centre channel.
 
Lowe said:
Seen the date on that article? It's pretty old... It was the case that features started to overtake sound quality but I'd argue this is less of an issue these days. The best 'cheap' solution (without going to dedicated processors) if HDMI is your bag is still to go with an AVR with pre outs and then use separate power amps to reduce the load asked of the AVR. In my own system I have power amps for the L/R/Ls/Rs channels and my AVR only runs the centre channel.
Click to expand...

I'd say it's more. Smaller PSU's, more channels in AVR's 9 channels (upto 11 for atmos) AV amps from a few years ago had proper power output, like 100W+ per channel.

Some do but you need to shop around for them, Pioneer and Denon seem to hold up well. Marantz aren't too bad either.
 
Scam, I assume you do not need need analogue/phono input ?

Hornetstinger : I had not realised the un-needed channel power amps(transistors) can be re-attributed to the 2.0/stereo outputs, if that is all you need.

For downmixing : it seems a complex task nonetheless to merge the surround channels into two without making something un-natural, and, taking an example hard_days_night_blu-ray
LPCM Audio English 2304 kbps 2.0 / 48 kHz / 2304 kbps / 24-bit
DTS-HD Master Audio English 3987 kbps 5.1 / 48 kHz / 3987 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Click to expand...

I think I would probably want to use the LPCM in a 2.0 setup
Ok in that case original material was, well, mono; but even for a modern film with a 5.1 sound-track the already down-mixed 2.0 maybe better than what the av could produce
 
Downming works perfectly fine.

Just select 2 channel mode (bass managment if you have a sub) or pure direct (no bass management no room correction) , or just disable all the other speakers.
 
Yeah. I think the AVR solution fits the bill really. As much as I love my music, the main reason to upgrade (besides the faults with my current amp) is to make everything easier. Getting an AVR+pre-amp/DAC/whatever combo isn't going to do that. On top of that -- all of my music is streamed from GPM via Chromecast (320kbs I believe) or TuneinRadio so I can't imagine I would really notice any huge flaws with the AV's music playback, it's more of a case of whether or not I can find a sound signature that I like. Hmn. Might have to get myself down to my local RS to try some out.

As far as downmix goes, surely if a Bluray offers a 2.0 mix I just choose that and always ensure (obviously) my AVR is set to 2.0 :confused:

So, what's the best AVR out there for 2.0 performance and musicality? Budget £400 I reckon.
 
For your budget, probably Marantz, but that would be a slimline model, which should be fine as since you're only using two speakers you don't need AVR designed for driving 5/6.
Marantz NR1506
 
Interesting you recommend the NR1506 when the NR1607 is only £419. Perfectly acceptable at my budget and has 7 hdmi inputs. The NR1506 only has 5 which would mean I'd need a splitter from the get-go. Reviews look good for both of them though. I wonder if there are any other comparable for music performance.
 
hornetstinger said:
NR1506 is going for far less than £419 though.
Click to expand...
Sure. But at the end of the day the number two reason for upgrading is to make my life easier. I have 6 devices to plug in currently, once I buy this I'd probably want to add a Chromecast which makes 7! Having to use a splitter still would do my nut :(
 
Since you have so many sources I'd probably go for a regular height AVR. Thing is then looking at higher end AVR's which means paying for lots of amps and not using them.

But at least you could use bi-amping function with AVR's if they had it.
 
Seems a bit clunky, generally neater just to have one cable from AVR to TV. With all devices plugged into your AVR.

Would make sense if you have a USB TV stick which is stuck to the back of the TV, a short HDMI cable or plugged straight into a HDMI port, so that audio is sent to AVR on the single AVR-TV cable.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom