Awfull Latency on BT Infinity / though BQM / pingtest.net say otherwise? :/

zeegy · 14 Mar 2013 at 21:37

Hi all,

I hope you can all help, I’m having loads of issues with the quality of my internet connection. And I really have no certain idea why. I think I know, but a second pair of ears would be a great help
I am with BT infinity, my HG612 is in my master socket, from there I connect to an asus n56u, and from there cat6 to my pc.

I was having interleaving issues on my line, I believe this has been resolved, my pings have dropped and my latency (even when on a BQM) seems very respectable.
I am running ping tests on pingtest.net and similar, and get an average of 20ms with <2ms Jitter, Which I think is acceptable.

That said, I do notice issues with my gaming, and its really, really bad. And has been for quite a few days now. I namely play counterstrike. When I see a list of servers (including my favourite server) it shows a latency or approx. 25-30ms, as soon as I actually join the server and play, it rockets! 200ms easily, if not more.

This seems to happen on quite a few servers, some seem fine, but the majority have very, very high pings.

I am now questing how some pings (like my BQM and pingtest.net) can yield such good results compared to real life statistics. I have included some pings and tracerts to bbc, google dns and my server. All are rather poor.

BQM Stats (Part 1)

Rebooted this evening,

Pinging www.bbc.net.uk [212.58.246.95] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 212.58.246.95: bytes=32 time=134ms TTL=51
Reply from 212.58.246.95: bytes=32 time=136ms TTL=51
Reply from 212.58.246.95: bytes=32 time=141ms TTL=51
Reply from 212.58.246.95: bytes=32 time=140ms TTL=51

Ping statistics for 212.58.246.95:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 134ms, Maximum = 141ms, Average = 137ms

Tracing route to www.bbc.net.uk [212.58.246.95]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms www.asusnetwork.net [192.168.1.254]
2 6 ms 6 ms 6 ms 217.32.141.7
3 7 ms 7 ms 13 ms 217.32.140.222
4 12 ms 12 ms 11 ms 217.41.216.154
5 12 ms 11 ms 11 ms 31.55.164.43
6 12 ms 11 ms 11 ms 31.55.164.107
7 128 ms 129 ms 129 ms acc1-10GigE-0-3-0-3.bm.21cn-ipp.bt.net [109.159.248.114]
8 143 ms 141 ms 137 ms core1-te0-3-0-15.ealing.ukcore.bt.net [109.159.248.28]
9 16 ms 16 ms 16 ms peer1-xe3-2-0.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [109.159.254.221]
10 19 ms 18 ms 18 ms 194.74.65.42
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 153 ms 157 ms 155 ms ae0.er01.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [132.185.254.93]
13 152 ms 147 ms 144 ms 132.185.255.165
14 144 ms 145 ms 149 ms bbc-vip016.cwwtf.bbc.co.uk [212.58.246.95]

Trace complete.

Pinging 8.8.8.8 with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 8.8.8.8: bytes=32 time=161ms TTL=44
Reply from 8.8.8.8: bytes=32 time=153ms TTL=44
Reply from 8.8.8.8: bytes=32 time=157ms TTL=44
Reply from 8.8.8.8: bytes=32 time=155ms TTL=44

Ping statistics for 8.8.8.8:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 153ms, Maximum = 161ms, Average = 156ms

Tracing route to google-public-dns-a.google.com [8.8.8.8]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms www.asusnetwork.net [192.168.1.254]
2 7 ms 6 ms 6 ms 217.32.141.7
3 10 ms 9 ms 8 ms 217.32.140.206
4 132 ms 133 ms 133 ms 213.120.161.98
5 11 ms 11 ms 11 ms 31.55.164.43
6 11 ms 10 ms 11 ms 31.55.164.107
7 127 ms 128 ms 124 ms acc1-10GigE-0-3-0-5.bm.21cn-ipp.bt.net [109.159.248.116]
8 151 ms 156 ms 158 ms core1-te0-15-0-15.ealing.ukcore.bt.net [109.159.248.40]
9 145 ms 143 ms 138 ms peer1-xe4-0-0.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [213.121.193.144]
10 144 ms 144 ms 150 ms 195.99.126.113
11 15 ms 15 ms 15 ms 209.85.252.186
12 15 ms 15 ms 15 ms 209.85.253.90
13 144 ms 138 ms 138 ms 209.85.240.28
14 25 ms 25 ms 25 ms 216.239.49.36
15 * * * Request timed out.
16 150 ms 151 ms 150 ms google-public-dns-a.google.com [8.8.8.8]

Trace complete.

Pinging 109.70.148.24 with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 109.70.148.24: bytes=32 time=147ms TTL=53
Reply from 109.70.148.24: bytes=32 time=153ms TTL=53
Reply from 109.70.148.24: bytes=32 time=142ms TTL=53
Reply from 109.70.148.24: bytes=32 time=131ms TTL=53

Ping statistics for 109.70.148.24:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 131ms, Maximum = 153ms, Average = 143ms

Tracing route to 24-148-109.gamingdeluxe.co.uk [109.70.148.24]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms www.asusnetwork.net [192.168.1.254]
2 6 ms 6 ms 6 ms 217.32.141.7
3 6 ms 6 ms 6 ms 217.32.140.222
4 12 ms 12 ms 12 ms 213.120.161.34
5 12 ms 11 ms 11 ms 31.55.164.43
6 11 ms 12 ms 12 ms 31.55.164.107
7 144 ms 139 ms 136 ms acc1-10GigE-0-7-0-4.bm.21cn-ipp.bt.net [109.159.248.70]
8 136 ms 134 ms 131 ms core2-te-0-13-0-4.ilford.ukcore.bt.net [109.159.248.10]
9 25 ms 23 ms 23 ms peer3te0-1-3-0.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [109.159.254.58]
10 17 ms 17 ms 16 ms linx.bandwidth.co.uk [195.66.225.123]
11 21 ms 19 ms 19 ms rt1.chelt.gamingdeluxe.co.uk [217.146.94.10]
12 147 ms 142 ms 140 ms 24-148-109.gamingdeluxe.co.uk [109.70.148.24]

Trace complete.

Looking at these stats, where are your views please guys?

zeegy · 14 Mar 2013 at 23:32

and yet, this time of night (23:30) a different story all together.

C:\Users\ZeeGy>ping www.bbc.co.uk

Pinging www.bbc.net.uk [212.58.246.93] with 32 byte
Reply from 212.58.246.93: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=51
Reply from 212.58.246.93: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=51
Reply from 212.58.246.93: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=51
Reply from 212.58.246.93: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=51

Ping statistics for 212.58.246.93:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% l
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 17ms, Maximum = 18ms, Average = 17ms

tipsy · 15 Mar 2013 at 05:15

what is the server your connecting to? or shall I say who's server & hopefully not mine

http://www.gametracker.com/server_info/81.19.212.56:27015/
That my server which is still very popular.

The is Team old school, TNB & ambrosia(non steam)

There have been some nasty issues as of late with regards to the linux update with steam & how they have made a sort of a mess of cs, if the issues continue contact BT and get them to test teh line as them pings are not acceptable (interleaving may need to be enabled or router check)

Just seen the below post, seems like capacity issues so its not unlimited at all & traffic management is on... sky fibre maybe your next option

KIA · 15 Mar 2013 at 11:16

Run WinMTR against the game server while you're playing.

It is probably a capacity issue if it is fine off-peak.

zeegy · 15 Mar 2013 at 12:54

When you say a capacity issue, are you refering to the server? (other users on at the same time have far better pings than me that are usually the same) also pings to say other sites, such as bbc and google DNS exceed 150ms

OR capacity on my ISP's infrastructure?

not heard of winmtr before, will need to have a look andf report back my findings.

KIA, as always. thank you for your support.

KIA · 15 Mar 2013 at 13:25

BT Wholesale or BT Retail capacity issue.

Is downstream throughput affected?

zeegy · 15 Mar 2013 at 16:05

KIA said:
BT Wholesale or BT Retail capacity issue.

Is downstream throughput affected?

What would be the best way to confirm this KIA?

KIA · 15 Mar 2013 at 16:12

Confirm if downstream is affected? Run the BT speed test when you're seeing the high latency. http://speedtest.btwholesale.com/

Are other machines connected to the same router also seeing the high latency?

Rroff · 15 Mar 2013 at 16:19

looks like the problem is between hops 6 and 7 (metro->core?)

6 11 ms 12 ms 12 ms 31.55.164.107
7 144 ms 139 ms 136 ms acc1-10GigE-0-7-0-4.bm.21cn-ipp.bt.net [109.159.248.70]

BT got mugged off on their 21CN setup and the core nodes are all kind of messed up so wouldn't suprise me if theres a lack of bandwidth or routing issues.

zeegy · 15 Mar 2013 at 16:19

Just ran two tests, one on my laptop via cable, and one on my gamer... each were switched off when the other was running a test.
Both seemed very very similar.

This is what i consider 'normal' at the moment. I will post another one up on-peak when my internet dies again.....

zeegy · 15 Mar 2013 at 16:20

Rroff said:
looks like the problem is between hops 6 and 7:

BT got mugged off on their 21CN setup and the core nodes are all kind of messed up so wouldn't suprise me if theres a lack of bandwidth or routing issues.

Agree, some of the hops seem very high, and all around the core of the ISP's infrastructure. but then, if that was the case to the level im getting wouldnt there be loads of disgruntled gamers complaining about their ping responses on peak with their infinity packages at the moment ?

I mean look at hops 7 8 and 9! they are awfull!
7 127 ms 128 ms 124 ms acc1-10GigE-0-3-0-5.bm.21cn-ipp.bt.net [109.159.248.116]
8 151 ms 156 ms 158 ms core1-te0-15-0-15.ealing.ukcore.bt.net [109.159.248.40]
9 145 ms 143 ms 138 ms peer1-xe4-0-0.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [213.121.193.144]

Compare it to now (off peak) and the same tracert is as follows:
7 11 ms 11 ms 11 ms acc1-10GigE-0-3-0-5.bm.21cn-ipp.bt.net [109.159.248.116]
8 16 ms 15 ms 15 ms core1-te0-15-0-15.ealing.ukcore.bt.net [109.159.248.40]
9 17 ms 16 ms 16 ms peer1-xe4-0-0.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net [213.121.193.144]

a ping to say 8.8.8.8 is currently 25ms, bbc.co.uk 20ms...

Note : they are all on the same nodes as before as the last test too.

Rroff · 15 Mar 2013 at 16:29

^^ I've not seen many people connecting via the Birmingham core which I assume you are tho I might be wrong. So might be why there aren't a lot of people complaining. It might be an indication tho they are finally getting around to sorting the cores and still work in progress.

EDIT: Scratch that people routed on the Birmingham node isn't that new.

zeegy · 15 Mar 2013 at 16:37

Off Peak WinMTR as follows

Code:

|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|

|                                      WinMTR statistics                                   |

|                       Host              -   %  | Sent | Recv | Best | Avrg | Wrst | Last |

|------------------------------------------------|------|------|------|------|------|------|

|                     www.asusnetwork.net -    0 |  363 |  363 |    0 |    0 |    6 |    0 |

|                            217.32.141.7 -    0 |  363 |  363 |    5 |    6 |   11 |    6 |

|                          217.32.140.222 -    0 |  363 |  363 |    6 |   13 |  267 |    6 |

|                          213.120.161.34 -    0 |  363 |  363 |   11 |   11 |   18 |   12 |

|                            31.55.164.43 -    0 |  363 |  363 |   11 |   11 |   15 |   11 |

|                           31.55.164.107 -    0 |  363 |  363 |   11 |   11 |   16 |   11 |

|  acc1-10GigE-0-7-0-4.bm.21cn-ipp.bt.net -    0 |  363 |  363 |   11 |   11 |   17 |   11 |

|  core2-te-0-13-0-4.ilford.ukcore.bt.net -    0 |  363 |  363 |   15 |   19 |   24 |   21 |

|  peer3te0-1-3-0.telehouse.ukcore.bt.net -    0 |  363 |  363 |   16 |   22 |   31 |   17 |

|                    linx.bandwidth.co.uk -    0 |  363 |  363 |   16 |   22 |  362 |   16 |

|            rt1.chelt.gamingdeluxe.co.uk -    0 |  363 |  363 |   19 |   19 |   25 |   19 |

|           24-148-109.gamingdeluxe.co.uk -    0 |  363 |  363 |   20 |   20 |   24 |   20 |

|________________________________________________|______|______|______|______|______|______|

zeegy · 15 Mar 2013 at 22:01

Right then, heres some stats for tonight. I have to admit, a lot, lot better than last night. but compared to other pings on the server (most under 30, mine around 80 - 110) there are some areas for improvement.

Please see the following MTR Stats, I have timestamped them too.

zeegy · 15 Mar 2013 at 22:07

just done a BT speedtest too (wish i remembered to do one earlier)

Download Speed : 49.52
Upload Speed : 6.57 (so this has dropped, this was under 3mb on-peak yesterday)
Ping : 48.57 - a little hight for my liking considering its in the BT WAN

KIA · 16 Mar 2013 at 11:24

I would ignore the high ping response from BT's routers as they're probably configured to give low priority to ICMP traffic when under load.

zeegy · 16 Mar 2013 at 14:35

KIA said:
I would ignore the high ping response from BT's routers as they're probably configured to give low priority to ICMP traffic when under load.

That makes sense considering it is low priority traffic.

So then, Any ideas why the response times (noticable in gaming) at peak periods. do those charts help at all?