b/w monitor on modem router

tomcat · 13 Jan 2011 at 15:31

Is there any modem router that has a bandwidth monitoring (like dd-wrt) or custom firmware that allows that? By bandwidth monitoring i mean showing the download and upload speed of the wan.

also, i have a DG834GT flashed with dgteam firmware where i can activate SNMP. Is there any client or software that i have to install in order to pull data out of the router modem in order to check the bandwidth?

thanks for your help

tomcat · 1 Jun 2012 at 16:51

sorry to bring this post back from dead...but i have noticed that the new dsl-n55u from asus is offering real time traffic monitor of bandwidth for internet, wired and wireless.

Is this working ok?

I'm also aware of fritz box that offers the same graph monitor.

Are there any other adsl routers that you are aware of to offer same feature please?

thanks for your help

Sin_Chase · 1 Jun 2012 at 18:54

Many do and almost all routers with custom firmware distributions will have bandwidth graphs.

The rest that do not usually will support SNMP that will let you graph from a SNMP client on any PC.

tomcat · 1 Jun 2012 at 21:01

Sin_Chase said:
Many do and almost all routers with custom firmware distributions will have bandwidth graphs.

The rest that do not usually will support SNMP that will let you graph from a SNMP client on any PC.

yeap, but not all adsl routers have bandwidth monitor and also very few have custom firmware developed on them with bandwidth monitor.

PistolPete · 2 Jun 2012 at 07:40

SNMP then, 99% of routers have basic ethernet MIBs but it does mean running a machines 24/7 to collect the data

tals · 2 Jun 2012 at 08:59

If you convert the 834 to a modem and get something like a netgear 3700 v2 then you can put gargoyle on that which gives a fairly comprehensive bandwidth monitoring solution. I can see from a network level to a device level what the bandwidth usage is

I didn't put a lot of the bandwidth stats in my post here

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18351858

But happy to if you want to see what is possible. It's usp however is it's the only solution to offer a working qos on an adsl line on both up and downstream.

Also has a fairly comprehensive quota management system and time scheduling

Sin_Chase · 2 Jun 2012 at 12:34

tals said:
But happy to if you want to see what is possible. It's usp however is it's the only solution to offer a working qos on an adsl line on both up and downstream.

Also has a fairly comprehensive quota management system and time scheduling

Could you expand on the 'working' QoS point?

Not sure how a router can do proper QoS when your ISP does not tag packets or even manage them appropriately if they accept tagging.

tals · 2 Jun 2012 at 12:40

Probably easier to read the devs post on it

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/wiki/doku.php?id=qos

What I would say is it does work, I was testing something for the dev a couple of days ago and accidentally disabled my qos. Pings went through the roof, voice comms was poor etc. how it handles adsl is by monitoring the line and keeping the necessary capacity for qos - any other qos is a static which would not work on mine where the connection goes between 6mb and 2mb

This post the dev also discusses it more

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2793

blueacid · 2 Jun 2012 at 15:35

tals said:
Probably easier to read the devs post on it

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/wiki/doku.php?id=qos

What I would say is it does work, I was testing something for the dev a couple of days ago and accidentally disabled my qos. Pings went through the roof, voice comms was poor etc. how it handles adsl is by monitoring the line and keeping the necessary capacity for qos - any other qos is a static which would not work on mine where the connection goes between 6mb and 2mb

This post the dev also discusses it more

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2793

I'm currently looking at doing exactly what you've done; Get a 3700 and install Gargoyle.

Question - do you have any idea what the maximum WAN to LAN routing speed of the 3700 is? I'm currently on ADSL but might well be able to get fibre "soon". Don't want to discover that the 3700 is too slow to keep up with potentially 80mbit...

Cheers,
Blueacid

tals · 2 Jun 2012 at 15:51

It will do the QOS at that speed but it does affect the performance quite badly - I think you would see about 60mbit or worse performance with QOS on. Some live with it or you just turn it off (but that takes away its best feature). That said when you are at 80Mbit you may not need qos - depends if you have any devices that steam the connection

From what I can see the 3700 seems to be the best of the Gargoyle routers but you may see one that is beefier in the list

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/wiki/doku.php?id=supported_routers_-_tested_routers

Unless you are very technical I would only go for ones that have a factory image which allows you to use your factory firmware to update to Gargoyle.

Could be worth posting on Gargoyle forums for thoughts and experiences

Sin_Chase · 3 Jun 2012 at 02:19

tals said:
Probably easier to read the devs post on it

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/wiki/doku.php?id=qos

What I would say is it does work, I was testing something for the dev a couple of days ago and accidentally disabled my qos. Pings went through the roof, voice comms was poor etc. how it handles adsl is by monitoring the line and keeping the necessary capacity for qos - any other qos is a static which would not work on mine where the connection goes between 6mb and 2mb

This post the dev also discusses it more

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2793

That's just a basic QoS description. Gargoyle cannot do more QoS than any other implementation on a a line where the ISP ignores any tagging.

It's a little unfair to say it does full QoS and nothing else does because that is simply not true. Monitoring a line dynamically for changes is a pretty nice feature but at what cost? Surely to truly know your current line capacity it has to run a 100% capacity check against a known good source which, well - uses 100% of your capacity and must cripple anything on the line at the time? Once every now and then, cool but not frequently surely?

I'm not a fan of bandwidth capping, I prefer to prioritise delivery effort based on packet priority with minimum bandwidth guarantees which will naturally shape bandwidth and still allow others to use 100% of the line if no other service requires it.

QoS/Traffic shaping is a MONSTER though and very hard to setup perfectly mainly because testing in a real world situation is hard. I think I spent 10 hours straight setting up traffic shaping on my pfsense implementation.

tals · 3 Jun 2012 at 06:58

It's a little unfair to say it does full QoS and nothing else does because that is simply not true. Monitoring a line dynamically for changes is a pretty nice feature but at what cost? Surely to truly know your current line capacity it has to run a 100% capacity check against a known good source which, well - uses 100% of your capacity and must cripple anything on the line at the time? Once every now and then, cool but not frequently surely?

As I understand it the router pings the host, if the ping degrades it assumes it is due to traffic congestion so reduces your line capacity. As you say with this QOS (as opposed to prioritisation) you need to have some capacity that it uses to allow the QOS to work - I don't think it is actually that much though. I tried a number of routers before I came to Gargoyle (including the Billion 7800N) and non of them could handle the familys internet usage tied in with my gaming.

It does go further and better than that, if the line doesn't need QOS it doesn't put in the rules (some QOS solutions are fixed aka Billions) and if it does need QOS it spreads it proportionally. So for example I have gone for a 'fair setup' each family member gets 20% and a catch all of 20%. If my daughter and I are using the net to capacity (and no one else is on) then I get 50% and she gets 50%. Set up wise it works pretty much on enabling and based more on traffic type but I preferred keeping everyone in their own classes.

Sin_Chase · 3 Jun 2012 at 14:41

Interesting, seems it uses a different approach rather than a 'more fully fledged' one because your ISP is still ignoring the tagging. I remember looking into Gargoyle but never had any hardware capable of running it.

I wonder what style of QoS it uses. HSFC is the best but hardest to configure.

tals · 3 Jun 2012 at 15:39

Sin_Chase said:
Interesting, seems it uses a different approach rather than a 'more fully fledged' one because your ISP is still ignoring the tagging. I remember looking into Gargoyle but never had any hardware capable of running it.

I wonder what style of QoS it uses. HSFC is the best but hardest to configure.

Post in the Gargoyle QOS forum, the dev pbix is very helpful.

(to setup Gargoyle cost me £80, £20 for the Netgear 834 which I use as a modem and £60 for a 3700 v2 (got lucky there

). Sold my Billion 7800n for £80 so all worked out rather well

Setting up Gargoyle on a router where they have a factory image is very easy)

tomcat · 4 Jun 2012 at 10:18

thanks for all the replies..
by using a separate modem and separate router i can get the real time bandwidth stats/graphs, with a router running dd-wrt or tomato..

my issue is a combined modem/router that has those stats.

At the moment i know only Asus dsl-n55u that does that, from what i have seen from their site, (i do not own one) and also the fritz box...both of which are very expensive.

are you aware of any other modem/router combined that has those stats?

at the moment i have an asus-N12u, which is a good modem/router but unfortunately does not have such graph and it does not have snmp either, although i think is running linux..(??). Before i buy it, i asked asus support if such graphs exist on this model and if there is snmp support and they told me yes. After i bought it i realised it had none..!! so -1 for asus advice..

tals · 14 Jun 2012 at 13:41

Sin_Chase said:
Interesting, seems it uses a different approach rather than a 'more fully fledged' one because your ISP is still ignoring the tagging. I remember looking into Gargoyle but never had any hardware capable of running it.

I wonder what style of QoS it uses. HSFC is the best but hardest to configure.

Resurrecting this slightly, he has done a minor update to his wiki

http://www.gargoyle-router.com/wiki/doku.php?id=qos&#class_priority

This was quite a big deal for me, in the past QOS has meant priority to me but with Gargoyles splitting the bandwidth really does work.

Tomcat - unfortunately I think the custom firmwares are the best solutions and all of those unfortunately appear to rely on a seperate modem/router solution albeit I have no issue with this and in my case gives me more resilience to handle failure.