Beef Use By Date

[bluemartian]

Using Hellofresh. Just started cooking for the first time properly.

Date on minced beef packs were yesterday (it's now 3:06am uK time).

According to NHS's website: You'll see "use by" dates on food that goes off quickly, such as smoked fish, meat products and ready-prepared salads. Don't use any food or drink after the end of the "use by" date on the label, even if it looks and smells fine. This is because using it after this date could put your health at risk.

So considering this is now 3 hours past the use by date (and probably 1 day past the use by date by the time I get a reply on here), is it still safe to eat?

Is it also safe to store the remaining in a container after it has cooled down in the fridge and eat it over 2-3 days (remember use by dat was yesterday).

 

[bluemartian]

Why risk it? Most mince is made from meat that is already several days old before it’s packed. Quite often the oldest meat in the factory is what gets minced because they didn’t use it in orders for more expensive cuts, so it’s good meat, just not always the newest meat in the factory.

The great thing about meat is that unless you poke things into the middle of it, any pathogenic (unhealthy) bacteria can only grow on the outside of the piece of meat and the nutrients they need to grow are locked up inside the meat so they don’t grow very fast. When you mince the meat, you spread the bacteria throughout the meat and you break open the meat to release lots of nutrients so bacteria can grow faster.

The advice about smelling it only tells you about a couple of spoilage bacteria that generate gases as they grow. And actually, they’re usually fine to eat if you cook the meat.

Smelling it tells you nothing about E. Coli, Staphylococcus toxin, Clostridia or any number of other food pathogens.

Some pathogens only release the toxins when you kill them ie. when you cook the meat, so cooking it won’t necessarily help.

If you were quite literally starving, then fine, no harm will likely come to you from eating out-of-date meat, but why risk it if you’re not starving to death?

Excellent reply. Thank you.

 

[bluemartian]

I think in this case where it is minced beef specifically it isn't worth attempting. Food poisoning can kill. I will just buy some from the supermarket as the veggies and potatoes and rice are still good to go. It makes me sad too to see food go to waste, but it's just not worth the risk.

The last time I made minced beef I ended up in hospital for 3 days with severe stomach pain (had to be shot with morphine) a rash and something else I forget. It may not be due to the minced beef, but the docs weren't able to identify the cause. I think it was. There was nothing else new that I ate or used in that week.

I had made burgers using minced beef back then.

 

[bluemartian]

people in supermarkets will pick up some meat. carry it in their trolley. change their mind and stick it on a random shelf in the tinned foods aisle. it will then take several hours before a member of staff notices and they will likely ignore it leaving for the next member of staff to deal with, etc. by the time it's put back in the fridge it's likely been ruined.

this is why when i buy meat. i'll tend to buy the one with the longest date. and i'll pick up the packet at the back or in the middle or under another packet, etc. chances are it won't have been passed around the shop, etc.

This is a good idea. Never thought about this.

HOWEVER no one seems to be addressing the second part. IF meat is cooked on it's use by date, is it then ok to eat it if it is refrigerated over 2-3 days?

 

[bluemartian]

Again, it's nothing to do with smell or colour. The darkening of the meat is to do with a breakdown in the pigment in haemoglobin. That's fine.

The standard shelf-life testing protocol includes an 'abuse' phase of 4 hours at 22C to simulate the customer taking the product home in a warm car or bus, so they pretty much have you covered for a bit of abuse inside the USE BY period.

Where are you getting all this info from? Sources please? Not saying what you are saying is wrong. I am intrigued how you seem to know so much about this.

 

[bluemartian]

Yes.

?

 

[bluemartian]

I also worry about use by dates and have posted on here in the past about a few things I was unsure of. I'd say as long as it smells ok and not putrid and as long as you cook it to a specific internal temperature, it's fine. Red meat cooked to an internal temperature of 160f/71c and chicken cooked to 165c/74c kills bacteria. I always used my thermapen to check for those temps. And leftover food to be reheated should also reach 165f/74c.

What I generally do when I buy mince beef, sausages, chicken thighs or drumsticks is freeze them if I don't intend to cook them the same day or if I'm unsure if I might even cook them the same week. Particularly when I buy them at a reduced price if they're being sold on the actual use by date. As long as they're frozen before the use by date has passed, they'll keep for ages, but once you defrost them, then they must to be cooked the same day. I happily defrost sausages and mince in the microwave and 500g of minced beef only takes a few minutes. But I defrost chicken overnight in the fridge as my understanding is that it's safer.

One other thing. If you plan to freeze meat or chicken, prepare ahead by splitting them into the portion sizes you'll want for single meals before freezing, otherwise they'll be stuck together and you'll have to defrost the whole lot. It's pretty much impossible to pull apart the amount you want to cook once frozen without resorting to a hammer and chisel. With a pack of 8 sausages for example, I split into two lots of 4 and wrap each portion in clingfilm.

What do you put each portion into to freeze? Cling film would be dangerous for like raw chicken breast and beef right? Too thin so can tear easily?

 

[bluemartian]

3 hours over.... You checked the NHS Web site?

Are you like a baby that suddenly became an adult a bit like that film Big?

My parents have abused me my entire life and they still do. I wasn't allowed to cook most of my life and I defo wasn't allowed to cook meat until only recently. They also move everything I setup in the kitchen which means forgetting I had ingredients and then they go bad and spending hours finding something because my stepmother doesn't talk to me and my dad isn't in the house and I am usually too scared to ask him as he has SERIOUS anger issues and asking him anything makes him get angry, and we have multiple properties right next to each other and stuff gets taken between them and sometimes they just throw my stuff away.

My dad often damages food cookware I buy because he's a very aggressive dumb idiot and does things like use my new blade to cut a watermelon over the edge of the kitchen sink which means the blade slams down onto the edge of the metal sink as he very aggressively attempts to cut the watermelon, leaving the kitchen sink with an unsightly mark and the blade damaged.

He also has terrible hygiene along with all other male members of this 'family and extended family' (extended family live in the other properties). The light switch ALWAYS has some black grime on it as does the fridge DOOR. The DOOR FFS sake. Why do you need to touch the damn door when theres a handle on it?! Same with all the cabinet doors.

Also he is aggressive with everything in general, so around the sink after he has used it is water everywhere including water dripping down the front of the cabinets under the sink - and that water isn't always clean water.

There has been a lot of violence I have suffered from at their hands not to mention the emotional abuse. Learn what creates human behaviour. If someone is dumb, skinny, ripped, muscular, very knowledgeable etc, it is due to their environment which includes all the people in it not just the physical environment (which is not what environment really means in this context).

So no. I don't know how to cook for myself. And I'm trying to learn. I also was hospitalised and shot with morphine due to what I think was minced beef. Read one of my previous posts for more detail.

Let me learn in peace.

 

[bluemartian]

lol at 3 hours past used by. Jesus

Read my OP. I wrote that it would be at least 1 day before I got a reply. I also wrote it's confusing as it is a use by date. Where do you draw the line? Surely the use by date IS the line that has been scientifically drawn after much testing and research.

 

[bluemartian]

So far the hellofresh recipes have been disgusting. The Prawn Thai Curry is utter vile. The chicken chow mein was not nice but not disgusting. It contains 22g of sugar per serving I ate 2/3rd's which is around 33g of sugar. That's as much sugar as in a can of cola. It's their disgusting premade paste's and sauce's. My god. Utter vile. Can't believe white people can palate this garbage. I LOVE AUTHENTIC Mexican and Indian food. Keyword being authentic. Best to go to the countries and stay with families and eat street food to get authentic. Which I have done.

Hellofresh is like some kid decided to make 'recipes'. They are stupid simple, all the recipes call for the same veggies and they are either courgette, carrot or a red pepper. Not even joking. Oh and red chilli which has no heat to it at all and tastes like red pepper.
I almost puked with the Thai Curry one. I just finished cleaning up having made it and I am starving because it was too vile for me to put in my mouth.

Any recommendations for AUTHENTIC Mexican recipes? Not the garbage on sites like bbc and pretty much every site that comes up with a google search.

 

[bluemartian]

Yeah, I just wrap in cling film and put that in the container the chicken or beef came in as in my photo below. I suppose it could tear but I've not had any problems so far. A freezer ziplock bag would be better.

[/QUOTE]

I thought you meant like you bu those £25 5kg chicken breasts or however many kg's it is from the butchers and you take them out and cling film them then store them all in the freezer in just their cling film stacked ontop of each other or a similar fashion. People that bulk buy in bulk like that; only I have no idea how they freeze the chicken breasts as cling film sounds dangerous.

Any ideas?

Also why do you wrap your chicken in cling film then put it in the fridge?

 

[bluemartian]

lol what is going on with these forums lately. Seems to totally accept racism, anti-semitic abuse et al now. I mean, worse than usual

Dunno what he expected from HF, it's clearly for people who can't cook. For authentic Mexican I'd recommend the Thomasina Miers books because that's what I've used. But then again, she's a white English girl so he probably won't like it...

I've done the Serious Eats pork carnitas a few times. They're awesome.

It is not racist. White people have VERY bland palates compared to ethnics. For example. Indian restaurants have all made their dishes to cater to white peoples tastes. Aka less heat and specific spices.

Think of typical traditional British cooking. Going back through history very clearly shows white peoples foods vs ethnics.

I google'd this Thomasina and she co founded wahaca. Wahaca's food is NOT authentic Mexican and is pretty crap in taste and quality.

A quick extract from one of her books visible for free on Amazon using 'look inside':

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mexican-Food-Simple-Thomasina-Miers-ebook/dp/B005ZTBZ50

She writes 'When I first travelled to Mexico, I was under the impression that chillies were either red or green and either hot or damned hot. Instead I found dozens of different varieties .... etc etc''.
Just goes to show that white people DO have bland palate bases. She wasn't even aware of the huge variety of chillies that exist let alone using them in her cooking.
Mexicans are BORN into it. They don't need to learn it as white people do in their 20's+.
Same applies for Indians etc etc.
This of course only applies to functional healthy families where the parents teach and allow their children to cook and can cook well themselves.

My parents have a family friend whose cooking is INCREDIBLE. My stepmothers and my aunties cooking is **** in comparison.
The family friend who is their age, has made the same dishes my stepmother has made and they were AMAZING. She has also made dishes that I have always hated, but I tried them because her food tastes so damn good, and oh my. I loved those same dishes I had hated my entire life.

So the skill, knowledge, experience and what region and specific area and even street an ethnic family come from, plays a huge role in the taste of their food.

White people DO have a more bland palate vs ethnics. No question about it. Go to any typical British white persons house vs an Indian. Indians have literal cabinets with shelves full of various spices, herbs etc. Over 50 spices in one household easily stocked in large quantities due to the amount they use daily.

 

[bluemartian]

You're confusing race with geography. I won't deny "traditional" British cooking uses less spices but that doesn't mean all white people have boring palates. There you've jumped to making an assumption about race. What you actually mean to say is more western or European people.

Not all. The majority. No doubt about it. Ethnic daily cooking involves 'exotic' spices and many of them. My local huge Tesco doesn't stock any of the ingredients my stepmother and aunty need let alone spices. So my dad makes a monthly trip to London which is a good 2 hours away to get the ingredients needed in bulk.
Chipotle chillies aren't available either. No fresh spices and chillies are available at my local Tesco.
Wanna cook Jamaican? Gonna have to go to London and find a small Jamaican supermarket or store for that.

Tell that to the two Mexican girls I work with. They would never say it's as good as Mexico city tacos but they find it pretty authentic in places and more to the point - tasty.

What are you talking about? Wahaca?

Wahaca's food is great, I trust my tastebuds well enough to know it.

You have low food standards then. Have you even been to Mexico and other countries? I have lived in other non-western countries for years being ethnic myself.

Don't give us that rubbish that because Thomasina is a white European she can't make an authentic Mexican recipe. That's as bad as the people having a go at Gordon Ramsey's new Asian restaurant. Guess what, the world's a small place now and with the right research and travel, it's very easy for a decent chef to go out and find the "authentic" recipes. If you don't like it because a white person has made it.. well flip that on its head and tell me how it sounds back to you...

Never said it's because of her ethnicity. She is a white person raised and born in a western country. She travelled to Mexico for a bit and then co founds a franchised 'Mexican' restaurant. LOL. LOL At you thinking Wahaca is even CLOSE to authentic.

I'd never deny that.

I have a huge amount of spices in my house because I enjoy cooking. My girlfriend used to live with a Punjabi girl who couldn't cook for toffee. It was embarrassing. She had no spices and no idea. Again, you're making broad assumptions about race which create quite negative connotations. Talk about 'British people' or 'Western people' all you like...

Nope. So some punjabi girl couldn't cook. Big deal. Doesn't change the importance of the food culture a person is BORN into.

I'm guessing a couple of British guys winning 'best restaurant in the UK' for their northern Thai restaurant would send you absolutely crazy? https://www.standard.co.uk/go/londo...t-at-national-restaurant-awards-a3860331.html

Awards mean nothing. Go to Thailand and a street vendor might be able to outdo them. You cannot change the fact that the food culture you are born into is the one you are a master of IF you learn to cook.

Don't know how to use quotes on this site so my replies are within the quote above for some reason.

 

[bluemartian]

Was thinking this myself.

If home issues are that bad, perhaps find a place of your own to live and stop starting arguments with people on a computer forum about 'authentic mexican' food?

Abuse is complex. It isn't the stereotype shown in movies. In real life it is a way of life. It is not constant 24/7 abuse. The LIFETIME of abuse itself makes moving away from here impossible. Abuse effects every single aspect of your life.

Not arguments you muppet. I need to learn how to cook for myself. A very essential skill. Eating out even one meal a day at £35-£45 a meal for enough food adds up REAL fast. Abuse takes place in poor, middle class and rich families. Before you start asking about money.

 

[bluemartian]

I also enjoyed Rick Stein's Road to Mexico series, but be warned, he is a white British man.

Had a look at that in a bookstore yesterday. Total garbage. Half the book is full sized photos. It isn't the skin colour that is important. You keep saying dumb stuff and choosing to ignore things I have typed. As I said it is the CULTURE that a person is born into that dictates taste and cooking.

A WHITE person is usually born in a western country. Go live in Mexico for 5 years and learn to cook with a few families there. Cookbooks are almost always utter garbage in western countries. Not even close to the food they eat on a daily basis and utterly lacking in flavour and quality of flavour.

 

[bluemartian]

Yup.

Been there, dealt with it.

When I dealt with it I was on the streets, and when I finally found somewhere to live I was eating tinned beans if I was lucky. I wasn't prepping myself with foodie' website guides.

Dunno who you're calling a muppet but you seem to be a person in a good situation playing the victim complex. I didn't get the chance to "learn to cook" before I left my home, especially not from some expensive foodie nonsense. I was sleeping on the damn street. And here's another thing, I never once complained or bitched, or told anyone online about it until now.

If your issues were half as bad as you claimed you wouldn't be sat making this thread, let alone posting the pretentious garbage you have.

If you really had problems you'd have left home and moved on, you wouldn't be "learning to cook" by ordering crap off the internet, while spewing self important nonsense toward people online.

What an incredibly dumb thing to write. You have very little knowledge of psychology. A lot of guys feel they shouldn't and can't talk about their issues and words like 'bitch about it/complain' are used against them dare they talk about it. Male suicide is 3 times higher than females.

You think what you did is what all people in abusive situations should do? I don't want to be in a ****** situation like you were. There is no reason why I should have to suffer as you did. It's one of the reasons I haven't moved out. Money. As I said not everyone comes from a poor background.

Karlie Kloss has never and will never be in the situation you were in due to coming from a loving caring family and having been born very good looking. Her life is a dream for most people. She makes millions just because she is good looking. LOOKS. Aka your genetic value governs every aspect of your life.

'Dealing with it' as per what you wrote is incredibly dumb. It's also useful to continue staying here as I record all the abuse now and have told the police I do so, so when the time comes to take them to court, I have some evidence rather than none at all.

It isn't pretentious. A person raised in a western country, born into a caucasian background is very unlikely to be a master with spices and herbs etc. Whereas ethnics are born into it as I keep writing again and again.

I can't believe how dumb you are with regards to all you have written in the above post I quoted you on.

Just running a quick google search brings up articles like this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-48940521

https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2017/may/10/support-seek-help-male-suicide-calm

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...alk-about-male-suicide-celebrities-vulnerable

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-...-2018-gender-stereotypes-man-up-a8641136.html

https://www.bps.org.uk/blogs/dr-funke-baffour/male-suicide-silent-epidemic

BUT you had better start researching psychology and learn about human behaviour. I have spent years doing so and spend most of my time talking to people, mainly girls, and analysing their behaviours, questioning and interacting.

I will not be replying to this thread so a mod can shut this thread down. I also suggest a mod look into this guys last reply and take the appropriate action needed.

I have all the time in the world as money isn't an issue to some extent. I do not have to work a ****** job to have money. I am fortunate.

I suggest you watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndsWuYfRgjE
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yb5ivvcTvRQ

This is what happens when you are born sexually desirable aka good looking: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-s2CorLWws

The better looking you are, the more you earn and the more easily you make money, the more positive character traits that are associated with you and the better people treat you. Google The Halo Effect.