Can anyone show me VR flight sim footage that doesn’t have stutter?

[wunkley]

Bit concerned here. Ordered a G2 reverb today with the hopes of flight sim nirvana, but every video I’ve seen on YouTube claiming to be VR capture is a stuttering **** show.

At the moment I game on a gsync monitor. Overall Smoothness and stutter free/ hitch free / judder free gameplay is 100% more important to me than ‘high’ FPS.

I see VR footage on YouTube of flight sim 2020 with an FPS counter running, and it’s showing 60 plus FPS, yet it stutters or ‘hitches’ to my eyes every 2 seconds. It looks like total **** and I don’t understand how people can’t see it and think it’s ok.

On my system, a 3090 but with an older cpu at the mo, I get around 35-50 FPS on average in flight sim 2020, but it’s mostly totally smooth with very few hitches.

As VR does not have gsync or the equivalent, is totally smooth stutter free gameplay a possibility in a VR flight sim? Can anyone link some decent video capture evidence?

 

[Moley]

FS2020 needs a good CPU and a decent amount of RAM. On my old PC (4790, 16GB, 1080ti) it ran like a dog, on my new PC (10700k, 32Gb, 3070) it's *much* better but not 60 fps.

 

[drakulton]

Bit concerned here. Ordered a G2 reverb today with the hopes of flight sim nirvana, but every video I’ve seen on YouTube claiming to be VR capture is a stuttering **** show.

At the moment I game on a gsync monitor. Overall Smoothness and stutter free/ hitch free / judder free gameplay is 100% more important to me than ‘high’ FPS.


I see VR footage on YouTube of flight sim 2020 with an FPS counter running, and it’s showing 60 plus FPS, yet it stutters or ‘hitches’ to my eyes every 2 seconds. It looks like total **** and I don’t understand how people can’t see it and think it’s ok.

On my system, a 3090 but with an older cpu at the mo, I get around 35-50 FPS on average in flight sim 2020, but it’s mostly totally smooth with very few hitches.

As VR does not have gsync or the equivalent, is totally smooth stutter free gameplay a possibility in a VR flight sim? Can anyone link some decent video capture evidence?

VR simmage is massively hardware intensive. You have a 3090 and a decent system. MSFS 2020 is a mahoosive resource hog, and the G2 ids one of the best headsets available. just get stuck in and toggle the settings to suit..... or miss out. I have a 780Ti and it does what I need it to do in VR.

 

[hyperseven]

I take it the footage you are talking about is from an external feed not what you actually see from the HMD?

 

[Ravenger]

Other flight sims such as IL2 run great on a 3090. It's FS2020 that's the problem. It's just not that well optimised, and is very single core heavy. Hopefully they'll upgrade it so processors with more cores can run it better.

 

[zero71]

I think you'll have a very hard time getting a smooth frame rate in FS2020 acceptably high, on a G2, even with a 3090. It'll be nowhere near the headsets Native resolution. Even in less demanding games I think most folk sacrifice resolution for fraamrate. I returned my G2 for a Quest 2 within a week of the G2 launch (I was an early preorder) because in the real world, at non vomit inducing frame rates, and non native resolution on either, the visual difference just wasn't dramatic. Sure it is at native, but even the Q2 is too high for most PCVR native.

I had very high expectations for VR. I can get close in Sim Racing, but it's at a lower resolution than I hoped and a 3080/90 won't get me to native, and they are way less taxing than FS2020. Maybe next gen.

The good news is System Active have a decent return policy if you aren't happy.

Edit :

I got into VR for Sim Racing. I tried FS2020 because it was free on Game Pass. But I've stayed in VR for pickup and play native Q2 games. They are simpler, but they are a lot of fun and I can play them in any room, whether the PC is available or not. That's the big selling point of Q2, when you get your FS fix done and you have 10 mins before heading out with the wife, you can grab the Q2 and be in Pistol Whip in seconds rather than the minutes it takes to ready PCVR. I grab lots of 10mins. I rarely get time for Sim Racing.

 

[wunkley]

I take it the footage you are talking about is from an external feed not what you actually see from the HMD?

It’s just random videos I’ve watched on YouTube, so I’m not sure. They’re mostly about the G2 but some with the Q2 also.
I’d estimate out of say 20 videos, only 2 had good smooth footage, one was ok and the rest were just a juddery mess.

And generally speaking, smoothness is not all about raw power and high FPS. As mentioned I see footage online of people running sims and other games at 60fps plus, yet it’s still juddery and not smooth. This is why I got into gsync monitors so early on years ago, a consistent smoothness at 50fps for example, is way more important to me than high FPS that judders.

The mostly bad footage I’ve seen of flight sim 2020 looks like it’s actually running at 10fps it’s that bad, even though they say it’s running above 30 FPS.

I think what you’ve questioned there may be key I.e. is the footage of the clips I’m watching from an external feed or from what is seen in the HMD. How would I tell the difference? Will one have stutter and the other not?

I noticed one guy did quickly mention that the footage might look stuttery to the viewer but to him it was smooth. It’s just I know for a fact that some people’s definition of smooth is just not the same as mine. Some people really don’t notice, and don’t seem to be be bothered by micro stutter and hitching in games. It’s a deal breaker for me unfortunately.

 

[hyperseven]

It’s just random videos I’ve watched on YouTube, so I’m not sure. They’re mostly about the G2 but some with the Q2 also.
I’d estimate out of say 20 videos, only 2 had good smooth footage, one was ok and the rest were just a juddery mess.

And generally speaking, smoothness is not all about raw power and high FPS. As mentioned I see footage online of people running sims and other games at 60fps plus, yet it’s still juddery and not smooth. This is why I got into gsync monitors so early on years ago, a consistent smoothness at 50fps for example, is way more important to me than high FPS that judders.

The mostly bad footage I’ve seen of flight sim 2020 looks like it’s actually running at 10fps it’s that bad, even though they say it’s running above 30 FPS.

I think what you’ve questioned there may be key I.e. is the footage of the clips I’m watching from an external feed or from what is seen in the HMD. How would I tell the difference? Will one have stutter and the other not?

I noticed one guy did quickly mention that the footage might look stuttery to the viewer but to him it was smooth. It’s just I know for a fact that some people’s definition of smooth is just not the same as mine. Some people really don’t notice, and don’t seem to be be bothered by micro stutter and hitching in games. It’s a deal breaker for me unfortunately.

You want o be looking for 'through the lenses' videos if you can. As said the external monitor is not really representative of what you are seeing via the HMD.

 

[zero71]

And generally speaking, smoothness is not all about raw power and high FPS. As mentioned I see footage online of people running sims and other games at 60fps plus, yet it’s still juddery and not smooth. This is why I got into gsync monitors so early on years ago, a consistent smoothness at 50fps for example, is way more important to me than high FPS that judders.

Not sure if you have tried VR yet, but for many people, anything below a rock solid smooth 72 fps will make them queazy. For me, it needs to be 90 fps. Anything below that, and I start to feel sick. It's especially bad if it varies. You need to be thinking about what visual compromises you need to make to lock the came at 72fps or ideally 90fps. Reprojection might work for you, taking it down to 45fps, but for me, that made me sick too. I know you are worried about judder, and that's never nice, and won't give you a great VR experience, but FPS is King in VR. I can happily play 30fps and 60 fps in PC and Console games. The variable frame rate doesn't bother me either. I'm as happy with G-sync on or off, I can even live with tearing. But in VR an ugly 90fps is way more playable than a gorgeous 30 to 50fps, no matter how smooth it feels. You need to find a way to get a high FPS that is judder free, unless you have an iron stomach and just don't tend to suffer motion sickness. Are you comfortable surfing on your phone for 30 mins as a passenger in a car with no nausea?

ps. I gave up trying to get FS2020 running on my system, which is just a 2070 Super. Lowest settings on everything and it was still a dog. Stutter, judder, very low FPS. Just unplayable. I uninstalled it and gave up. It's a tough game.

 

[melmac]

B

I see VR footage on YouTube of flight sim 2020 with an FPS counter running, and it’s showing 60 plus FPS, yet it stutters or ‘hitches’ to my eyes every 2 seconds. It looks like total **** and I don’t understand how people can’t see it and think it’s ok.

Look, you have ordered the Reverb G2. There two possible outcomes. You will either like VR or you will hate VR. And nobody can tell you which it will be until you put on the headset and try it out for yourself.

Most people these days like VR, because the headsets are so much better. So chances are you also will like VR.

Now where is all this leading? If you like VR and the amazing sense of presence and through the roof immersion levels that it brings, then things that you find important in pancake won't matter as much. You will find that you are happy to make compromises to keep that immersion level.

It's really hard to explain, but once you put on the headset, power up your favourite flight sim and find yourself sitting the cockpit of a plane then, hopefully, you will understand!!

 

[zero71]

Now where is all this leading? If you like VR and the amazing sense of presence and through the roof immersion levels that it brings, then things that you find important in pancake won't matter as much. You will find that you are happy to make compromises to keep that immersion level.

It's really hard to explain, but once you put on the headset, power up your favourite flight sim and find yourself sitting the cockpit of a plane then, hopefully, you will understand!!

Agreed. I was running max settings in most sim racers with loads of cars on the track at 1440p and loving it. Now I don't play them at all unless I can be bothered hooking up my headset and wheel to play in VR. Usually at low to med settings with half a dozen cars on the track, most often hot lapping or qualifying. It's such a different experience, it's just WOW. But it's primarily my son's PC - he uses it for all his FPS stuff and for Homework, so I can't leave it setup for me. Hence most of my VR ends up being Pistol Whip, Beat Saber, Climb 2, etc on the Quest 2 native instead.

 

[wunkley]

Not sure if you have tried VR yet, but for many people, anything below a rock solid smooth 72 fps will make them queazy. For me, it needs to be 90 fps. Anything below that, and I start to feel sick. It's especially bad if it varies. You need to be thinking about what visual compromises you need to make to lock the came at 72fps or ideally 90fps. Reprojection might work for you, taking it down to 45fps, but for me, that made me sick too. I know you are worried about judder, and that's never nice, and won't give you a great VR experience, but FPS is King in VR. I can happily play 30fps and 60 fps in PC and Console games. The variable frame rate doesn't bother me either. I'm as happy with G-sync on or off, I can even live with tearing. But in VR an ugly 90fps is way more playable than a gorgeous 30 to 50fps, no matter how smooth it feels. You need to find a way to get a high FPS that is judder free, unless you have an iron stomach and just don't tend to suffer motion sickness. Are you comfortable surfing on your phone for 30 mins as a passenger in a car with no nausea?

ps. I gave up trying to get FS2020 running on my system, which is just a 2070 Super. Lowest settings on everything and it was still a dog. Stutter, judder, very low FPS. Just unplayable. I uninstalled it and gave up. It's a tough game.

not tried gaming in VR yet no. G2 coming this week. Thanks for the info bud that’s useful.
I hope/ think I have an iron stomach! I’ve never suffered from travel sickness and used to read in the car for a fair bit as a kid. I’ve seen people talk about training up for VR with gradual exposure which is probably a good idea.

Look, you have ordered the Reverb G2. There two possible outcomes. You will either like VR or you will hate VR. And nobody can tell you which it will be until you put on the headset and try it out for yourself.

Most people these days like VR, because the headsets are so much better. So chances are you also will like VR.

Now where is all this leading? If you like VR and the amazing sense of presence and through the roof immersion levels that it brings, then things that you find important in pancake won't matter as much. You will find that you are happy to make compromises to keep that immersion level.

It's really hard to explain, but once you put on the headset, power up your favourite flight sim and find yourself sitting the cockpit of a plane then, hopefully, you will understand!!

heha cheers! I know, I think I’m trying to stave off potential buyers remorse with the G2, maybe thinking I should have gone for the much cheaper Q2 as it’s my first foray into vr. I reckon I’ll love it if I can get it running well.

thanks for all the input fellas, seems like a friendly helpful section in this vr forum.

 

[zero71]

not tried gaming in VR yet no. G2 coming this week. Thanks for the info bud that’s useful.
I hope/ think I have an iron stomach! I’ve never suffered from travel sickness and used to read in the car for a fair bit as a kid. I’ve seen people talk about training up for VR with gradual exposure which is probably a good idea.

Good stuff. You may well be in for a treat. I can cope with a short bit of surfing in the car before I get ill. I am OK in flight sims in VR for a while, and Sim Racers (so long as the tracks aren't too undulating - who knew there were so many hills on the Nurb. it's so flat in pancake).

FPS like population one kill me in seconds though.

 

[Mr_Sukebe]

Just to add, I also find MS FS2020 runs like a dog on my 9700/64GB/2070S, and that's with low visual settings using a Rift S.
On a positive note, DCS and IL2 both run lovely for me.

 

[kevman]

Not much help for OP but for those with an Index there is a newish function where you can now throttle the FPS down to 30fps (and even less if you want). Having tested this out it works quite well and give a pretty smooth experience on MSFS as you do not need to move your head around much. For sims where you need to move your head more, like DCS, its not so good (even at say 60 fps) and I found the normal motion reprojection gives better smoothness.

 

[lokiss]

Huh id forgotten about that update. In truth the only game that would need it would be MSFS on my hardware. I wonder what the trade offs would be ditching Open XR and reintroducing the SteamVr overheads, id like to see somebody more knowledgeable deep dive in to that.

You can tell that the game isn't doing so well when you start moving your head around for sure, but saying that in my limited experience with it i had it looking great with a smooth forward frame rate on the G2, the caveat being that i was flying in normal conditions in the middle of nowhere.

 

[wunkley]

I’ve managed to find a few videos myself on YouTube of several flight sims, up in the air footage - that is done “through the lens” like suggested above.

All my worries about horrible judder in VR are now gone! Even though they are filmed on a camera phone and rubbish technical quality I can see everything is super fluid and looks silky silky smooth.

Traditional Internal video capture on a capture card of VR footage must be technically difficult or impossible to do (?) because I’ve worked out that all the horrible stutter and jerky footage I’d seen was that style of capture, not through the lens stuff.

Really looking forward to getting the G2 now!

 

[Jumpjim]

That’s one I took the other week using OBS. About half way through it seems the generate a frame stutter every 3-4 seconds but that wasn’t visible in the headset. It could be the difficulty of trying to capture stereoscopic VR on a flat screen.

on a positive note the VR using my Reverb G2 is mind blowingly good! I am amazed at the quality and smoothness of the video. DCS took some heavy settings tweaks to smooth it out but generally it runs very nicely.

 

[wunkley]

Thanks mate. Good footage, but it’s a prime example of what I’m talking about. In the few moments you look towards the ground you can see it best - every 2 or 3 seconds there is a ‘jerk’. Like a sudden shift in the whole landscape. It’s so so far from smooth and it looks terrible.
And the head movement is also very erratic With no smooth pans in these externally captured videos, yours included.

If it was like that in the headset it would be unplayable for me. As you say though, in actuality in the headset it is smooth. The issue must be with the programs people are using to capture the footage, something to do with a mismatch in frame rates between the footage displayed and then what its saved/ rendered at.

The thing is, all over YouTube there are these externally captured VR videos with terrible jerky footage. It’s such a bad advert for the technology. A lot of people would look at them and think wtf is that stuttering *****, never buying one of those. I would anyway, thankfully though I know better now

 

[Dano]

Thanks mate. Good footage, but it’s a prime example of what I’m talking about. In the few moments you look towards the ground you can see it best - every 2 or 3 seconds there is a ‘jerk’. Like a sudden shift in the whole landscape. It’s so so far from smooth and it looks terrible.
And the head movement is also very erratic With no smooth pans in these externally captured videos, yours included.

It's not like that in the headset, the jerky movement on the ground will likely be down to frames being dropped for capture and your head movement is jerky. but your eyes and brain compensate for it, something which a capture of a VR session cannot do as you are looking at the entire viewport and not just what you are specifically focused on from moment to moment.