Career in 3D

Jonnybmac

Jonnybmac

Jonnybmac

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Joined
17 Dec 2009
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Not sure where to put this so I though GD to be best located.
Im currently at a point in my life where I hate my job and wish I did something sooner. As a college drop out studying binary, html and visual basics, I found it quite the bore after self teaching myself for the better part of 3-4 years already and learning stuff I already knew. I thought it a better option at the time to get myself into a dead end job and earn some money so I could go out and party all the time, as you do.

Now, at the age of 25 comes a point in my life where these daed end jobs only offer you stress, frustration and misery.

Before its too late, I want to persue a career I've always wanted, and would be my dream job. I've always been intrested in CAD, and was one of the options I considered before choosing a web development course. I decided on the website route, being an idiot because a school friend was also going on the same course.

After having a late teen crisis at the age of 18 and getting a self tutored course with sikillstrain on web design and management, paying a lovely sum of £2,700 to never actually get passed the first module due to becomming ever so bored again and knowing the course was actually a rip off and a waste of my time.

Put that behind me I want to actually do something I should have done from the start, with a little twist that rather than doing the likes of autocad, I would rather go down the maya/3ds/zbrush route, although unsure what type I would like be in model's, enviroment and so on.

I've applied for a college course, but due to past experiences, and trying to do research and only finding that its a relativly new coruse that are cropping up in quite a few places, and also the fact it has games in the title that could be misleading people to think more than it actually is, which is probably only brief and light.

The course I've applied for is this one. Its a 2 year course, but do too my idiotic ways messing around at school and doing no coursework, I would have to complete the level 2 1 year course first, hence why im so sceptical over a 3 year course that could lead to nothing.

http://www.mbro.ac.uk/Home/coursesearch.aspx?page=coursedisplay&CourseInformationID=4069

Obviously I gather I would be doing stuff in there which wouldnt really be essential to what I need, but from what I would require is an insight into different roles so that to understand more?

My question would be that do you think this course is worth the paper it is written on? Bearing in mind it would be a 3 year course I would be committing to, then maybe 4 years at uni to further my career. Is it worth doing just to gain the requirements, insight and experience to get entry into uni?

The course in uni I've looked into is this one.

http://www.tees.ac.uk/undergraduate_courses/Computing_&_Web/BA_(Hons)_Creative_Digital_Media.cfm

I've only really got one shot at a career change and its now or never and cant really consider choosing a different plan if I fail, but although I'm intrested and I've had a little play about with 3d studio, I dont want to go too deep and start learning loads from online tutorials just yet to find I'll be learning it all over again.

Is it better/essential to be an artist? Although I used to draw when I was younger, I never really went in depth with texture, shading and lighting, which I guess is a must in this industry.. Will I get taught on these practices, or is it something that really you should have as a natural ability, like the ability to draw with a pencil for instance.
The reason I ask is that I dont know if I can achieve such effects without proper training on the subject. I feel I would be able to commit well to a 3 year course at college, and if funds allow, continue onto uni which I would love to do.

Would the college course alone be enough to further a career? or would I have to persue onto higher education after my 3 years?

Thanks for reading, sorry if its so long and boring for many!
 
Very long post, and I admit to only having read about 90% of it.

I'll start of by saying I know very little about the industry, however I believe as it is a design based area, I'd imagine building up a portfolio of work is probably quite a good idea.

kd
 
Ive obviously thought about building a small portfolio to help me with a college interview, but I'd imagine for uni, I can use the work I created through college?
 
I work in 3D, and can give you what insight I have, though a lot of it is opinion and take it with a pinch of salt..

First of all, the 3dsMax/Maya/Mudbox route isn't really CAD, that would be stuff like Solidworks, Rhino etc. If you want to get into Motion Graphics, ie Film, TV, Advertising then you'd be better off going for Maya over Max, though Max has by far more seats in generalised 3d Studios.

The next thing to mention is that a degree or qualification mean nothing, unless it's a specialist one from somewhere like Escape Studios. The only thing that matters a damn is your showreel/portfolio. University is a good place to build that portfolio, but if you just sit there doing what you're told without putting the time into your portfolio off your own bat you're going to be left with a worthless degree that won't even get you interviews.

Traditional art skills are useful, if you're really interested it might be a good idea to do a far more traditional course and develop your 3d computer skills in your own time alongside.
 
Yeah, i wasnt refering to maya ect as cad, just that was one of my past intrests and would rather go down the art route rather than engineering cad.

I also wasnt stating i would just stick to my course only and nothing more, just id rather not learn too much till im on the course and can learn the basics from tutor, amd advanced at home.

Would you say doing art and design at college then digital media at uni to be the best option?
 
Wow, you are are in the same boat as I am, with a similar interest however I am a year older. This is quite weird as a career change has been a huge sticking point in my life this last month or so and I'm really in a rut, very depressed about it all.

My worry is that I like earning £20k a year, something I can't do as a student, and I want to do something around my work. Not sure what that will be though and how I will do it.

Anyway, RB Customs on here is doing a course which is CG/design based with some other multimedia work thrown in at Bolton Uni. I asked him about it a while ago and never followed it up due to my depression and silly mindset holding me back. Worth a look if they do a distance course if Bolton isn't an option for you.
 
Degrees are pretty much worthless when it comes to game art jobs. if you can do a 1 year college course or something to give you a taste of the different things then follow it up in your spare time it would be much more beneficial. In hindsight i could probably have a job worthy portfolio right now but instead about 80% of my uni modules have been irrelevant and taking up time that could have been much better spent.
 
I'm in the games industry as a programmer.. but my little brother is a 3d artist in another games company.

For Art, I wouldn't bother getting a degree to be honest. My little brother did get a degree (computer arts at Abertay) yet he's said that the degree taught him very little. His talent has come from learning himself and that fact is evident when you compare the quality of his work to others who graduated with him.

In fact, he said at his company they had a very junior artist start working for them who had a lot of talent but no formal qualifications. Said artist was about to leave to go and pursue a degree but they told him not to bother and that he should continue to work for them, which he did. He's now learning, earning and gaining experience.

Portfolio is everything. If you think you can save some money and teach yourself to a high level (there are plenty of resources) then you should do that. It would be quicker, cheaper and arguably look better on a CV.

Oh - one final tip: don't loose sight of traditional art like drawing and painting. One reason my brother is such a good character artist is that he sketches anatomically correct models of the human form. Techniques established over thousands of years of traditional art should be used to make you a better 3D artist. Plus an artist that can produce beautiful concept drawings and convert them to 3D is worth his weight in gold in this industry.
 
I wanted to do this when I was a teenager and messing about with various 3D programs for fun. I wish I'd gone for it now - I've lost pretty much any artistic talent I had now so have no chance! :p

An old friend of mine works in the games industry as a 3D artist and his stuff is stunning. Unfortunately it seems that there's a not so great side to the job when deadlines are looming - he spends a lot of time at home locked up in his study doing crazy hours to get things done. Isn't popular with his missus on a regular basis and I don't think the money is amazing... Still, he used to say he enjoyed it!

I loved the way he talked about a few techniques that I'd never have even thought of. I was always toying with primitives and extruding/deforming to get where I wanted. He'd make an entire car out of extruding edges IIRC... jeebus!

Really jealous of you chaps doing it for a living!
 
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yer_averagejoe said:
I'm in the games industry as a programmer.. but my little brother is a 3d artist in another games company.

For Art, I wouldn't bother getting a degree to be honest. My little brother did get a degree (computer arts at Abertay) yet he's said that the degree taught him very little. His talent has come from learning himself and that fact is evident when you compare the quality of his work to others who graduated with him.

In fact, he said at his company they had a very junior artist start working for them who had a lot of talent but no formal qualifications. Said artist was about to leave to go and pursue a degree but they told him not to bother and that he should continue to work for them, which he did. He's now learning, earning and gaining experience.

Portfolio is everything. If you think you can save some money and teach yourself to a high level (there are plenty of resources) then you should do that. It would be quicker, cheaper and arguably look better on a CV.

Oh - one final tip: don't loose sight of traditional art like drawing and painting. One reason my brother is such a good character artist is that he sketches anatomically correct models of the human form. Techniques established over thousands of years of traditional art should be used to make you a better 3D artist. Plus an artist that can produce beautiful concept drawings and convert them to 3D is worth his weight in gold in this industry.
Click to expand...

This is all good advice, but to highlight the golden rule, portfolio is everything.
 
I was at uni doing Design for Digital Media, with 3d part of this general course, I was hoping it would teach me and from there I could develope my own skills.
In short it didn't, well very basics and even then had to go out and teach myself more, and the course was very missold. One element was game design which was never taught yet still being advertised in the brochure.
In the end I dropped out due to depression and still mintain it was a waste of time and if I had the motivation would've been better off teaching myself.
 
Sounds to me like im going to struggle due to my lack of artistic background. I'd like to enrole into some form of education to push me forward into learning as much as I possibly can.

What sort of things would you fill into a portfolio? What do they look for when viewing one of this type? Speed, detail, imagination?

After reading all these posts im a little bit sceptical now that im jumping into something deeper than I can manage... I guess I was wrong to just assume I'd get taught everything, and be able to learn myself things but I take it you need some artistic nack, thats not possible to learn but comes naturally?

With the mixed comments im unsure as to what to do. I dont want to stay in my current job whilst learning, I would rather take up something thats going to better me if I decide to go down this route
 
Artistic talent is certainly possible to learn. As is maths or music. I hate how art has this sort of enigma surrounding it, in that some people are born with it and some people aren't. Its all BS. As long as you have the will, you can learn what you need (want) to.
 
as soon as i read the title, i came in to suggest Teesside Uni, we have the best uni for this kind of stuff, it's world famous for it.
 
As previously mentioned, Escape Studios is the place to go at the moment. Peter Jackson took 20 people to NZ at the end of a course there to work full time on LOTR. Might go there myself if work ever dries up.
 
yer_averagejoe said:
Artistic talent is certainly possible to learn. As is maths or music. I hate how art has this sort of enigma surrounding it, in that some people are born with it and some people aren't. Its all BS. As long as you have the will, you can learn what you need (want) to.
Click to expand...

I disagree. I definitely think that skill and talent are two very seperate things.
 
I've read of a few folk who do 3d at uni and don't rate it, you can search the 3dpalace forums to see their opinions.

If you wan to learn 3D the best place to learn imo is 3dbuzz.com

Get a subscription and you get quality video training on Maya, Max, Zbrush, Houdini
To give you an idea the Basic Maya Fundamentals training is 80+ hours long.
 
I went to Teesside Uni and did the Games Art degree, for me it was worth it, it got me a job. BUT... I learnt my chosen subject of vehicle modelling with some help from a couple of fellow students, during my final year. That piece of work alone really got me my job, it showed I had a natural talent for it.

I would struggle to recommend both courses you have mentioned, purely for the number of years you will be dedicating to them. But a course like Teesside Uni's can help show you a range of things and give you a basis to learn more from. It introduced me to using 3ds Max properly (I'd used it briefly at school) and I met other students I could learn from.

Natural talent does help, but half the artists I work with can't draw to save themselves (largely because they don't have the time to do it regularly)

I think most people who make it without a degree, started when they were pretty young and have 4+ years of working on stuff at home before they get a good enough portfolio. I don't think I would have ever made it purely by learning at home.

Don't expect big money, you won't be paying off your student loans in the first few years... But those who are smart and somewhat lucky can get a decent living out of it eventually.

Speed is not key, you can't see that anyway from a portfolio piece and you'll get faster/more efficient with experience.

Imagination can help, it would certainly be good if you're a character artist that doesn't model a "troll/beast/thing" like every other student does for their portfolio. But recreating something that someone else has concepted is perfectly acceptable.

Detail is probably the most important and often missing factor. So many modellers seem to have no eye for detail or shape. Particularly in cars (my specialty) the details seem like they've taken one look at a photo and then done the modelling from memory. Very frustrating.

It's a 3d subject, so an eye for shape is key. Colour theory can be taught, may not even be needed at a junior level for some roles.

You'll learn more in your first 6 months in the industry than you will on any course you do. And it doesn't stop after those first 6 months.
 
I'd have to contemplate a 3 year course pretty carefully considering the cost of courses these days! Escape has some great course options and a nice atmosphere but before you go there it might be worth doing a one year art and design foundation/diploma. There are plenty of people working in CG who can't draw and are more into the technical side if that's your bag, but training in composition, colour, form etc would give you a good base to work from.

Couple of useful links for you:

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=2&t=372592

http://www.skillset.org/animation/qualifications/article_8377_1.asp
 
I'm a visual effects artist, I do a lot of compositing and dabble in 3d production if needed - but i'm not great with it in all honesty (i'm more of a matte painter and rotoscoper).

All I would say is that all of these computer based industiries are a minefield to get into these days, because every man and his dog reckons he can pull it off with bedroom portfolios!
 
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